Colts looking for new horse

[ltravisjr]

Everybody is so negative and bitter about this. Nobody that is talking smack about the contest has shown anything better that they have come up with.

Really....nothing posted here is better than this?

I, too, am puzzled by the statement. I don't consider myself cocky, but I'm not stupid, and I'm not blind; I know I showed something better than what they came up with. So did at least four other people on this board, as well as a few members of the Colts' board. Your design ignorance makes me laugh.

I will play a little devil's advocate here. Agreed 100% that the board here has come up with better, more professional logos than this. However, perhaps the Colts chose this design for its general idea and that they will refine it, straightening/thickening lines, adding shadows, defining facial features, etc. You gotta keep in mind they intended to solicit amateur designs as part of the mix. It reminds me of the license plate Chisox unis of the 1980's. They were a result of a "fans design the uniform" contest in which professionals submitted designs, as well as amateurs (using a cartoony template) from the game program. The Sox chose six finalists, and the fans voted for the winner. The winner was one of the amateur designs, but was streamlined and simplified by the Sox (that S-O-X jersey had been substantially more Astro-like when it was submitted and modeled for final fan voting). My guess is the winning Colts logo will reflect the vision of this fan, but be redrawn and be much more professional looking.

Then again, maybe the Colts just chose a joke of a logo in a scam of a contest...

LT

[spinner_head]

The colts picked one and went with it.

And with that statement my dear spinner, you have hit the mother****** nail on the mother******** head. i think you will find that most of the posters in this thread found that the contest stunk to high hell... firstly a multi multi multi million dollar entity being to cheap to actually hire someone to design this logo.. secondly, it was obvious that that horse was the one that they wanted all along and surrounded it with chicken scratch and dog vomit to make it seem so much better than the others.... most people on here will not say that there designs would win.. just that this "vote" was rigged and that is truly disgraceful. everyone on here called it from day one.... it was that obvious..

Obviously, when I said that, I was referring to the possiblility that maybe they picked one of the TWO logos because they were too similar. By all means continue to twist things to your own liking to help with your whining. You have fun storming the Colts' headquarters with your pitch forks and torches and keep us posted on how that turns out for you.

You know what? I will join you. I have seen the light. This "promotional" contest is just an outrage. I mean the nerve of some people! ...promoting their team in the off-season with a friendly fan-designed logo contest... pfft! I mean despite the possiblity that this could be a simple contest that fans could participate in, win a little cash and some tickets, the Colts use their design for a year or so on t-shirts and printed pieces, I don't think it's right and I am not going to stop complaining about this until mine or one that I approve of wins. I may get so mad that...i don't know...arghh...i may start to use asterisks. I am mainly ticked because it's not right that a multi-million dollar company would have this in the first place but then, after I entered anyway, I am even more mad that I didn't make it! The only way I think that this could have happened is if the whole thing were rigged. Now the only thing left to do is group the finalists together and bash them all until i feel better. After all, it is the finalists' fault, and they deserve the brunt of pitch-fork attack when we get there. What were they thinking!?

[gingerbreadmann]

T-Shirts!

All proceeds to the ABA Hoop Dreams foundation!

[rtrich11]

The colts picked one and went with it.

And with that statement my dear spinner, you have hit the mother****** nail on the mother******** head. i think you will find that most of the posters in this thread found that the contest stunk to high hell... firstly a multi multi multi million dollar entity being to cheap to actually hire someone to design this logo.. secondly, it was obvious that that horse was the one that they wanted all along and surrounded it with chicken scratch and dog vomit to make it seem so much better than the others.... most people on here will not say that there designs would win.. just that this "vote" was rigged and that is truly disgraceful. everyone on here called it from day one.... it was that obvious..

Obviously, when I said that, I was referring to the possiblility that maybe they picked one of the TWO logos because they were too similar. By all means continue to twist things to your own liking to help with your whining. You have fun storming the Colts' headquarters with your pitch forks and torches and keep us posted on how that turns out for you.

You know what? I will join you. I have seen the light. This "promotional" contest is just an outrage. I mean the nerve of some people! ...promoting their team in the off-season with a friendly fan-designed logo contest... pfft! I mean despite the possiblity that this could be a simple contest that fans could participate in, win a little cash and some tickets, the Colts use their design for a year or so on t-shirts and printed pieces, I don't think it's right and I am not going to stop complaining about this until mine or one that I approve of wins. I may get so mad that...i don't know...arghh...i may start to use asterisks. I am mainly ticked because it's not right that a multi-million dollar company would have this in the first place but then, after I entered anyway, I am even more mad that I didn't make it! The only way I think that this could have happened is if the whole thing were rigged. Now the only thing left to do is group the finalists together and bash them all until i feel better. After all, it is the finalists' fault, and they deserve the brunt of pitch-fork attack when we get there. What were they thinking!?

This was a childish response. I don't think you understand what most of have been saying. There's a lot of intelligent posts explaining people's feelings, which noone should bother to explain to you again.

This was your second post. Waste no time showing us yourself.

[andrewharrington]

The colts picked one and went with it.

And with that statement my dear spinner, you have hit the mother****** nail on the mother******** head. i think you will find that most of the posters in this thread found that the contest stunk to high hell... firstly a multi multi multi million dollar entity being to cheap to actually hire someone to design this logo.. secondly, it was obvious that that horse was the one that they wanted all along and surrounded it with chicken scratch and dog vomit to make it seem so much better than the others.... most people on here will not say that there designs would win.. just that this "vote" was rigged and that is truly disgraceful. everyone on here called it from day one.... it was that obvious..

Obviously, when I said that, I was referring to the possiblility that maybe they picked one of the TWO logos because they were too similar. By all means continue to twist things to your own liking to help with your whining. You have fun storming the Colts' headquarters with your pitch forks and torches and keep us posted on how that turns out for you.

You know what? I will join you. I have seen the light. This "promotional" contest is just an outrage. I mean the nerve of some people! ...promoting their team in the off-season with a friendly fan-designed logo contest... pfft! I mean despite the possiblity that this could be a simple contest that fans could participate in, win a little cash and some tickets, the Colts use their design for a year or so on t-shirts and printed pieces, I don't think it's right and I am not going to stop complaining about this until mine or one that I approve of wins. I may get so mad that...i don't know...arghh...i may start to use asterisks. I am mainly ticked because it's not right that a multi-million dollar company would have this in the first place but then, after I entered anyway, I am even more mad that I didn't make it! The only way I think that this could have happened is if the whole thing were rigged. Now the only thing left to do is group the finalists together and bash them all until i feel better. After all, it is the finalists' fault, and they deserve the brunt of pitch-fork attack when we get there. What were they thinking!?

After thinking about the contest, I've made an observation and conclusion. There are certainly differing opinions on the way this contest could/should have been handled. Personally, I believe the contest should have transcended the publicity and fan hoo-ha and honored the best work. It defies logic that the judges would pick these particular pieces as the 5 best examples out of probably a few thousand based on concept, execution and overall quality. Thus, it seems to me that the decisions were made not necessarily with aesthetics in mind, but that they were made with more intent toward honoring 'the fan' rather than 'the artist' or 'the designer.' I don't know that they anticipated getting professional-quality entries from artists and designers, or that they even wanted professional-quality entries from artists and designers for that matter. It's certainly plausible (for me) that the Colts were simply looking to generate a little interest and didn't want to hold a tired raffle contest to give away $1000 and set of tickets, so they chose to hold a 'design a logo contest.' Design is, after all, an 'in' thing right now and has been sparking a lot of interest in the gen. public the past few years. They made some claims that the winner would be potentially immortalized and got a lot of people excited, but nobody really has any idea as to what the organization's intent was. I don't think it's right to be bitter without knowing; they may have been just as surprised as we were when the envelopes came in.

[spinner_head]

The colts picked one and went with it.

And with that statement my dear spinner, you have hit the mother****** nail on the mother******** head. i think you will find that most of the posters in this thread found that the contest stunk to high hell... firstly a multi multi multi million dollar entity being to cheap to actually hire someone to design this logo.. secondly, it was obvious that that horse was the one that they wanted all along and surrounded it with chicken scratch and dog vomit to make it seem so much better than the others.... most people on here will not say that there designs would win.. just that this "vote" was rigged and that is truly disgraceful. everyone on here called it from day one.... it was that obvious..

Obviously, when I said that, I was referring to the possiblility that maybe they picked one of the TWO logos because they were too similar. By all means continue to twist things to your own liking to help with your whining. You have fun storming the Colts' headquarters with your pitch forks and torches and keep us posted on how that turns out for you.

You know what? I will join you. I have seen the light. This "promotional" contest is just an outrage. I mean the nerve of some people! ...promoting their team in the off-season with a friendly fan-designed logo contest... pfft! I mean despite the possiblity that this could be a simple contest that fans could participate in, win a little cash and some tickets, the Colts use their design for a year or so on t-shirts and printed pieces, I don't think it's right and I am not going to stop complaining about this until mine or one that I approve of wins. I may get so mad that...i don't know...arghh...i may start to use asterisks. I am mainly ticked because it's not right that a multi-million dollar company would have this in the first place but then, after I entered anyway, I am even more mad that I didn't make it! The only way I think that this could have happened is if the whole thing were rigged. Now the only thing left to do is group the finalists together and bash them all until i feel better. After all, it is the finalists' fault, and they deserve the brunt of pitch-fork attack when we get there. What were they thinking!?

This was a childish response. I don't think you understand what most of have been saying. There's a lot of intelligent posts explaining people's feelings, which noone should bother to explain to you again.

This was your second post. Waste no time showing us yourself.

Right. MY response was childish. I was only making a point in reply to the childish response that I got. Grouping the finalists together and calling them dog vomit is not necessary to make one's point. It was over the top and that's how I replied. And I am not saying that there are not any intelligent posts or that people cannot have opinions; I am saying that there is no need to bash the finalists. The people that I was talking to know who they are. This forum started out great with people posting their work and others posting constructive criticism and general discussion about the contest. Towards the end it seems to me that things have taken a nasty turn. The other forum that turned this way was shut down.

So I have made my points and have a suggestion for a different direction in the forum. If nobody wants to do it, cool but I think it would be interesting.

I may try to do this later today but if someone else wants to, that's fine too. I propose we gather all entries on this and the other 2 or 3 forums where people posted them, plus the five finalists, put them all in one image and number each of them in no particular order. Then everybody can post their own choosing of top 5, and maybe the rest in order of liking if you want. And for everybody's number 1 pick, post what you like about it and what you would change to make it better... or this can be done with all top five. I think it would be interesting if anybody is game.

[Gothamite]

I will play a little devil's advocate here. Agreed 100% that the board here has come up with better, more professional logos than this. However, perhaps the Colts chose this design for its general idea and that they will refine it, straightening/thickening lines, adding shadows, defining facial features, etc. You gotta keep in mind they intended to solicit amateur designs as part of the mix.

True, but they also required submissions to be EPS files. So they were expecting at least a certain degree of professionalism, not 10 year-old fans doodling on looseleaf.

Then again, maybe the Colts just chose a joke of a logo in a scam of a contest...

Ah, could be.

[spinner_head]

Everybody is so negative and bitter about this. Nobody that is talking smack about the contest has shown anything better that they have come up with.

Really....nothing posted here is better than this?

I, too, am puzzled by the statement. I don't consider myself cocky, but I'm not stupid, and I'm not blind; I know I showed something better than what they came up with. So did at least four other people on this board, as well as a few members of the Colts' board. Your design ignorance makes me laugh.

It is because you read my first sentence and then posted a reply..quoting only part of it. Notice that I also said there are maybe 2 non-finalist entries that I thought should be in the finals. Which because there are not 7 finalists, it is indicative that I think they are better than 2 of the finalists... imo 3,4. Are there others that are better than #3 and #4? yes, but if I have already removed 3 and 4 and replaced them with 2 that i thought should be in the finals, then that is 5 people.

What makes me laugh is that one of my two picks was yours. Personally, I would like to see the head and body match a little better as far as complexity, and the pose changed from prancing or flying to more of a gallop. The tail is lackluster compared to the mane and face. Other than that, I liked the style and overall proportions...but what do I know, right? Let me ask you this... Do you think that if your entry and another entry were in place of 3 and 4 that some in this forum would be praising the colts for their awesome choice of at least 2 good finalists?; or, do you think that once your design was put under the microscope as scrutinized like the rest of the finalists, the remaining group of nay-sayers would still lump yours together with the other 4 as the horrible results of a rigged contest?

[andrewharrington]

Everybody is so negative and bitter about this. Nobody that is talking smack about the contest has shown anything better that they have come up with.

Really....nothing posted here is better than this?

I, too, am puzzled by the statement. I don't consider myself cocky, but I'm not stupid, and I'm not blind; I know I showed something better than what they came up with. So did at least four other people on this board, as well as a few members of the Colts' board. Your design ignorance makes me laugh.

It is because you read my first sentence and then posted a reply..quoting only part of it. Notice that I also said there are maybe 2 non-finalist entries that I thought should be in the finals. Which because there are not 7 finalists, it is indicative that I think they are better than 2 of the finalists... imo 3,4. Are there others that are better than #3 and #4? yes, but if I have already removed 3 and 4 and replaced them with 2 that i thought should be in the finals, then that is 5 people.

What makes me laugh is that one of my two picks was yours. Personally, I would like to see the head and body match a little better as far as complexity, and the pose changed from prancing or flying to more of a gallop. The tail is lackluster compared to the mane and face. Other than that, I liked the style and overall proportions...but what do I know, right? Let me ask you this... Do you think that if your entry and another entry were in place of 3 and 4 that some in this forum would be praising the colts for their awesome choice of at least 2 good finalists?; or, do you think that once your design was put under the microscope as scrutinized like the rest of the finalists, the remaining group of nay-sayers would still lump yours together with the other 4 as the horrible results of a rigged contest?

There are a lot of people who do nothing but seek out and dwell upon the bad qualities of a work without ever taking the time to recognize, evaluate and praise the successes and the potential of the work. I find it most beneficial for both artist and critic to keep an open mind and strike a good balance of both, which you seem to do pretty well. So, kudos for that, and while I don't agree with your critiques, you clearly do have an understanding of formalism and principles on which you base your opinions, which I respect. To your question, now, if my entry had been a finalist, I think it probably would have been treated the same way as the current finalists are, if not by this group, then by another for certain. You can never please everyone, and sometimes, it seems like you can't please anyone in the sports logo business.

[spinner_head]

There are a lot of people who do nothing but seek out and dwell upon the bad qualities of a work without ever taking the time to recognize, evaluate and praise the successes and the potential of the work. I find it most beneficial for both artist and critic to keep an open mind and strike a good balance of both, which you seem to do pretty well. So, kudos for that, and while I don't agree with your critiques, you clearly do have an understanding of formalism and principles on which you base your opinions, which I respect. To your question, now, if my entry had been a finalist, I think it probably would have been treated the same way as the current finalists are, if not by this group, then by another for certain. You can never please everyone, and sometimes, it seems like you can't please anyone in the sports logo business.

Well put. I definitely agree that an open mind to criticism is important. Listening to what others have to say (positive or negative) may be one of the best ways to improve your own work. I think the negative probably plays a bigger role in most cases because the positive facets of your work do not require a lot of change. The negative comments can promote change for the better. I know I received a few comments on my lines being too thin and a few other issues with proportions and the neck, and I will definitely be watching for problems like this the next time I am in a similar design situation. One of the worst things a critic can do is be "nice" and tell how much they love it as not to offend anybody. But I think even worse than that is the extreme opposite of running someone in the ground without reason. I guess that's why I was a little irritated when I came in expecting a little more of a professional environment.

[andrewharrington]

Well put. I definitely agree that an open mind to criticism is important. Listening to what others have to say (positive or negative) may be one of the best ways to improve your own work. I think the negative probably plays a bigger role in most cases because the positive facets of your work do not require a lot of change. The negative comments can promote change for the better. I know I received a few comments on my lines being too thin and a few other issues with proportions and the neck, and I will definitely be watching for problems like this the next time I am in a similar design situation. One of the worst things a critic can do is be "nice" and tell how much they love it as not to offend anybody. But I think even worse than that is the extreme opposite of running someone in the ground without reason. I guess that's why I was a little irritated when I came in expecting a little more of a professional environment.

No doubt. Couldn't agree more.

[pdg]

Many of these comments are perfectly valid. The one thing I can add is the Colts historically lack emphasis on design as a marketing tool in their general communications. I have been a season ticket holder for nearly 10 years and the print communications I receive are for the most part just awful. You need a culture of commitment to these issues to have better outcomes in these types of situations. My entry didn't make the final 5. Many of the solutions posted on this site are vastly superior to all but one of the chosen concepts. So the question is really not about the design work itself, but the committee process and who is responsible for making the decisions. My guess is a very young, inexperienced staff with a shoestring budget. Without the proper philosophy; one which demands higher quality; design will not be a part of the Colts marketing vocabulary. Not to offend anyone however 4 of these ideas looks like clip art and frankly that's what the Indy market tolerates. And by the way, the ownership of the submitted art to the Colts would not hold up in court. There must be some form of compensation to legally transfer ownership. At least that's what my attorney indicated to me.

For what it's worth here's mine.

[pdg]

OK; here's a link to the concept...

http://www.prismdesign.com/wip/pdg_wip_colts_horse.html

[spinner_head]

I just posted this on the other forum where you posted this same link.

Thanks for sharing. I really like your reasoning for the head-only approach. I think this is a very unique take on the logo and I think you have included the right amount of detail and motion. However, the mane?s repetitive and smooth-line style does not match the rest of the logo. For instance, the ears appear to be different sizes with different stroke thicknesses but the sections of the mane are exactly the same. There are also, in my opinion, some perspective issues that could be fine-tuned. Some other things that are working against you are the perfectly straight sliver just behind the nose (It seems like it should follow the bridge of the nose to between the horse?s eyes) and the mouth, though I think you entended to indicate the mouth wrapped around the face a little more, at first glance it seems to be more like he is a ventriloquist talking out of the side of his mouth. These suggestions are all just my opinion but I think it has a lot of potential and thought I would share my thoughts on it.

[Frenchie]

OK; here's a link to the concept...

http://www.prismdesign.com/wip/pdg_wip_colts_horse.html

Sorry, I haven't read much of theis thread, but as far as horses are concerned, it'll be hard to rival with the Broncos'.

And it certain won't be this "My Little Pony" "Barbie's Magic of Pegasus" type of version.

The mane on the side looks like an Alberto VO5 hair flip....

[spinner_head]

OK; here's a link to the concept...

http://www.prismdesign.com/wip/pdg_wip_colts_horse.html

Okay, I couldn't resist tinkering with it. Had a little down time and wanted to see it with nose and hair tweaked.

[blumonkey95]

Once they use Napoleon Dynamite horse as a secondary, it'd be cool to see mine as a tertiary or special usage mark.

So to bring this up again, do they retain the rights to the unused finalists?

[OCE]

Once they use Napoleon Dynamite horse as a secondary, it'd be cool to see mine as a tertiary or special usage mark.

Your state outline is still a bit goofed especially on the upper left corner, the bottom left corner and the lower right edge.

I've never seen a horse shoe shaped like that (with full serifed tips) only with little flares as on the Colts' primary logo or with unflared blunt or rounded tips.

Why not use a torch (as on the Indiana flag) for the I instead of the abstract letter I? You'd have to change the color of course (it is yellow on the flag).

BTW (question for the board) is there a word to describe a letter that is also an image of something (like the horseshoe C)?

[spinner_head]

Once they use Napoleon Dynamite horse as a secondary, it'd be cool to see mine as a tertiary or special usage mark.

Your state outline is still a bit goofed especially on the upper left corner, the bottom left corner and the lower right edge.

I've never seen a horse shoe shaped like that (with full serifed tips) only with little flares as on the Colts' primary logo or with unflared blunt or rounded tips.

Why not use a torch (as on the Indiana flag) for the I instead of the abstract letter I? You'd have to change the color of course (it is yellow on the flag).

BTW (question for the board) is there a word to describe a letter that is also an image of something (like the horseshoe C)?

I agree. I also think that there is a reason the colts are not currently using the horseshoe as a C or in any other position. One reason could be that it is positioned like a horseshoe for good luck would be...the open end up so the "luck doesn't run out". Plus most of logo standards manuals I have seen or done have a stipulation about not rotating the logo to make another letter. McDonalds is a good example and their standards manual is online if you do a search for it. It says that you cannot use their arches as a W or E or cursive Z as it compromises the integrity of the logo.

[Gothamite]

And they're right about that.

Using the primary logo as a C is clever, but it undermines the primary.