2017 NFL Season: Then there were Two

[Still MIGHTY]

12 hours ago, DG_Now said:

I was going to ask if tanking ever worked in the NFL, and the answer is it does if you get a great QB at #1. That list includes Matthew Stafford, Cam Newton, Peyton Manning, Michael Vick and Andrew Luck, but it also includes JaMarcus Russell, David Carr, and Sam Bradford.

 

But for all of that, the entire league could have had Russell Wilson or Tom Brady but passed.

 

The Bills are doing the Patriots deal by drafting a bunch of guys in late first/second rounds. Six high picks in the first three rounds is still pretty good, they also could have made the playoffs this year and had six value picks. The same way the Pats do it. It's all just a waste.

 

The Texans did do some pretty hard tanking by not existing the year before.

 

The rest of your point is well taken though.

[TBGKon]

On 11/10/2017 at 8:37 PM, Tracy Jordan said:

Going back to the old TNF schedule from 2006-2007 would be a good start. Eight primetime games total, five on Thursday and three on Saturday. I believe they started that schedule on Thanksgiving night. They could go back to exclusively airing the games on NFL Network while awarding the streaming rights to Amazon or Yahoo. This would reduce the amount of Thursday night games down to five, and it would only affect 10 teams per season.

I know im a bit behind in replying to this, but a reason for the TNF package was to give every team a primetime TNF/MNF appearance.

 

Honestly i dont give two :censored:s if the Bucs have a TNF game per year.  Seems like a throwaway when you're trying to fill 15 weeks with possible garbage match ups when you could have 6-8 really good TNF games, following bye weeks.

[JWhiz96]

18 hours ago, DG_Now said:

I was going to ask if tanking ever worked in the NFL, and the answer is it does if you get a great QB at #1. That list includes Matthew Stafford, Cam Newton, Peyton Manning, Michael Vick and Andrew Luck, but it also includes JaMarcus Russell, David Carr, and Sam Bradford.

 

But for all of that, the entire league could have had Russell Wilson or Tom Brady but passed.

 

The Bills are doing the Patriots deal by drafting a bunch of guys in late first/second rounds. Six high picks in the first three rounds is still pretty good, they also could have made the playoffs this year and had six value picks. The same way the Pats do it. It's all just a waste.

Tanking for a QB is usually boom or bust, but I wouldn't include the Texans and David Carr on the list. The Texans were an expansion team without a season of NFL play under its belt, and it made sense to draft a QB #1 overall. Same with the expansion Browns and Tim Couch (subsequent QBs are on the list though).

 

Oddly enough, the Colts are involved with a number of tanking-for-the-future phenomena: John Elway in 1983 (traded to Broncos), Jeff George in 1990, Manning in 1998, and Luck in 2012.

16 hours ago, SabresRule7361 said:

Tom Brady is the most overpraised and overprotected player in NFL history

Overprotected yes, overpraised no. Having never watched greats like Unitas, Montana or Elway, I can confidently say that Brady's the best QB I've ever seen.

[BBTV]

What's the non-local view of the Eagles?  People here are starting to get carried away, and even I have to admit that there's just something different about this team.  Watching them is just not stressful, and not just because they're winning.  Even when they're down, you know that Wentz will make something out of nothing, or that the defense will get a pick, so it's just like no big deal.  Even when they sleepwalk for an entire half, and lose a kicker, they still win by 4TDs.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

37 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said:

What's the non-local view of the Eagles?  People here are starting to get carried away, and even I have to admit that there's just something different about this team.  Watching them is just not stressful, and not just because they're winning.  Even when they're down, you know that Wentz will make something out of nothing, or that the defense will get a pick, so it's just like no big deal.  Even when they sleepwalk for an entire half, and lose a kicker, they still win by 4TDs.

 

To me they seem like the a really likeable team that we're all going to rooting for to not get stomped by the Pats in the Super Bowl. But they will

[IceCap]

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/bills-mcdermott-still-evaluating-on-who-will-start-at-qb-112017

 

What is this I don’t even...

 

This is something the Browns would do. Don’t be the Browns, Bills. 

[oldschoolvikings]

Blair Walsh...

 

[BBTV]

 

Has there ever been a great NFL qb that wore #2?  It just seems like such a kids number for some reason.  I can't picture a grown ass man wearing #2 and being a competent player.  The only #2s in the NFL that I can think of were total scrubs.

 

I feel kinda the same way in baseball, and a tiny little bit in basketball too.  The only sport where #2 seems normal is hockey, and that's probably just because I grew up when every teams' best defender wore it.

[BBTV]

5 hours ago, DG_Now said:

 

To me they seem like the a really likeable team that we're all going to rooting for to not get stomped by the Pats in the Super Bowl. But they will

 

They are likable, aren't they.  The only real scumbag on the team is Nigel Bradham, and in the grand scheme of things he's not that bad.  Chris Long donated his entire salary to educational equality, Malcom Jenkins is as down to earth as it gets, and is one of the leaders in the anthem protests (but he doesn't just complain, he actually does stuff), and dopey-ass Doug Pederson has always been likable, even if totally dopey.  It's hard to dislike Carson Wentz, though I could stand to go 10 minutes without hearing about how his lord empowers him to do all these great things and he throws TD passes to honor him.  I almost want them to job to the Patriots just so I don't have to hear Wentz tell his god that the trophy is for her.

[JQK]

2 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

 

They are likable, aren't they.  The only real scumbag on the team is Nigel Bradham, and in the grand scheme of things he's not that bad.  Chris Long donated his entire salary to educational equality, Malcom Jenkins is as down to earth as it gets, and is one of the leaders in the anthem protests (but he doesn't just complain, he actually does stuff), and dopey-ass Doug Pederson has always been likable, even if totally dopey.  It's hard to dislike Carson Wentz, though I could stand to go 10 minutes without hearing about how his lord empowers him to do all these great things and he throws TD passes to honor him.  I almost want them to job to the Patriots just so I don't have to hear Wentz tell his god that the trophy is for her.

I am a Giants fan, so....

...no, i still don't like this team. :-P

[FiddySicks]

9 hours ago, DG_Now said:

 

To me they seem like the a really likeable team that we're all going to rooting for to not get stomped by the Pats in the Super Bowl. But they will

 

They're a Philly team that people outside of the city actually want to root for. It kinda feels like making a deal with the devil. This has a dangerously high chance of getting completely :censored:ed up in the worst of ways (AKA, blowing a 28-3 lead to the Pats in the Super Bowl). 

[FiddySicks]

4 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

 

Has there ever been a great NFL qb that wore #2?  It just seems like such a kids number for some reason.  I can't picture a grown ass man wearing #2 and being a competent player.  The only #2s in the NFL that I can think of were total scrubs.

 

I feel kinda the same way in baseball, and a tiny little bit in basketball too.  The only sport where #2 seems normal is hockey, and that's probably just because I grew up when every teams' best defender wore it.

 

Ummmm....

[Kramerica Industries]

And if I had a dime for every time someone called Capt. Intangibles overrated...

[BBTV]

4 hours ago, Bucfan56 said:

 

Ummmm....

 

Yeah, and I think it looks goofy.  It's a little better on a Yankees uniform because of how classic it is, but I still don't like it.  Anyway, my point about stars was specific to football.

[dfwabel]

17 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

What's the non-local view of the Eagles?  People here are starting to get carried away, and even I have to admit that there's just something different about this team.  Watching them is just not stressful, and not just because they're winning.  Even when they're down, you know that Wentz will make something out of nothing, or that the defense will get a pick, so it's just like no big deal.  Even when they sleepwalk for an entire half, and lose a kicker, they still win by 4TDs.

The Eagles' front four is quick and good.  Their secondary really hasn't had to face a formidable group of receivers this season outside of NYG with Shepherd and OBJ.

 

The issues won't come from the regular season, but the local pressure they'll face possible being the #1 seed and have home field advantage. Plus there's that chance which Pederson will be outcoached by those with much more experience: Payton, Rivera, Quinn, Carroll (if they make it).  Their win or lose, their game @SEA will tell a lot of the team, but I think since the Saints are winning on the road with defense, they should be taken very seriously

11 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

 

Has there ever been a great NFL qb that wore #2?  It just seems like such a kids number for some reason.  I can't picture a grown ass man wearing #2 and being a competent player.  The only #2s in the NFL that I can think of were total scrubs.

 

The best #2 played last night in Matt Ryan.  Otherwise, you're looking at Flutie or Aaron Brooks.  

[BBTV]

1. Flutie looked goofy, but I give him a pass since my brain would replace his 2 with 22.  I wouldn't call Brooks a star, but I'll concede that it didn't look bad on him.  Maybe it looks better on runners rather than statues or fat guys (aka the fat slob the Raiders wasted the #1 pick on a while back - forget his name.)

 

2. I was actually thinking about your point about the media pressure in the playoffs, and I was thinking it would be better for them to play on the road in the NFCCG if they get that far.  Especially if it's in a dome, I think it gives them an edge since Wentz is used to dome / turf, and in general less is left to chance in a controlled environment, and I think that all other things being equal they're the best team so I wouldn't want snow or some other factor leveling the playing field.

 

I do worry about Pederson being out coached, but I have to give him this - the players legitimately love him, just like they loved Andy Reid.  The difference is that Pederson has shown to actually make adjustments and is self aware enough to reel himself in when he's going on an Andy Reid-esque streak of calling 50 pass plays in a row.  The Dallas game was a great example - they came out after half time, gave up on trying to get Wentz untracked by throwing all the time and went back to run-first.  They dominated from that point on.  Reid would never do that, he was too stubborn.

[dfwabel]

10 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

 I was actually thinking about your point about the media pressure in the playoffs, and I was thinking it would be better for them to play on the road in the NFCCG if they get that far.  Especially if it's in a dome, I think it gives them an edge since Wentz is used to dome / turf, and in general less is left to chance in a controlled environment, and I think that all other things being equal they're the best team so I wouldn't want snow or some other factor leveling the playing field.

 

I do worry about Pederson being out coached, but I have to give him this - the players legitimately love him, just like they loved Andy Reid.  The difference is that Pederson has shown to actually make adjustments and is self aware enough to reel himself in when he's going on an Andy Reid-esque streak of calling 50 pass plays in a row.  The Dallas game was a great example - they came out after half time, gave up on trying to get Wentz untracked by throwing all the time and went back to run-first.  They dominated from that point on.  Reid would never do that, he was too stubborn.

Playing in the Superdome wouldn't be beneficial to Wentz, but US Bank Stadium is just two years old and the Vikings are 10-4 overall (5-1 this season).

 

Jim Schwartz is making the defensive adjustments since was not just a coordinator but also a HC.  Peterson was never a coordinator. Same with Frank Reich in terms of coordinator experience. Pedersen is a "Jason Garrett"-type, but holds the play card.

Michael Lombardi is awful within a front office, but in media he is right on more often. As you should know, Lombardi is a south Jersey guy, but not a Pederson fan.

From September:

http://www.nj.com/eagles/index.ssf/2017/09/eagles_doug_pederson_responds_to_michal_lombardis.html

 

From November 3 :

http://www.nj.com/eagles/index.ssf/2017/11/mike_lombardi_still_wont_give_eagles_doug_pederson.html

 

 

[BBTV]

He was a coordinator in KC under that fat worthless family-ignoring slob Andy Reid, albeit not a ful time play caller. Lombardi could end up being proven right - it’s certainly how I felt - but he IS changing the play calling strategy based on what the defense is doing. That’s evident simply by watching. 

 

Schwartz is a great DC, and has full autonomy there, but the D is usually dominant from start to finish, so if he’s making in game adjustments they’re proactive enough not to be obvious.  

 

[Sport]

LOL at the Bengals being "In the hunt". There was a time in 03 or 04 where I was excited just to appear on the "in the hunt" in the standings. Simpler times. They have to go 6-0 or 5-1 to have a shot at the playoffs and they still have the Steelers, at Ravens, at Vikings, and Lions left to play. They could get tripped up against the Bears too. Just give me 3-3, finish 7-9, put an end to the Marvin Lewis era, and draft some offensive linemen. 

 

All I ask is they don't lose to the Browns this weekend. 

[dfwabel]

2 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

He was a coordinator in KC under that fat worthless family-ignoring slob Andy Reid, albeit not a ful time play caller. Lombardi could end up being proven right - it’s certainly how I felt - but he IS changing the play calling strategy based on what the defense is doing. That’s evident simply by watching. 

 

Schwartz is a great DC, and has full autonomy there, but the D is usually dominant from start to finish, so if he’s making in game adjustments they’re proactive enough not to be obvious.  

 

While Pederson was OC in Kansas City, he was never the play caller.

 

He only started calling plays until last year.

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles/philadelphia-eagles-head-coach-doug-pederson-play-calling-offensive-coordinator-quarterback-20170718.html?mobi=true

 

It's hard to coach a team and call plays.