Miami Marlins 2019 Rebrand

[Gothamite]

15 hours ago, Brandon9485 said:

Continue to dislike them if you want to, but these slogans have been developed more towards Cardinals fans than anything else.

 

That’s hardly a defense of them. 

[Gothamite]

14 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

Jeff Loria and David Samson are two Jewish men who are being vilified with antisemitic tropes of being greedy and out to screw others. All while not-Jewish Derrick Jeter is held up as Doing the Right Thing while Jeter’s Jewish partner Bruce Sherman is ignored.

 

I’m not sure that’s an entirely fair comparison.  Even setting aside that I had no idea any of those three men were Jewish.

 

Sherman is ignored because that’s the point of Sherman.  Jeter wanted a silent partner, or else he would have stayed with Jeb Bush.

 

I have no particular love for Jeter, but he’s not taking Loria-level flak because he hasn’t done anything as obviously scummy as Loria and Samson have done.  If he goes there and is then spared, you’ll have a point.

 

I appreciate the point you’re making, with the current rise in anti-Semitism, but I honestly don’t think that’s behind the criticism of those two men.

[Gothamite]

15 hours ago, Olmec said:

Outside of these boards I've never heard of "The Cardinal Way" or "best fans in baseball" and I've been watching/following baseball for 25+ years. 

 

Oh, how I envy you. 

 

I can only wish I’d never heard Joe Buck call a game.

[BC985]

1 hour ago, Gothamite said:

 

That’s hardly a defense of them. 

 

That’s the thing, I don’t think they need to be defended that much. The people offended by these slogans aren’t the intended audience. 

[Gothamite]

1 hour ago, Brandon9485 said:

That’s the thing, I don’t think they need to be defended that much. The people offended by these slogans aren’t the intended audience. 

 

I don’t think thats actually the case.

 

But still, ludicrous self-aggrandizement is never intended for an outside audience.  It’s meant to placate and reinforce members of a chosen group.  Doesn’t mean others can’t point and laugh when they see it. 

[The_Admiral]

17 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

Here’s what bugs me about the Marlins ownership discussion. This is far from innocent. 

Jeff Loria and David Samson are two Jewish men who are being vilified with antisemitic tropes of being greedy and out to screw others. All while not-Jewish Derrick Jeter is held up as Doing the Right Thing while Jeter’s Jewish partner Bruce Sherman is ignored. 

 

I understand this discomfort, but Loria and Samson really did set new lows in greed and ruthlessness. It had nothing to do with their Jewishness and everything to do with them being crappy people. But you do make a very good point about Jeter and his role as public ownership face.

 

I’m not sure that’s an entirely fair comparison.  Even setting aside that I had no idea any of those three men were Jewish.

 

You had no idea that a guy named "David Samson" was Jewish??

[Gothamite]

I just thought he had good hair.  

 

If I’d thought about him, maybe I would have realized.  But he’s such a silent partner I don’t usually remember he’s even part of the ownership group.  

[The_Admiral]

You thought David Samson was a silent partner?????

[Sec19Row53]

2 hours ago, Brandon9485 said:

 

That’s the thing, I don’t think they need to be defended that much. The people offended by these slogans aren’t the intended audience. 

Thinking the slogan arrogant and/or self important is not the same as being offended.

[Gothamite]

5 hours ago, the admiral said:

You thought David Samson was a silent partner?????

 

Sorry, I meant Bruce Sherman.  Sanson is the loud moron. 

[Marlins93]

I don't think much of the fanbase is enamored with Derek Jeter thus far. He came in and traded away Stanton, Yelich, Ozuna, and Gordon, which seems like Loria moves to many. He's getting plenty of flak.

[Marlins93]

23 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

Secondly? Something else that’s innocent. 

I think the new identity has some cool ideas (neon, kind of an 80s look, bright colours on a black base) but I don’t think they pulled those ideas off well. 

The logos and wordmark look like they came right out of the mid 2000s (despite those cool shirts swinging hard for the 80s) and the red and blue don’t pop on the field. 

I think the logos and uniforms could have used a few revisions to really bring the potential inherent in the concept out. As is? It’s just kind of underwhelming. 

 

I agree that it's underwhelming but I don't get much of an 80s vibe at all now that the dust has settled a bit. It reminds me much more of the early/mid 2000s BFBS trend if we were to draw a comparison.

[Gothamite]

Ironic, since the Marlins were one of the early adopters of BFBS.

[Marlins93]

23 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

Ironic, since the Marlins were one of the early adopters of BFBS.

I know some might disagree but I wouldn't call the 97-02 look BFBS. 03-11 definitely is though.

[SilverBullet1929]

42 minutes ago, Marlins93 said:

I don't think much of the fanbase is enamored with Derek Jeter thus far. He came in and traded away Stanton, Yelich, Ozuna, and Gordon, which seems like Loria moves to many. He's getting plenty of flak.

There's two sides to every story. To people who are actually Marlins fans and not just random people who don't really follow the team I actually feel the support for Jeter and the organization as a whole growing more and more. Those people understand those moves and don't just see them as Loria moves, because they're not. I refuse to consider the opinions of people who haven't gone to a Marlins game since the year the ballpark opened as being the opinions of the Marlins fanbase. Of course there are real Marlins fans who disapprove of Jeter but I honestly think the majority do approve of him and his moves and I'm talking about season ticket holders, fans who actually attend games on a realistic and regular basis, fans who actually watch the games and know the players, etc. 

[SilverBullet1929]

This has been discussed in the past but I think the 03-11 Marlins deserve a bit of a pass on BFBS considering black was their secondary and in some instances their primary color since day one.

 

To me the big offenders of BFBS are the teams that never had black in their color scheme before randomly bringing it in, namely the A's Mets and Royals.

 

They definitely overdid the black in 03-11 but the Marlins might not even count as BFBS if you wanna get technical about it. One could argue that all they did was choose to emphasize one of their own colors more than another, basically rearranging which color was their primary. 

[Gothamite]

But they chose the black for its marketability.  And then emphasized it to sell more stuff.  Which is the very definition of BFBS. 

[SilverBullet1929]

2 hours ago, Gothamite said:

But they chose the black for its marketability.  And then emphasized it to sell more stuff.  Which is the very definition of BFBS. 

By that definition then the White Sox and Rockies are BFBS too.

 

Doesn't every team emphasize their colors for marketability and more sales? 

[Quillz]

On 12/30/2018 at 9:26 AM, Ice_Cap said:

That's not really what I was getting at. People are acting like Jeter's the one making moves and comparing him to the previous ownership group. And neither is true.

Yes, he's the frontman, but we all know that. So we shouldn't be indulging in the act if we're trying to be accurate.

Jeter is to the Marlins what Magic Johnson is to the Dodgers. Both are well-known "faces" of their organizations, yet neither are majority owners and don't really deal with the true money decisions. I think some people are assuming Jeter is to the Marlins what John Elway is to the Broncos.

[Gothamite]

11 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said:

By that definition then the White Sox and Rockies are BFBS too.

 

There's an argument that the Rockies are indeed BFBS.  The White Sox, choosing their colors at the very beginning of the merchandising boom, much less so.  But neither of those clubs altered their color scheme as much as the Marlins did -- from almost totally-teal to almost totally-black -- to sell more stuff.

 

11 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said:

Doesn't every team emphasize their colors for marketability and more sales? 

 

Oh yes, of course they do.  But when teams choose or adopt black for its marketability, that's BFBS. 

 

Which I fully acknowledge means that it's awfully hard for new teams not to be BFBS, but that's the reality in which we're now living.  Merchandising is now the cart pulling the horse.