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OnWis97

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Everything posted by OnWis97

  1. You're the guy! Oh, you already knew that I'm that guy. Current scheme = terrific. Germanic unis > all other Brewers unis. Totally agree. Once they dumped the "Motre Bame" hat in favor of "M", that was their best.
  2. Wow...I don't really agree with anything on this list (maybe somewhat on Bills and Chiefs). Nice work at long list of "unpopular". I'll add that I hate the Cartoon Bird
  3. Ice Cap's post may have implied something that it was not. Nevertheless, this all brings up something that is applicable to this thread... It is unbelievable how many cultures cover this stuff up and don't do anything about it. Penn State, The Red Sox of the 70s through ??, The Citadel, and of course the Catholic Church (just Google Pope Benedict on Child Molestation and make your own call). What do they all have in common? Horrific acts, people protecting the image of the institution, LOTS of people in the know letting the past/current/future victims down, not doing anything about it until it becomes public (and still having to be dragged kicking and screaming in some cases). In short, it is downright depressing that this is so commonplace. It makes me not think to much of people. None of us is dumb enough to think that steroids and NCAA violations have not been covered up. But I was dumb enough to think that this was different. People suck.
  4. That makes no sense. So Sparrow is saying his one good deed condemned him? Not sure what you're going for there. At any rate, here's my "decision." The "deed" in question here is a little bit bigger than just being "the one bad thing out 1000 good things" that Paterno did. It's not like Paterno preached the virtue of a clean program only to get caught having knowledge of a booster giving players money. If that were the case, then all the "don't let one slip ruin his legacy" arguments might hold some water. The problem is Paterno's "one bad deed" was turning a blind eye to a football coach who was -ing children. Doing so allowed that football coach to continue to children unabated for another 9 years. That's a pretty significant "one bad deed." There's just no way to look past it. It was a commentary about our current society. One bad deed is enough to condemn a man who otherwise lived a good life. But the opposite is not true. One good deed is not enough to salvage a man who otherwise lived a bad life. I don't know how you're not grasping this. It wasn't just one bad thing. It was over a decade of letting a pedophile rape children to save the university. And how do you know he lived a good life? Remember when we thought Jim Tressel was a great man? How do we know JoePa didn't cheat? Just because he didn't get caught, doesn't mean he didn't do it. There are lots of people supporting Paterno, there are lots of people crying foul with renaming the trophy, with firing Paterno, etc. From what we know, the only bad decision he really made was not reporting this allegation to police. Otherwise, from what we know as fans, JoePa lived a very good life, donating to the library, helping people make good decisions, etc. Except that he made that decision every day for nearly a decade.
  5. Fact or prediction? Edit: NVM, looked it up. I am surprised by the swift action of an otherwise silent B10
  6. Is Madden the radio guy from PA who said that the guy who got assaulted at the Dodgers - Giants game had it coming for wearing a Giants jersey to Dodger Stadium? Or am I thinking of someone else? That was a print guy...pretty sure not the same one.
  7. They are traveling particularly well this year; to four new conference rival towns. This game is going to be a circus.
  8. It's going to take some time to confirm it if it is true. But if so, I'd say PSU plays out the season this year and takes next year off.
  9. Exactly. And Paterno never followed up (he obviously believed McQueary, or McQueary wouldn't still be on his staff). There were at least seven grown men who knew about the rape in 2002, and nobody did anything to make sure Sandusky wouldn't do it again. Seven men, who knew that he was a child rapist and had continuing access to at-risk kids. Some of those seven men even knew that he still brought boys to the University's facilities. How many boys were raped between 2002 and last Saturday because those seven men were cowards and opportunists? If we're not vocal enough about Sandusky on this thread, it's because nobody anywhere is defending him. People are still defending that scumbag Paterno, so it's natural that Paterno would dominate our conversation here. If you don't mind, I am going to copy and paste this paragrpah and put it verbatim on replies to facebook posts of sympatheic friends...
  10. People are not perfect. And if he'd run away and panicked about what he should do for 10 minutes, an hour or whatever, I'd still call it an error in judgement, but he could have called the cops then. Yeah he'd still deserve some negative press, but at least he'd have done the right thing after "pulling himself together". Instead he was never going to say a word. I don't get it. How could you go to sleep that night, or any night thereafter, without doing what you can to make sure it does not happen again. Ultimately the right thing to do is to stop it and I totally agree with this post. You don't have to try to beat the hell out of him. Just say "uh, Jerry, whatcha doing." Jerry's reaction would be to stop and run or try to make up some phony lie...and let him run. You've got the kid; call the cops and let the justice system go to work. There's no telling how many future victims that would have saved. Not firing McQueary shows that the decision to fire Paterno was a response to pressure and that these remaining football games come first. They fired their figurehead...So what if you're a coach down? So what?
  11. Equally poor move from the Big Ten to allow PSU to finish its conference schedule. Penn State will benefit from football games yet to be played, and that ain't right. The Big Ten and the NCAA should take the moral stand no one at Penn State wad courageous enough to do. So are you saying that the players on the team DO NOT deserve to finish the season? They did nothing wrong! Do you think Penn State players even want to go out there and play for Paterno, knowing what they know now? I don't. I'd feel pretty bad for players, particularly seniors, that have to just suddenly have their season (or career) cut short. I'd rather see PSU play it out and even play in a bowl (though I don't know that a bowl will take 'em). Of course, I'd most like to see that done without the offending coaches included...I don't know enough about their staff to know how many coaches that would be. McQueary is the guy that I can't see anyone wanting to play for. I assume he won't be there on Saturday. As for Paterno, I don't know how they feel. I am on the fence. As I said, I feel bad for the players already, but I'd feel worse if they had to just stop now. On the other hand, this is unprecedented and maybe the Big Ten should have no choice. Or maybe they should say "you can play, but not with Paterno or McQueary on the sideline."
  12. This is absolutely true. Sandusky did not look like a child molester any more than any other people that had gotten away with it. So there is no way Paterno could have known here. Unless there is something different. Oh, yeah, the guy was caught in the act and Paterno was told about it.
  13. I still have a feeling he won't be coaching the final regular season game this year. If he really stays through the end of the year, assuming PSU does not win the B1G title game (which I am pretty sure they won't) it will be really interesting to see whether they end up in a Bowl. I don't know if anyone will take 'em. A traditional powerhouse that is bowl eligible and had a decent year (though have beaten nobody yet). I don't think they're going to a bowl if the house has not been cleaned by the end of the regular season (which is too bad for the senior players).
  14. On another board I saw a good quote from Herm Edwards about McQueary (though I can't find it online to back it up). Something like "When you see that, there is no protocol. You stop it immediately. If I saw that I'd be in a fist fight." And that makes him the worst of the cover up artists (along with the janitor). JoePa heard second hand (and still had, at least, a moral responsibility). This guy saw it. Even if you drop the ball at first (or if you feel you have reason to fear for your safety and you don't feel comfortable getting in the middle of it), you call the cops immediately. This is not a "work" matter. It's a "legal" matter. And I totally agree with Herm: there is no protocol. McQueary will eventually be the poster child for a lot of people that let down a lot of kids. And the more I think about it, the more I think that any upward mobility he had (as referenced in a post earlier in this thread) was an unspoken agreement for his silence...and if that's the case, Paterno was probably a central figure in making that happen.
  15. And now students are rallying outside of his house...one day, they'll look back on that with embarrassment.
  16. Sometimes a particularly bad story comes about and someone will say "I am really disheartened with humanity." We even have a thread on that in the lounge ("More proof the world is going to crap" or something). I don't often feel that way. There are some bad dudes in this world and a lot of problems, but when one mother kills her child, it does not make me think about "humanity" as there will always be bad people... But this gets me thinking that. This makes me "down on people." The more you hear, the more it seems that we are well into double digits of people in the football program/athletic department/university that had reason to believe (ranging from hearing the rampant talk to actually witnessing acts) something was up and nobody stepped up. Everyone was "covering up", "looking the other way", or "covering their own asses". THIS is what disheartens me in regards to my species. Yeah, Sandusky's the true scumbag, but every time I hear about this story, it becomes more evident that there was tacit approval and from many, many people...not one person tried to stop it. Not one person stepped up for past and future victims. It's depressing.
  17. And THAT is why I don't think there's any excuse to make for JoePa...He kept coming on campus (working with kids) and Paterno (at best) just pushed the allegations to the back of his mind.
  18. Wait... Are you saying that cheering on Penn State is the equivalent of supporting child molestation? I cannot say what I'd do. But there are players who are working just as hard as other players at other schools. These players are playing for a Rose Bowl (in theory anyway) and are worthy of being cheered on. I don't see a problem with going to the game and cheering for them. On the other hand if Paterno, McQueery, and any others named are still on the sidelines, I can see wanting to protest that.
  19. Right on both counts, I'd guess. Minnesota basketball took a long time to recover from Clem Haskins's academic scandal. Some at Wisconsin think it took the hockey team a decade to recover from it's 1992 Nat'l title game loss (specifically the subsequent on-ice meltdown in berating the refs). This makes things like that look like nuthin'. There is no longer going to be a draw to going to Penn State. No "JoePa", no "Great Legacy" as that is tarnished. Just an uneasy feeling about a culture that will sweep something like this under the rug. If I was a PSU fan/alum, I'd take a 10 to 15 year recovery if offered. They might never recover. They might become Indiana and maybe, given the culture of football in that state, move up to Purdue/Northwestern/Wisconsin status. But the "big 4" programs of the Big Ten just became the "big 3" programs for some time and maybe forever. And yes, they brought it on themselves. If Paterno (and you cannot just blame him) and the rest of the Athletic Department/University would have nipped this in the bud, the program would have taken some bad press and looked bad for a while, but ultimately, it would have been one bad apple and "kudos to JoePa and the University for addressing it swiftly and appropriately." Covering up a bar fight to try to win games is one thing, but this! They made their bed when they turned their collective head.
  20. It's either this or that he is so timid that he just wanted to tell someone "higher up" and put it out of his mind, lazily assuming that he'd done his part and justice will now be served. Either way, it is absolutely charitable to call him "irresponsible". It's just flat out wrong...he's the witness. "Chain of command" has nothing to do with it; it's a legal matter and he's a witness to a horrible crime. At this point, we're all equals (because it's the law/society, not the coaching staff) and he owed those kids more. I suppose a 3rd option is that he condoned it, but I don't think so, or he'd not have even told Joe. Pretty spineless for a 28 year old man. This wasn't a "young man" who was new at this game. He was a man, and ultimately the one who enabled Sandusky more than anyone. The janitor who witnessed Sandusky giving a blow job to one of the kids did the same thing...discussed it with his co-workers but never reported it in fear of losing his job. He was a Korean war vet who said it was as traumatizing as his stint in the war itself...and his co-workers thought he was going to have a heartattack when he was telling them. The guy is now in stages of dementia in a nursing home and isn't fit to give testimony. Wow. It seems that a lot of people were hearing about this. It must have been circulating around PSU enough to be rumor with legs...Lots of people did not want to know... This may be, in a way, the most disheartening comment on humans; that so many just kind of tried to forget about it rather than address it.
  21. It's either this or that he is so timid that he just wanted to tell someone "higher up" and put it out of his mind, lazily assuming that he'd done his part and justice will now be served. Either way, it is absolutely charitable to call him "irresponsible". It's just flat out wrong...he's the witness. "Chain of command" has nothing to do with it; it's a legal matter and he's a witness to a horrible crime. At this point, we're all equals (because it's the law/society, not the coaching staff) and he owed those kids more. I suppose a 3rd option is that he condoned it, but I don't think so, or he'd not have even told Joe.
  22. I'd be willing to give JoePa the benefit of the doubt since he only heard second hand and did the legal duty, if not for the fact that Sandusky continued using PSU facilities for the next several years. If I was in Paterno's shoes, I know I'd be terribly uncomfortable with it. And even if he had reason to believe he could not go to the cops because he thought it had run its course, his "most powerful person at PSU" status means he could have, and should have, made sure he was not working with kids at PSU facilities. That status matters there more than it does with the original incident. There are probably a lot of people (particularly the GA) that should feel horrible about the original incident, but it's Paterno that had the power to at the very least cut Sandusky off from the University. And he did not. To steal from someone else in this thread...this could, and probably should, be his legacy. This football program is going to take a big step backwards now.
  23. I detest the Orioles cartoon bird and love the full-body bird (preferably from the early 1990s, though). Generally I prefer full body animal logos (Bengals leaping tiger, Lions bubbles, Coyotes alt) and it seems most of you prefer animal head logos. Also I love the matte college baseball helmets we saw a few months ago and matte football helmets. I also prefer the Angels' silver halo to the gold one.
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