Why Wayne Gretzky was so good

[IceCap]

I just think it's nit-picking when you are talking about who's the best amongst greats.

It's not nitpicking to point out that Gretzky obliterated the record book. That's what puts him above each and every one of the other hockey greats. Orr included.

[DnBronc]

Gretzky was great, but if Lemieux had just a little bit of Walter Payton's and Jerry Rice's work ethic off the ice, nobody would have touched him as far as best ever is concerned.

[IceCap]

Gretzky was great, but if Lemieux had just a little bit of Walter Payton's and Jerry Rice's work ethic off the ice, nobody would have touched him as far as best ever is concerned.

Maybe. Possibly. We don't know, because you're discussing something that's counter-factual.

[Breakwood]

Wait so Maurice Richard hasn't been mentioned at all in this thread?

[FGM13]

1. Gretzky

2. Orr

3. Howe

4. Lemieux

5. Rocket

[sc49erfan15]

1. Dylan

2. Dylan

3. Dylan

4. Dylan

5. Dylan

He shoots hot fire.

[HotWheelsdude]

The article is bang on.

That's exactly why Gretzky was good....but not the best.

Gretzky was the great facilitator, but he needed the right supporting cast to facilitate for.

Orr and Lemieux could do it on their own.

Both would eat Gretzky in one-on-ones.

1- Orr

2- Lemieux

3- Gretzky

Gretzky...as the third greatest of all time? No, I can't buy that. The man rewrote the record book like no one before him. Lemieux and Orr? Great in their own right, but they're not better then Gretzky. Not at all.

You think? Well take a look at this:http://www.lcshockey.com/content/LCStop1001.asp, and http://www.lcshockey.com/content/LCStop1003.asp

i've actually agree with the list that LCS hockey has put. Let's think about it. While he did had great numbers, but most of greatness took place in Edmonton. He didn't put up specatular numbers like he did in Edmonton when he was with LA, St. Louis, and New York. He was a shell of former self when he reached those hights..

[habsfan1]

You think? Well take a look at this:http://www.lcshockey.com/content/LCStop1001.asp, and http://www.lcshockey.com/content/LCStop1003.asp

i've actually agree with the list that LCS hockey has put. Let's think about it. While he did had great numbers, but most of greatness took place in Edmonton. He didn't put up specatular numbers like he did in Edmonton when he was with LA, St. Louis, and New York. He was a shell of former self when he reached those hights..

In Edmonton, he had an all-star line-up to net all of his perfect passes, and received some perfect passes in return when he was in shooting position.

Mario had Jaromir Jagr, Ron Francis to an extent, and maybe one or two other guys who I forgot what their names were. Sid has Malkin.

No one reaches those heights without a good team surrounding you to produce the finishes. Still Gretzky was always the main produce. There's a reason why he has 20 something NHL records. Not Messier or MacTavish. I still give Gretzky the title of Greatest of All Time.

[The_Admiral]

i've actually agree with the list that LCS hockey has put. Let's think about it. While he did had great numbers, but most of greatness took place in Edmonton. He didn't put up specatular numbers like he did in Edmonton when he was with LA, St. Louis, and New York. He was a shell of former self when he reached those hights..

Are you going to count Lemieux's years at the end where he suited up for the Pens as an owner just to give them a better player on the roster than Rico Fata? Or Orr limping into retirement with the Black Hawks?

Gretzky's 1669 points with the Oilers would put him ninth all-time if he had retired in 1988 -- you know, if he had decided after nine seasons at age 27 that he no longer wished to play professional hockey for the rest of his life. But he did wish to play, and he averaged 1.7 points a game, or let's say about five points every three games, in eight years with Los Angeles. That's still an astounding rate of production.

Can't believe we're sitting here trying to argue for the most inarguably great player there's ever been. Some people will tell you the sky is green on a sunny day, I swear.

[The_Admiral]

Oh, and the Pittsburgh Penguins assembled their 1991 team Miami Heat-style to account for the oft-injured Lemieux, who missed 74 games over their two championship seasons, being unable to do it by himself. This spending spree ultimately led to the club's bankruptcy.

[GFB]

Exactly. There is no debate. It's Gretzky, then everyone else.

Can someone please explain to me why Orr is so loved and rated highly? Anyway, here's my top five:

1.Wayne Gretzky

2. Gordie Howe

3. Bobby Orr

4. Mario Lemieux

5. Steve Yzerman

Steve Yzerman was my hero growing up, but I think I could name 5 other Red Wings that were better than him.

[The_Admiral]

Howe, Lidstrom, Lindsay, Fedorov, and Draper, right?

[tigerslionspistonshabs]

Yea Yzerman...top 25 maybe.

1. Gretzky

2. Orr

3. Howe

4. Lemieux

5a. Beliveau

5b. Rocket

[charger77]

Exactly. There is no debate. It's Gretzky, then everyone else.

Can someone please explain to me why Orr is so loved and rated highly? Anyway, here's my top five:

1.Wayne Gretzky

2. Gordie Howe

3. Bobby Orr

4. Mario Lemieux

5. Steve Yzerman

Steve Yzerman was my hero growing up, but I think I could name 5 other Red Wings that were better than him.

Not sure there are 5 Wings better than Yzerman. I'd really need to see a cause built for him to not be the #1 Wing ever.

[The_Admiral]

I have him third behind Gordie Howe, who was hockey's all-time great before Gretzky shattered his achievements into a thousand tiny pieces, and Nicklas Lidstrom, who revolutionized the position of defenseman and dominated at said position for an incredibly long period. It's no slight on what Yzerman did. Lou Gehrig and Joe DiMaggio don't get to be the greatest Yankee, either.

[Sport]

No! He's either #1 or he sucks!

Why is it in this day you have to either love something or hate it? I think Derek Jeter was a pretty good ball player. I don't think he was the greatest Yankee ever, Jorge Posada.

I'd put Yzerman above Lidstrom on the Red Wings list, behind Gordie Howe, but I'm okay with Howe-Lidstrom-Yzerman as well.

[JayMac]

No! He's either #1 or he sucks!

Why is it in this day you have to either love something or hate it? I think Derek Jeter was a pretty good ball player. I don't think he was the greatest Yankee ever, Jorge Posada.

I'd put Yzerman above Lidstrom on the Red Wings list, behind Gordie Howe, but I'm okay with Howe-Lidstrom-Yzerman as well.

Yeah, Jeter is 5th at best. As for Stevie Y, I'd have him at 2 as well. I still feel he is better than Lidstrom.

[ElwoodCuse]

Lemieux had great teammates lol for like what, three years? And even then, the only team even close to the peak of Gretzky's Oilers is the 76 Habs. Get real.

[sparkychewbarky]

i've actually agree with the list that LCS hockey has put. Let's think about it. While he did had great numbers, but most of greatness took place in Edmonton. He didn't put up specatular numbers like he did in Edmonton when he was with LA, St. Louis, and New York. He was a shell of former self when he reached those hights..

Some people will tell you the sky is green on a sunny day, I swear.

...Kind of like you trying to convince us that Orr and Lemieux had as good as supporting casts as Gretzky had in his Oiler years.

Your bum's out the window on that one, admiral.

A few more arguments for Orr...

-2 league scoring titles (Art Ross Trophy), as a defence-man...The only D-man ever to win the Ross! I can't even think of an "other sport" comparison. Spectacular!

-The only player to win 4 major awards in one season (Hart, Ross, Norris, Conn Smythe)

-Highest single season plus/minus ever. In that season, his numbers were twice that of the second-place Bruin (Esposito)...and the only player to be the +/- leader for 6 seasons.

If Orr had played for nearly as long as Gretzky, would this even be an argument?

However, longevity is part of the equation that makes Gretzky so great, and his perimeter style of play was part of what allowed him to have that long career.

[The_Admiral]

If Orr had played for nearly as long as Gretzky, would this even be an argument?

How many angels can dance on the head of a pin? If I had taken up hockey as a kid, would I have been the best ever? I don't know. I'm working with the facts here.