orangefaniniowa

Seattle NBA Brand Discussion

Recommended Posts

Ice_Cap    7,591
13 minutes ago, DG_Now said:

 

And yet...

 

 

EDIT-

Actually, I'll take a swing in the dark because I'm not sure you actually want a real discussion here. If you're mad about me "quoting out of context" sorry.

I'm just saying why I think the historical record is important. The fine people of Seattle can reminisce about the old or new Sonics however they like. That's not my concern.   

Edited by Ice_Cap

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Did anyone watching the 1961 Washington Senators consider that expansion team to be the same franchise that had won the World Series in 1924 and pennants in 1925 and 1933?  No, they did not.

 

People in Seattle are no stupider; they could handle the idea that a previous franchise of the same name is the one that won the championship.  

The only difference is that we have reached a degraded state of affairs in which we no longer expect record books to accurately record what actually happened.  (Anyone who wishes to call this development meaningless or to detach it from the growing dangerous societal trend of lack of respect for facts is fooling himself/herself.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
OnWis97    2,200
1 hour ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:


Did anyone watching the 1961 Washington Senators consider that expansion team to be the same franchise that had won the World Series in 1924 and pennants in 1925 and 1933?  No, they did not.

 

People in Seattle are no stupider; they could handle the idea that a previous franchise of the same name is the one that won the championship.  

The only difference is that we have reached a degraded state of affairs in which we no longer expext record books to accurately record what actually happened.  (Anyone who wishes to call this development meaningless or to detach it from the growing dangerous societal trend of lack of respect for facts is fooling himself/herself.)

That's pretty much it.  Pre-Cleveland Deal, there was never a discussion.  It never occurred to anyone to "leave history behind."

 

Funny, though, suppose someone had said "well, I know that all the Senators players are going to Minnesota, but since Washington's getting a team right away, it's pretty clean to just consider Minnesota a new team and have the new Washington team continue to be the Senators."  Seems pretty clean, eh?  Then, ten years later the Senators moved to Texas.  And today, the Texas Rangers would be the team that "officially" has the connection to the 1924 team.  And in the early 1970s, Harmon Killebrew would have faced "his former franchise" in Texas despite never having (to that point) actually switched teams.  And which franchise is the first 60 years of Senators baseball directly the connected with?  The Twins or the Rangers?  The Twins...but the history would be really, really weird today.

 

And the fact that I am a Twins fan is neither here nor there.  It's not that I want the history for my team...it's that it actually is a part of a team that happens to be the team for which I cheer.  I truly only care about it as a fan of baseball history, much like I do the former lives of the Giants, Dodgers, Pilots, Boston/Milwaukee Braves, etc.

 

Anyhow, "leaving the franchise certificate" behind would have been a simple, easy thing following this move.  And it would have ended up a disaster.  Fortunately, we had not reached this "degraded state of affairs in which we no longer expect record books to accurately record what actually happened." 

 

Now you make one interesting point that most here will consider over-the-top:

Quote

(Anyone who wishes to call this development meaningless or to detach it from the growing dangerous societal trend of lack of respect for facts is fooling himself/herself.)

Hmmmm.  

 

I guess I don't detach it from this trend.  I don't blame the Cleveland and Hornets messes for the trend, but those messes could be symptomatic of this trend.  In the 1990s, we were not going to go crazy, but we just told a little white lie about the Browns.  Now we've moved on to full-blown dishonesty, as reflected in the Hornets/Bobcats/Hornets/Pelicans mess.  And it looks like it's all over for us dorks.  Hopefully MLB, the most history-based league, holds out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mtcantwe    5

When the sonics left to become the Thunder, city representatives asked them to choose a new name. In the hopes they get another franchise one day, they could use the name again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
OnWis97    2,200

I was at the new Braves ballpark this weekend and enjoyed the franchise history exhibited in the concourse.

IMG_0317.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WSU151    2,412
14 hours ago, OnWis97 said:

I was at the new Braves ballpark this weekend and enjoyed the franchise history exhibited in the concourse.

IMG_0317.JPG

 

Have they opened up the museum yet?  The Braves' museum at Turner was fantastic.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
OnWis97    2,200
18 minutes ago, WSU151 said:

 

Have they opened up the museum yet?  The Braves' museum at Turner was fantastic.  

The weather foiled my plans...out of the blue came the gray and we ended up leaving without doing the full walkaround.  

 

Unless the area in my photo is what you are talking about.  They had jerseys* from past players/iterations of the team, trophies, gold gloves, retired numbers, player statues etc.  It was just the 100-level concourse roughly behind the plate.  It's exactly what I think every franchise (at least those that have been around a while) should do somewhere in the concourse.  The more I search for photos of it the more I think it is what you are talking about.  It's really, really nice.  I wish the Twins had that somewhere (and gave at least a nod to the Senators).

 

Man, I should have spent more time; been more mindful of where I was and how rarely I get to that part of the country.

 

*I think a lot of the jerseys were just reproductions.  The Babe Ruth jersey looked a bit too pristine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
omnivore    68

Given the NBA gave Charlotte their history back when the Bobcats became the Hornets, it's pretty clear that if Seattle ever got another NBA franchise, they'd obviously become the Sonics and would get the shared history back, OKC would go back to being an expansion team for historical purposes and done. Like...this isn't even really that complicated from a NBA standpoint, given we have a precedent now.

 

On 5/24/2017 at 1:43 PM, OnWis97 said:

The weather foiled my plans...out of the blue came the gray and we ended up leaving without doing the full walkaround.  

 

Unless the area in my photo is what you are talking about.  They had jerseys* from past players/iterations of the team, trophies, gold gloves, retired numbers, player statues etc.  It was just the 100-level concourse roughly behind the plate.  It's exactly what I think every franchise (at least those that have been around a while) should do somewhere in the concourse.  The more I search for photos of it the more I think it is what you are talking about.  It's really, really nice.  I wish the Twins had that somewhere (and gave at least a nod to the Senators).

 

Man, I should have spent more time; been more mindful of where I was and how rarely I get to that part of the country.

 

*I think a lot of the jerseys were just reproductions.  The Babe Ruth jersey looked a bit too pristine.

 

On the Braves, it's cool they trace their lineage since the franchise name never changed much like the Dodgers and Giants and A's. I like the teams that maintain the history, much like a company that moved from one city to another. But I think baseball is more unique in that way, especially since until the Expos move, there hadn't been one in such a while.

 

There would be no point for the Twins to recognize Senators history, though. The Nats exist now negating that need and also they changed the franchise name so it'd be really silly to do that in my mind. I mean, I get they're the "same franchise" essentially, but nobody in D.C. or Minnesota sees them that way. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now