Cleveland Browns Helmet

[IceCap]

Frankly, the only post you need to edit is your own, as it seems to be nothing more than a cheap shot at a team that hasn't had on field success.

You said, and I quote, "That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning."

The emphasis is mine.

You said that the new Browns being able to keep the colours, name, logos, and history would set a winning precedent. It's clear this is not the case, and I pointed that out. It's not a cheap shot. It's you being factually incorrect and me correcting you.

Again, I'll repeat what I said in my first note. Do not take something someone says about your favourite team personally. Calling the opinions of others "asinine" and "stupid" will not be tolerated. Consider this an official warning.

[4thandPunt]

mod edit

[jgiff17]

Can we get a quick mock up

Of what this crap would look like?

[wonderbread]

Frankly, the only post you need to edit is your own, as it seems to be nothing more than a cheap shot at a team that hasn't had on field success.

You said, and I quote, "That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning."

The emphasis is mine.

You said that the new Browns being able to keep the colours, name, logos, and history would set a winning precedent. It's clear this is not the case, and I pointed that out. It's not a cheap shot. It's you being factually incorrect and me correcting you.

Again, I'll repeat what I said in my first note. Do not take something someone says about your favourite team personally. Calling the opinions of others "asinine" and "stupid" will not be tolerated. Consider this an official warning.

In addition to your credibility as a moderator being called into question for adding nothing to the discussion of team tradition by cheap shotting the lack of on field success, you have now shown a complete lack of reading comprehension.

I'm reporting you so we can get another mod into this discussion.

What is saying is correct, you trying to belittle him as a mod is not a good idea nor is your posting at any point correct.

[4thandPunt]

Frankly, the only post you need to edit is your own, as it seems to be nothing more than a cheap shot at a team that hasn't had on field success.

You said, and I quote, "That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning."

The emphasis is mine.

You said that the new Browns being able to keep the colours, name, logos, and history would set a winning precedent. It's clear this is not the case, and I pointed that out. It's not a cheap shot. It's you being factually incorrect and me correcting you.

Again, I'll repeat what I said in my first note. Do not take something someone says about your favourite team personally. Calling the opinions of others "asinine" and "stupid" will not be tolerated. Consider this an official warning.

In addition to your credibility as a moderator being called into question for adding nothing to the discussion of team tradition by cheap shotting the lack of on field success, you have now shown a complete lack of reading comprehension.

I'm reporting you so we can get another mod into this discussion.

What is saying is correct, you trying to belittle him as a mod is not a good idea nor is your posting at any point correct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Browns_relocation_controversy#Effect_on_teams_in_other_sports_leagues

Ice_Cap is completely wrong in this situation, as are you.

[IceCap]

If any other mods wish to come in and give their appraisal of the situation then they're more then welcome to.

I do not believe I have crossed any lines as a mod myself though. I've removed your belittling and confrontational comments. That's where my actions as mod began and ended in this thread.

My actions as a member of these forums began when I quoted you and corrected your factually incorrect assertion. That you chose to respond to that with belittling and confrontational comments only highlights why I had to take any actions as a mod in this thread in the first place.

[wonderbread]

"The reactivated Browns have had only two winning seasons since returning to the NFL in 1999:" straight from that wikipedia link. Do you call that a winning precedent?

[4thandPunt]

If any other mods wish to come in and give their appraisal of the situation then they're more then welcome to.

I do not believe I have crossed any lines as a mod myself though. I've removed your belittling and confrontational comments. That's where my actions as mod began and ended in this thread.

My actions as a member of these forums began when I quoted you and corrected your factually incorrect assertion. That you chose to respond to that with belittling and confrontational comments only highlights why I had to take any actions as a mod in this thread in the first place.

I posted a link so you could better understand why you are wrong. Please read it.

[Lee.]

If any other mods wish to come in and give their appraisal of the situation then they're more then welcome to.

I do not believe I have crossed any lines as a mod myself though. I've removed your belittling and confrontational comments. That's where my actions as mod began and ended in this thread.

My actions as a member of these forums began when I quoted you and corrected your factually incorrect assertion. That you chose to respond to that with belittling and confrontational comments only highlights why I had to take any actions as a mod in this thread in the first place.

moderator edited section

I posted a link so you could better understand why you are wrong. Please read it.

Hi. I'm another mod. Dial it down. You're getting worked up over nothing.

[LMU]

Another mod reporting.

There is nothing posted by Icecap that can be seen as belligerent or inappropriate. I quite frankly agree that there's no tradition for an expansion team to recycle uniforms only to go on to fifteen years of below mediocre play. In terms of the settlement, it's a victory only in the sense of revisionist history. All that was served was confounding the record books leading to the bizarre history trades that teams now take part in that question intelligence.

So, let's stop whining about a mod editing posts and concentrate on dropping the radical fanaticism and debating without personal attacks.

[4thandPunt]

"The reactivated Browns have had only two winning seasons since returning to the NFL in 1999:" straight from that wikipedia link. Do you call that a winning precedent?

That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning.

The city and fans won a settlement against Modell in order to keep the team name, colors, and history.

Winning this settlement set a legal precedent with other sports teams, including the Minnesota Twins, Seattle SuperSonics, and San Jose Earthquakes.

That link actually went straight to the relevant section.

[IceCap]

"The reactivated Browns have had only two winning seasons since returning to the NFL in 1999:" straight from that wikipedia link. Do you call that a winning precedent?

That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning.

The city and fans won a settlement against Modell in order to keep the team name, colors, and history.

Winning this settlement set a legal precedent with other sports teams, including the Minnesota Twins, Seattle SuperSonics, and San Jose Earthquakes.

That link actually went straight to the relevant section.

Here's the point of confusion. The Browns case set a precedent regarding how team relocation would be handled. You said, however, that it would set a precedent for on field success. Which was incorrect.

If the only issue here at play is confusion over the wording of your original quote then I see no need to continue this argumentative line of discussion. We were both addressing two different points and weren't aware of it, and a disagreement happen. It happens on the internet. So let's move on.

[LMU]

Let's assume that the "actually winning" line was a poor phrasing of the precedent being that the case itself was won. All that victory does is make us ignore the elephant in the room and believe with crossed fingers that Jim Brown wasn't associated with the two time Super Bowl champs that former Brown Ozzie Newsome put together. Or that Michael Jordan owns the team that drafted Kobe Bryant.

[4thandPunt]

"The reactivated Browns have had only two winning seasons since returning to the NFL in 1999:" straight from that wikipedia link. Do you call that a winning precedent?

That tradition is one of a city desperately fighting against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history, and in a landmark case that would set a precedent, actually winning.

The city and fans won a settlement against Modell in order to keep the team name, colors, and history.

Winning this settlement set a legal precedent with other sports teams, including the Minnesota Twins, Seattle SuperSonics, and San Jose Earthquakes.

That link actually went straight to the relevant section.

Here's the point of confusion. The Browns case set a precedent regarding how team relocation would be handled. You said, however, that it would set a precedent for on field success. Which was incorrect.

No, I didn't.

"actually winning" referred to the fight "against a criminal owner and the NFL to keep the team name, colors, and history".

Winning that fight was "a landmark case that set legal precedent".

Nowhere in that post were any references to the on field product, at all.

Edit: accidental multiquote.

[IceCap]

My mistake. As the source of the disagreement is settled we can hopefully move on and get back on topic.

[guest23]

mod edit

[4thandPunt]

Let's assume that the "actually winning" line was a poor phrasing of the precedent being that the case itself was won. All that victory does is make us ignore the elephant in the room and believe with crossed fingers that Jim Brown wasn't associated with the two time Super Bowl champs that former Brown Ozzie Newsome put together.

Posts like this are why I made my original post.

People talk about the Browns and say "oh, it is a tradition of losing." "Real Browns went to Baltimore."

How can so many people supposedly interested in a subject (sports uniform and logo design) that involves passionate fan bases have such a careless, callous attitude to how those fans see themselves and their own traditions?

Not viewing a subject like this from the point of view of the community one is talking about is ignorant.

A statement like "maybe the Browns should try a new striping pattern" or "I don't like the Browns colors" is far, far different than "What tradition do they have to be proud of?"

[ESTONES6]

Back on topic, the local CBS Sports Talk affiliate here in town, 92.3 The Fan, had team President Alec Scheiner on today, and he said that the team would be debuting new uniforms next season.

Just to confirm, "next season" means the 2015-2016 season right?

[habsfan1]

^{_{A Customer of mine Works for the Browns And told me that she saw some helmets brought in a saw one of them and its was metallic in nature with a wider then normal stripe. She did say it was one of a few different ones but only saw the one. dont know if its a prototype or something else, just wanted to let you guys know ,i'm really not artistic i really just come here to see the awesome work some of you do.}}

If that's the official change, then I think it may not be a big deal at all, depending on how exactly the metallic part stands out.

[IceCap]

Back on topic, the local CBS Sports Talk affiliate here in town, 92.3 The Fan, had team President Alec Scheiner on today, and he said that the team would be debuting new uniforms next season.

Just to confirm, "next season" means the 2015-2016 season right?

Yeah. There's no way they'd have anything ready to go by September.

^{_{A Customer of mine Works for the Browns And told me that she saw some helmets brought in a saw one of them and its was metallic in nature with a wider then normal stripe. She did say it was one of a few different ones but only saw the one. dont know if its a prototype or something else, just wanted to let you guys know ,i'm really not artistic i really just come here to see the awesome work some of you do.}}

If that's the official change, then I think it may not be a big deal at all, depending on how exactly the metallic part stands out.

My problem with this rumour is that the metallic orange shells will really stick out when compared to the flat orange that will inevitably be used on the uniforms. It's one of the (many) problems the Bucs' new look has. The jerseys and pants use this very dark, flat pewter. The pewter helmet, however, is very shiny and almost looks silver under some lighting conditions. It's supposed to be the same colour as the pewter elsewhere on the uniform but it just looks like it doesn't belong. Like it's from a different uniform set entirely.