Veras

History of a Fictional Football League (1989 – 44th Victory Bowl)

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I can see that the Firebird looks like it has some sort of Southwestern Native American influences, but I can definitely see how people would think it's an alien. If I didn't know it was the Firebirds, I would've thought it was an Albuquerque team with an alien motif. 

 

Maybe the wings might serve as a better secondary?

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I've made a new alternate, as suggested by @Steelman and others.  I avoided the profile look before because I was afraid of looking too much like the Falcons, but I think the angles are different enough that it works.  For the record, I did play with putting this on the helmet, but it doesn't work.  The tip of the wing runs into the facemask unless the logo is either really small or oddly placed.

 

1987_arizona_firebirds_alternate_logo_by

On 9/24/2017 at 10:44 PM, CheeseBurger22 said:

Love the new Firebirds logo and uniforms, although they do look a bit modern, but that's ok, they still look great

I think a lot of the looks over the next few years will end up being pretty modern.  I've been looking forward to doing some crazy stuff in the 1990s, but as I've started researching 90s uniforms in the NFL... they're just not that exciting.  The NFL didn't go crazy in the same way that say, the NBA did, so I'm probably going to end up with some more radical designs than were seen in real life.

 

On 9/24/2017 at 11:13 PM, rjrrzube said:

I'm not feeling the bird head secondary. Exploded from the body, it reads like something looking upward. 

 

Also think the mainly dark red main logo is lost on a dark red helmet. 

 

I do like that you didn't go with a black jersey - although I expect that's coming in the late '90s or early 2000s.

 

The only way around the logo getting lost on the helmet is to turn the helmet white.  I like it more with the white jersey, but not so much with the red.  What do you guys think?

 

1987_arizona_firebirds_uniform_by_verast

 

On 9/25/2017 at 8:23 AM, DNAsports said:

The sleeve stripe for the Firebirds seems to resemble an "A". Is that intentional?

Yes.  That is actually how the entire uniform got started, everything else is built around that feature.

 

On 9/25/2017 at 1:39 PM, Jimmy Lethal said:

And since they're the Firebirds, I get some Moltres from it, too. Now we just need Articuno and we'll be able to create Thu-Fi-Zer.

When I first started working on the Firebirds (for the 1974 season), I considered Arcticuno as inspiration, but didn't like what I ended up with.

 

On 9/25/2017 at 8:19 PM, officerpain138 said:

I love the addition of black to the scheme. The uniforms are outstanding! The logos, I am not really in love with. When put side by side to the old vs the new, I like the old better. The new primary is decent, but I like the old primary better. The new secondary I am not a fan of. As others have said, it could pass as a snake. And for the wordmark, I like the old style better. It had a flame feel to it. If this is just a stepping stone to get to where you see them going, I can dig it for now. I just think they still need work. But like I said about the uniforms, those are outstanding! Love the double outline! I cant wait to see what else you got up your sleeves.

I've been unhappy with the old logos for quite some time.  I hated how uneven the different segments of the wings were.  When I made the first set, I didn't understand how to use the stroke tool as well as I do now.  I could probably improve it, and they may end up going back to something like the original someday.  I'm not really sure yet.

 

On 9/25/2017 at 8:58 PM, ItDoesntMatter said:

Well, it's not exactly what I expected, but it still looks great, especially for the late 80s. I'd feel very redundant saying the secondary logo doesn't really work, so I won't. I will say that the font used for the wordmark is a little strange; it looks very Greek and doesn't really say "Arizona" or "Firebirds" to me at all. The uniforms look really nice, though.

The Greek font was intentional, though maybe the thought process that I used to get there makes less sense outside of my History teacher head.  People from Phoenix are called Phoenicians, and the Greek alphabet is directly based on the Phoenician alphabet.  The Phoenix is a creature from Greek mythology.  Greek letters are pointy, like the logo, and the sleeve stripe (okay, that last one wasn't historical).

 

That is pretty much a transcript of the thoughts that ran through my mind when I was considering the font.  Like you (and @Dan O'Mac) I prefer the old font, BD Merced.  In fact, it is my favorite font.  I just don't think it fits very well with this set.  It's very flowy, while this is jagged and harsh.  I strongly suspect that the old one will come back someday, though.

 

On 9/27/2017 at 3:25 PM, JH42XCC said:

There's a baseball stadium in Brooklyn in the AFA Universe? Is that located where the Brooklyn Dodgers domed stadium would've been built? Also, I'm guessing Indy's stadium is on the site of the real-world Lucas Oil Stadium and Anaheim's stadium is... well, Anaheim Stadium when the Rams played there.

I have not and will not done any research for where the USFA stadiums are (to keep the project from getting out of control, I have to strictly limit how much time I'm willing to put into the USFA).  The only one that I'll comment on for sure is Indianapolis, because I don't have to research that.  It's located where the Hoosier/RCA Dome was.  Close to Lucas, but not quite.

 

On 9/27/2017 at 3:51 PM, mr.negative15 said:

After noticing this thread for some time, and having a couple failed starts in reading it..I finally took the plunge last week. 

 

I'm now caught up and just wanted to throw my 2 cents out there @Veras: This really is captivating. The story stays really fresh but realistic. I legitimately felt a little sad when Buffalo moved. I really hope the city gets a team again. 

The design portion has been great too. I know you've said that you started this to improve your skills and in that regard, you have succeeded (I know that's not an original thought but it's worth repeating). 

I'm officially hooked.

Welcome to the thread.  Now that you're all caught up, I'm definitely looking forward to your commentary, and I hope that you will participate in future expansion councils.

 

If nothing else, Buffalo will definitely get a USFA team, and it's one of my favorite designs in the league (though it's admittedly corny).

 

On 9/27/2017 at 5:48 PM, Dan O'Mac said:

And I see them more like our universe's Lions, where the team added black, no one outside of the front office really liked it, and it stuck around longer than anyone really would've wanted it to.

Maybe, maybe not.  A lot of teams are going to start adopting black over the next decade or so, and I'm sure that some teams will do a worse job than this.

 

Also, unpopular opinion - while I think Detroit overused the black, and they should never have worn a black jersey, I really did like the black facemask.

 

On 9/27/2017 at 8:10 PM, RightGuard said:

Did you ever get to fix the Wasps' wordmark?

I haven't gone back to it.  It took me so long to get my computer working again that I kind of just got over wanting to work on them.  Beyond that, I'm inclined to leave it, even if it is a bit anachronistic.  As I said earlier, since the NFL didn't really go crazy with their 90's designs like other leagues did, I'm probably going to end up doing a few logos and uniforms over the next decade the look a bit historically out of place.  The Washington wordmark, I think, fits that pattern.

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3 hours ago, Veras said:

The Greek font was intentional, though maybe the thought process that I used to get there makes less sense outside of my History teacher head.  People from Phoenix are called Phoenicians, and the Greek alphabet is directly based on the Phoenician alphabet.  The Phoenix is a creature from Greek mythology.  Greek letters are pointy, like the logo, and the sleeve stripe (okay, that last one wasn't historical).

 

That is pretty much a transcript of the thoughts that ran through my mind when I was considering the font.  Like you (and @Dan O'Mac) I prefer the old font, BD Merced.  In fact, it is my favorite font.  I just don't think it fits very well with this set.  It's very flowy, while this is jagged and harsh.  I strongly suspect that the old one will come back someday, though.

 

Ok, that makes sense. I think the main problem I have with the font is not its "Greek-ness" but more its "ancient Greek-ness," if that makes any sense. Your logos and uniforms have a lot of sharp, clean points, as does Greek lettering; but this font is, like you said, jagged and harsh, and doesn't seem to mesh with the logos any better than the previous font. I think if you used a font that was more inspired by Ancient Greek instead of actually looking like it was carved into a stone tablet, it would look better (consider this returning a favor :D).

 

On other notes, the new secondary is great, and I like the white helmet better than the red, but I like the concept of the red helmet better. Just throwing things against the wall here, but have you tried a black helmet?

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3 hours ago, Veras said:

I've made a new alternate, as suggested by @Steelman and others.  I avoided the profile look before because I was afraid of looking too much like the Falcons, but I think the angles are different enough that it works.  For the record, I did play with putting this on the helmet, but it doesn't work.  The tip of the wing runs into the facemask unless the logo is either really small or oddly placed.

 

1987_arizona_firebirds_alternate_logo_by

 

 

Dude, this is one hell of an improvement. It's a shame it doesn't work on the helmet. This turned out fantastic though.

 

I like the primary on the white helmet better, but I like the red helmets for the new set overall. I think the logo on red reminded me of the Ravens styling; black on black. I don't think it's too big of a deal to be honest. Is having two helmets out of the question?

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Oh well if there are more uniforms that are gonna look modern I'm looking forward to those!

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2 minutes ago, CheeseBurger22 said:

Oh well if there are more uniforms that are gonna look modern I'm looking forward to those!

True dat

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Now that's an excellent secondary logo!

In my opinion, keeping the red helmets make more sense than the white helmets for this uniform, even if that means the logo gets a little lost on the helmet.  

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2 hours ago, Stickman said:

Now that's an excellent secondary logo!

In my opinion, keeping the red helmets make more sense than the white helmets for this uniform, even if that means the logo gets a little lost on the helmet.  

 

I agree, I like the red helmet. I remember having this problem in the old Madden games, the logos were so simple with only two or three colours and didn't always have outlines so they would bleed into the helmet. I was normally not a fan of white helmets so I'd always have to choose what looked better.

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20 hours ago, ItDoesntMatter said:

 

Ok, that makes sense. I think the main problem I have with the font is not its "Greek-ness" but more its "ancient Greek-ness," if that makes any sense. Your logos and uniforms have a lot of sharp, clean points, as does Greek lettering; but this font is, like you said, jagged and harsh, and doesn't seem to mesh with the logos any better than the previous font. I think if you used a font that was more inspired by Ancient Greek instead of actually looking like it was carved into a stone tablet, it would look better (consider this returning a favor :D).

 

On other notes, the new secondary is great, and I like the white helmet better than the red, but I like the concept of the red helmet better. Just throwing things against the wall here, but have you tried a black helmet?

Now I think I see what you're saying on the letters.  I've redrawn them to avoid the... let's call it wobbliness.  I've included both for comparison.  The original is on bottom, the reworked version is just above it.

 

I tried helmets in red, white, black, and yellow.  Black looked terrible with the white jersey, and yellow just looked terrible.  Red and white you guys saw, and I think it's fair to say that both have merits.  I prefer the red, so that's what I'm going with (@Steelman, I considered doing two helmets, but I'm not ready to go there yet.  It may happen eventually, but not until the 2000s).  So here is the final version of the Firebirds (well, once I choose a wordmark).

 

1987_arizona_firebirds_by_verasthebrujah

 

1987_arizona_firebirds_uniform_by_verast

 

I will also now present the rest of the 1987 changes.  Up first, is the San Diego Destroyers:

 

Old Logos:

1976_san_diego_destroyers_by_verasthebru

 

New Logos:

1987_san_diego_destroyers_by_verasthebru

 

I've already mentioned the color change.  The old blue was just too dark - it often looked black - and I changed the shade of gold to better match.  The only other change is the addition of the secondary.  I've actually had this, or at least a version of this, for quite a while.  It was my second choice when the team was first introduced.  I decided against it because I didn't like the height to width ratio (this edition isn't as tall as the original).

 

Old Uniform:

1978_san_diego_destroyers_uniform_by_ver

 

New Uniform:

1987_san_diego_destroyers_uniform_by_ver

 

Like Arizona, they made the switch to the new template.  To add a little flavor, they also became the only team in the league to have wildly different home and away jerseys.  The white jersey is more or less the same, but the blue did away with the shoulder stripes.  The look has increasingly become associated with Colorado, so the team wanted to try something different.  The front office was divided on whether the old look or the new look was better, so they ended up splitting the difference.

 

So that brings us to the Tampa Bay Bobcats.  Their old jersey wasn't popular among uniform buffs.  The sleeve stripes were weirdly high, which led to them awkwardly ending at the player's chest, though they could easily have fit unabbreviated if they were lower.  When presented the opportunity to be a guinea pig for the new uniform template, they jumped at the chance, both because they play a lot of hot-weather games and because it provided an excuse to fix the old design.

 

Old Uniform:

1981_tampa_bay_bobcats_uniform_by_verast

 

New Uniform:

1987_tampa_bay_bobcats_uniform_by_verast

 

 

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Don't have much to say on Atlanta, @Veras

 

 

However, I do have a lot to say on the Destroyers.... and it's 100% positive. The new brighter Navy & Metallic Gold really pop...... I do have to wonder though.... how would a Gold Shell for the team look? I like the Navy helmet, but a Gold one feels like it would look better with the new Blue Jersey & Gold Pants. Still, a great look! 

 

The small tweak for the Bobcats also looks nice & I was fine with where the stripes were, but it does look better now. 

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The new font looks much better. I only have one tiny nitpick: the two horizontal lines on the F aren't quite parallel. I just can't unsee it. Other than that, I think the Firebirds are perfect, and the Destroyers and Bobcats look great as well.

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That new San Diego look is Destroyer fan approved. The brighter blue and yellow reminds me a lot of Cal, and that's nothing but good. Great job! The different jersey styles are something to get used to though...I really wonder which style they'll ultimately run with in the future.

I guess that means it's time for a new sig...

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Out of all the updated uniforms, I find the Destroyers to have the best look of them all! The lighter shade of blue really compliments the gold more, in my opinion. 

 

Also, is there a chance of Philadelphia getting as USFA team should the Railers move? I can’t wait for the 1987 offseason!

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First, I'd like to get all of the sig updates out of the way.

 

Here is the championship banner sig, now including a 9th for the Miners:

championship_banners_sig_by_verasthebruj

 

Here is the updated Boston Captains jersey sig for @Darknes

boston_captains_jersey_sig_by_verasthebr

 

@ChicagoOakland - I'm finished with the sigs for this year, so I just quickly updated the old one with the new colors.  If you'd like, I can make one featuring Marius Emmons (a rising superstar) or Shell Thompson (a veteran legend) next offseason.  If so, just remind me after the next Victory Bowl.

san_diego_destroyers_player_sig___qb_wal

 

I believe that @RightGuard also requested the official RGB codes for each team.  I'll do you one better.  Here is a spreadsheet showing a timeline of every team's colors since they entered the AFA.  I'll make the document editable so you can look at the colors in detail.  If anybody does edit it, I'll just overwrite it with the master copy from my computer.

 

13 hours ago, KittSmith_95 said:

However, I do have a lot to say on the Destroyers.... and it's 100% positive. The new brighter Navy & Metallic Gold really pop...... I do have to wonder though.... how would a Gold Shell for the team look? I like the Navy helmet, but a Gold one feels like it would look better with the new Blue Jersey & Gold Pants. Still, a great look! 

The gold helmet really doesn't work for San Diego.  For some reason, even with the blue jersey, it just takes over the entire look, and I prefer it as an accent color.

 

12 hours ago, ItDoesntMatter said:

The new font looks much better. I only have one tiny nitpick: the two horizontal lines on the F aren't quite parallel. I just can't unsee it. Other than that, I think the Firebirds are perfect, and the Destroyers and Bobcats look great as well.

That was intentional.  Actually, none of the lines are parallel.  It's my way of splitting the difference between the old font and your suggestion.

 

58 minutes ago, BengalSteve said:

...is there a chance of Philadelphia getting as USFA team should the Railers move? I can’t wait for the 1987 offseason!

If the Railers leave, there is a 100% chance that the USFA will move into Philly.  The markets that the Railers ownership have been looking at are all USFA markets, so if they relocate, the USFA franchise would do the opposite.  This would be a wonderful thing for the upstart league, and as a result, AFA President Warren Breyer has been putting heavy pressure on both sides to make a deal.  He does not want to abandon the market.

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12 minutes ago, Veras said:

I believe that @RightGuard also requested the official RGB codes for each team.  I'll do you one better.  Here is a spreadsheet showing a timeline of every team's colors since they entered the AFA.  I'll make the document editable so you can look at the colors in detail.  If anybody does edit it, I'll just overwrite it with the master copy from my computer.

Oh my god, thank you so much for this. Though I have a few questions. What year did the Royals move from Richmond to Baltimore? That seems to have been complicated by all the information you have out there. And will you update this spreadsheet for upcoming seasons?

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 I think 1967 was their first season in Baltimore I have to double check but I'm about 90% sure that's right. I will keep updating it for future seasons, other this is honestly the kind of thing that I'm going to forget to do so if it doesn't get updated just remind me from time to time. 

 

EDIT:  Yes, it was 1967.  As I was making this, I did find an error on my roster sheet in which I left one player in Richmond for that season, and didn't change them over until 1968.

 

Just out of curiosity, do you remember where you saw the conflicting information, so I can go back and fix it?

Edited by Veras

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Nice updates for San Diego and Tampa, those blue home jerseys are beautiful. What you could do to fit the Firebirds secondary logo on the helmet is tilt it (the Arizona Cardinals do this currently).

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I like what you did with the secondary for AZ. I actually like it better than the primary. The red helmet is a great choice for them. I was afraid you were going to go white. There are to many teams with white helmets in my opinion. The Destroyers brighter set looks great! The secondary logo is great! And the bobcats, that fix of the uniform looks much better. All in all, everything has been executed well and I cant wait for the season to start!

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