MLB: The Defunct Saga - Washington Senators/Nationals, Pt. II Added

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33 minutes ago, neo_prankster said:

If Horace Stoneham had moved the Giants to Minnesota and the Dodgers stayed in Brooklyn, where would Griffith have been able to move the Senators?

Los Angeles, possibly.

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1 hour ago, Discrimihater said:

Los Angeles, possibly.


And would the Kansas City A's have come to San Francisco?

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Thanks for the C+C, guys!


On 7/12/2018 at 11:23 AM, Cardsblues02 said:

Not a huge fan of the mismatching “W” between the script on the away and the main cap logo. Just a little nitpick. This is what the Nationals should look like. Very clean and professional looking. No random american flag patterns. Looks good.

On 7/12/2018 at 4:08 PM, bleuet said:

everything here is beauty. 

On 7/12/2018 at 4:16 PM, DoctaC said:

As a Nats fan, I can say this upgrade is definitely a great one. While I like the current W, your is cleaner and nicer, and the new primary is sick.

On 7/12/2018 at 4:20 PM, coco1997 said:

I love how the "N" on the Nationals script looks like half of an upside-down Nats' "W." Great stuff!

On 7/14/2018 at 10:05 AM, KRZYBDGRZ said:

Loving the nationals script

12 hours ago, mungojerry311 said:

I'm loving every pixel of this thread so far. Keep it up!


Thanks! I had fun making this one, especially in finding the right balance between the Twins and Nationals for the design.


On 7/12/2018 at 12:51 PM, CaptainKirkMN said:

You missed the chance to have "I am the Senate" as the first title, in the same post as another line from the prequels.

Other than that, great set!  I like the blending with the Twins and the Nationals.


Thanks! "We are the Senate" was my attempt to make the prequel meme plural, since most "I am the Senate" memes keep it in the singular. P.S., the C-3P0 line is from the Auralnauts "abridging" of the Star Wars saga - check it out!


On 7/13/2018 at 6:06 PM, Cardsblues02 said:

I think the other roundel logo (the tertiary) would work better as the primary. I really like it. Love the throwback uniform, I think it looks great. The hat you use with it is incredible. Really love it. 


This uniform set doesn’t really do it for me because of the navy centric design. Not that it’s bad, because it still looks good. But I would love to see more red. Red base, some kind of red alt cap (non throwback), ect. The Nats do a good job balancing this. You often hear around here about how boring the Indians away uniforms are with little red in them. Thats the vibe this set puts off. Would love to see some more red. But in the end it still looks good and it’s your concept. You’re the expert here! 


Thanks! I'm less than keen on using the tertiary as the primary, since I wanted the primary logos to reflect the government buildings of the city (Senators/Nationals). The tertiary is far more civic in nature.


I get where you're coming from with the navy-heavy design and wanting more red. I really wanted to push the navy/white/red look for them, as it's my ideal Twins look and keeps them separate from the Red Sox. The red of the 1970s/80s design would be an aberration in a long history of navy-heavy designs. However, if you like the navy/red co-balance, you'll like my alternate take for the team.


On 7/12/2018 at 11:33 AM, Carolingian Steamroller said:

I love the new "W" and I am horrified by Griffiths. 



Thanks! The Griffiths were a nasty group of people, especially in regards to their attitudes on race. Yet somehow, Calvin Griffith got a statue. Ugh.


On 7/12/2018 at 11:29 AM, MJD7 said:

That is a beautiful set. Like you said, a perfect blend of Twins & Nationals. My one suggestion would be to maybe try a modernized version of the white front-panel cap for the navy alternate, I feel like that could be a great look. Wonderful job!


Thanks! The white front-panel cap on the navy alternate looks pretty decent, but I wouldn't make it a part of the full set.




On 7/12/2018 at 10:50 PM, Ted Cunningham said:

I always thought that the N should fit with the curly W. Thanks for the shout-out! Also, I can't remember if I stated as much previously, or just thought it, but I'd wear the hell out of just about all the jackets you've designed.


Thanks! Your script really got my design process going for the team. I'm glad you like the jackets!


On 7/12/2018 at 12:46 PM, the admiral said:

I like the Senators roundel much more than the Nationals one. Washington, by design, doesn't have a real skyline. It just looks like a big blob with the Capitol and Washington Monument poking out. But I love the overall aesthetic of the uniforms and how they would have evolved from the 1901 Senationators. The lowercase uppercase N is a nice touch because that's sorta how I write my Ns in cursive.

On 7/13/2018 at 3:54 AM, NicDB said:

I actually see your alt W being closer to what they would really use.  I also agree with the sentiment that your DC "skyline" looks like a blob.  You could get away with a straight line.  Or maybe try a logo of the George Washington statue atop the Capitol.  It still features something people associate with Washington DC, but would resonate more with locals.


Thanks, guys! I totally see how it looks like a blob. I figured I could simplify the design by just using the Capitol Building outline with the W (akin to this logo, which may or may not be anything the team wore).








Thanks @NicDB for the consult on this one.

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Well, it's time to Twin up!






The year is 1987. The Senators/Nationals want to emerge from their pullover/sansabelt period with a renewed sense of identity. They tell their design firm to create something that balanced traditional baseball aesthetics with a more modern font style. They get pretty much that, albeit with a few hiccups along the way (debates over square and angular slab serifs, matching or non-matching road scripts, etc.). This look popped up at the right time for the team, as they underwent a competitive resurgence right after their debut. However, attitudes on the design soured over time as it got more dated, with minor tweaks happening in the late-1990s to keep the look fresh. By the time the team moved out of RFK to Navy Yard Stadium (completed a bit earlier in this timeline), the team was ready to go full-on retro.


Basically, this is my simulation of what would happen if the Senators/Nationals followed the same identity trajectory as the Minnesota Twins (while maintaining a commitment to New Historicism by keeping the changes realistic to the period). While I loathe the 1987/2010-present "Twins" wordmark and the navy/red co-balance (which should be what Cleveland or Boston does), I know that it has a lot of fans. I figured it would be a fun experiment for the team to go all-in on the 1987 Twins-style redesign.


PHASE ONE - "I am the Senate!" "I am the Senate" "I am the Senate and so is my wife!"


The primary is my attempt to recreate the 1987-2009 Twins' primary logo, complete with the ugly drop shadows (it was harder to "nail" the look that one would imagine). The secondary logo debuted in the late 1990s, featuring the shape of the Washington family's coat of arms and the senator from the 1950s-'60s logo alongside the founding date and the "DC" logo. It was my way of paying homage to the Twins' state logo. The insignias include an underlined "w" and a "DC" meant to emulate the Twins' "TC" logo.




The home and road uniforms would undergo a shift in their existence. The 1999 season would see the introduction of nameplates (for realism's sake, because I don't like nameplates in baseball) to the home uniforms, as well as the new secondary patch. The number and NOB fonts are the Twins' classic MLB Block with Serifs. I had to use the road pinstripes, because why the f--k not? I figured that the team would insist on a matching road script instead of the non-matching ones we got in 1987. If Atlanta, Oakland, and the White Sox (sorta) could match wordmarks, then the Senators certainly could follow suit.






The alternates include one navy top with the "w" logo (for the "W" insignia's importance to the jersey designs of past teams) and a "DC" cap with a contrasting bill. The second alternate is a recreation of the 1959-60 design (with Wilson Varisty numbers, as the Twins wore on their 1960s home uniforms), which would be a means for the team to "test the waters" with a retro revival.




The dugout jacket employs the "w" logo on the front, while featuring the primary on the sleeve and the "DC" insignia on the back.




The Nationals version should be up soon. 

Edited by SFGiants58
New info with links added.

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PHASE TWO - Going National!


The Nationals version of the concept changes a few of the graphics, most notably using a different secondary with the Capitol Building outline from my main concept alongside the "DC" logo.




The home and road uniforms follow the same trajectory as the Senators versions, albeit with the name change.






The alternates undergo a minor shift, to account for the new name. I modded my retro "Nationals" script to better match the 1959-60 Senators script. The alternate logo on the throwback uses the "W" from the 1948-52 primary logo. It's a bit for added accuracy.




The dugout jacket merely swaps out the sleeve patch.




While I'm not keen on the script style for either the Twins or the Senationalators, I figured that it was an excellent exercise in both New Historicism and script-making (using Liebe as a guide). Losing the symbolism of the underlined "win" in "Twins" is a bit iffy, but I still think the design seems reasonable for the time and would be an appropriate change-up of the Senators/Nationals' aesthetic. C+C is appreciated, as always!


Up next, what if the Griffiths went out west?

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I really don't see the interlocking DC's resemblance to the Twins' TC, but I like it anyway.  It looks very streamlined.  I also know you're not a fan of the TC logo, so I guess it works out.

That underlined W cap insignia is amazing!  I'm one of the few Twins fans who likes the lowercase m, because of the success the Twins had when it was most prominent.  Also, it made a cameo of sorts in one of my favorite movies.

I also really like the navy Nationals alternate.  I loved the Twins' navy alts, and wished I could get a logo-on-the-side style for one of them.

Could I see what that uniform looks like with the DC logo instead of the W?

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The '80s Twin-ified Nats and Senators look great! I really like the interlocking "DC" logo.


Really curious to see what the next team is...That magenta and gold color scheme looks mighty intriguing.

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Yea, this definitely isn't my favorite era of Twins uniforms (as much as I've grown to dislike the gold-trimmed look, I still think it's an upgrade over the Dome set), but you did about as much with it as you could. The "W" and "DC" logos are both super creative transformations. Looking forward to what you have next!

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So I'm guessing next up is the Senators becoming the Angels...and the team that would've been the Angels instead becomes the Hollywood Stars?

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This is so unsettling to look at (mainly because I have an irrational hatred of the '87 Twins look), but so, so good.

The upside down M truly makes this.

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Branching off of discrim's suggestion there'll probably be room for the St. Louis Browns going to LA since that move was thwarted by Pearl Harbor.

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