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Alternate SPORTS! History Thread

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It has probably already have been asked but...

What if money never became a problem for Peter Pocklington and the Oilers were kept in tact through the early/mid-80s.

Gretzky stays longer, the Oilers win a few more cups. Without Gretzky in LA, hockey doesn't become popular in California. Perhaps Anaheim and San Jose never happen. The NHL would look a lot different.

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What if the Kansas City Scouts, Quebec Nordiques, Hartford Whalers, California Seals, Minnesota North Stars, and the original Winnipeg Jets don't move? What would today's NHL look like and what teams would replace the Sharks, Wild, and Dallas Stars?

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What if the Kansas City Scouts, Quebec Nordiques, Hartford Whalers, California Seals, Minnesota North Stars, and the original Winnipeg Jets don't move? What would today's NHL look like and what teams would replace the Sharks, Wild, and Dallas Stars?

I think Dallas gets an expansion team in that 1999-2000 quad-spansion, or even in 1991 in place of the Sharks. I would also guess Phoenix and Denver get expansions in the 90's as well.

Atlanta still fails miserably, and probably ends up moving to who knows where? Carolina? Seattle?

It has probably already have been asked but...

What if money never became a problem for Peter Pocklington and the Oilers were kept in tact through the early/mid-80s.

Gretzky stays longer, the Oilers win a few more cups. Without Gretzky in LA, hockey doesn't become popular in California. Perhaps Anaheim and San Jose never happen. The NHL would look a lot different.

The Ducks definitely don't happen. Sharks, who knows. The bay area probably gets a team at some point, but who knows how well they're received.

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What if the Kansas City Scouts, Quebec Nordiques, Hartford Whalers, California Seals, Minnesota North Stars, and the original Winnipeg Jets don't move? What would today's NHL look like and what teams would replace the Sharks, Wild, and Dallas Stars?

Sorry, but there's no way that the Scouts and Seals never move. I'm not sure how the Whalers would survive either, since they were a small market team that didn't play in the best of arena. A Southern market team probably replaces the Wild. :lol:

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What if the Houston Oilers did indeed knock on the door, beat on the door, and then kick the SOB in against Pittsburgh in the AFC title game? Big Earl "Skoal, brother" Campbell gets more than a handful of yards in the AFC title game and the Oilers go on to disrupt the Steelers dynasty? If they would've been able to beat Pittsburgh, there's a solid chance they win at least one Super Bowl. Bum Phillips would have been in Houston until he decided to retire, and the Oilers would definitely still be in Houston, in my opinion, in spite of having the worst owner in football. Luv ya blue.

Would Nashville have ever been awarded a team via expansion?

Sorry, but Art Modell had to have the title of worst owner in football. Speaking of expansion, I recently watched A Football Life: Walter Payton on NFL Network and towards the end they talked about how Sweetness, along with a group of other investors, tried to get St. Louis a football team, before the group fell apart and the NFL decided to expand instead to Jacksonville and Carolina. My question is: What would the repercussions have been if St. Louis had been awarded one of those expansion teams? Do the Rams stay in Los Angeles? Do they win a Super Bowl? Does the "Greatest Show on Turf" still come together? Would Mr. Payton have been a good team owner for St. Louis, at least before his health problems set in? Would we view his legacy differently?

I read that Jacksonville almost gave up on trying to get an expansion team sometime in the summer of 93, but decided to keep going. What if they gave up? Who gets the other team? St. Louis or Baltimore? Or, since Tags had bias against Baltimore, does Memphis come back into the fray?

Baltimore by default. St. Louis' ownership group collapsing IIRC was a result of the fundamental makeup of the group, so that seems inevitable.

I'm not sure if Memphis' plans involved replacing the Liberty Bowl, and if they didn't, that puts them behind Baltimore.

They didn't since they added the skyboxes in 1987. All they were going to do was put in another $11-15 million for club seating, but bench seating would have stayed.

Plus, after Fred Smith (of FedEx) dropped from the ownership group, the new leader signed a 30 year lease to play there which still is in effect and impacted the Oilers years there.

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What if Ray Lewis had never played football, & thus been incarcerated all this time, & thus never had the chance this week to suggest the Tuck Rule was the only reason the world knows anything at all about Tom Brady.

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How different would baseball in Philadelphia be if the A's stayed and the Phillies moved?

What if the USFL owners gave Donald Trump a resounding NO to his push for a fall schedule? How many more years could that league have lasted?

Suppose the NFL didn't give up so quickly on the original World League. Would any of the CFL's US teams have instead played in the WLAF? Would the Montreal Machine have to relocate once the Alouettes were reborn?

What if Houston had gotten the same deal for the Oilers that Cleveland got for the Browns?

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Suppose the NFL didn't give up so quickly on the original World League. Would any of the CFL's US teams have instead played in the WLAF? Would the Montreal Machine have to relocate once the Alouettes were reborn?

Baltimore Stallions moved to Montreal I think in part because the Machine were proving a semi-worthy market yes? (The Al's didn't really catch fire until Molson Stadium).

The Machine probably would've been disbanded or relocated.

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What if the 2002 Packers got the NFC's #1 seed in 2002?

Suppose the Dolphins don't blow the Patriots week 17 finale, they clinch the AFC East division, the Jets don't have anything to play for, Green Bay wins.

GB would have been the 1 seed, Philly the 2 seed, Tampa Bay instead plays Atlanta in the 3-6 WC game?

What happens in the AFC Playoffs if the Dolphins play the Colts instead of the Jets, which I assume would not have been 41-0?

What happens with the winner of that game against the Raiders/Titans?

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What if the Kansas City Scouts, Quebec Nordiques, Hartford Whalers, California Seals, Minnesota North Stars, and the original Winnipeg Jets don't move? What would today's NHL look like and what teams would replace the Sharks, Wild, and Dallas Stars?

Sorry, but there's no way that the Scouts and Seals never move. I'm not sure how the Whalers would survive either, since they were a small market team that didn't play in the best of arena. A Southern market team probably replaces the Wild. :lol:

Mel Swig, the man who took over the Seals around 1974-75, tried to get an arena built in San Fransisco, but the timing was bad (it was during a mayoral election), he didn't get it, and the Seals were moved to Cleveland. If Mel was successful, the Seals may still be in San Fran today.

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What if the Kansas City Scouts, Quebec Nordiques, Hartford Whalers, California Seals, Minnesota North Stars, and the original Winnipeg Jets don't move? What would today's NHL look like and what teams would replace the Sharks, Wild, and Dallas Stars?

Sorry, but there's no way that the Scouts and Seals never move. I'm not sure how the Whalers would survive either, since they were a small market team that didn't play in the best of arena. A Southern market team probably replaces the Wild. :lol:

Mel Swig, the man who took over the Seals around 1974-75, tried to get an arena built in San Fransisco, but the timing was bad (it was during a mayoral election), he didn't get it, and the Seals were moved to Cleveland. If Mel was successful, the Seals may still be in San Fran today.

There's no way in a freezing hell that the Seals stay in San Fran. They were a losing team, and its hard to market awfulness as a product.

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There's no way in a freezing hell that the Seals stay in San Fran. They were a losing team, and its hard to market awfulness as a product.

If the Seals' ineptitude would have prevented them from getting a new arena, here's another WI: What if the Barons would have played in Cleveland instead of in the burbs? I read somewhere that playing in a downtown Cleveland arena may have saved that team.

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There's no way in a freezing hell that the Seals stay in San Fran. They were a losing team, and its hard to market awfulness as a product.

If the Seals' ineptitude would have prevented them from getting a new arena, here's another WI: What if the Barons would have played in Cleveland instead of in the burbs? I read somewhere that playing in a downtown Cleveland arena may have saved that team.

I wonder not only who would replace the Blue Jackets as an expansion team, but also would further expansion happen if the Barons survived?

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There's no way in a freezing hell that the Seals stay in San Fran. They were a losing team, and its hard to market awfulness as a product.

If the Seals' ineptitude would have prevented them from getting a new arena, here's another WI: What if the Barons would have played in Cleveland instead of in the burbs? I read somewhere that playing in a downtown Cleveland arena may have saved that team.

I wonder not only who would replace the Blue Jackets as an expansion team, but also would further expansion happen if the Barons survived?

Well, I think that the Sharks may not have happened if the Barons survive (didn't their merger with Minnesota involve the Gund's and a promise of a new team in the future?).

Also, in the late-90's expansions, maybe the Hampton Roads Rhinos come to be, or a team in Houston (those were two other candidates for expansion at the time) happens if there is no Columbus team.

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If Gary Kubiak wouldn't have been retained in Houston at the end of the 2010 season, he would have been Elway's first HC as Bronco GM.

With Kubiak there, Rick Dennison is probably their OC, not Mike McCoy. Also, he probably would have brought Wade Phillips with him to be the DC.

A big issue would have been how Gary would have handled Tim Tebow because Elway probably would have wanted him to play so they could have tanked to get Luck.

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Would we still be talking about the "Miracle on Ice" if the U.S. lost their last game against Finland, after beating the Soviets, and did not get the Gold Medal?

That's a good question. Some people still think that was for the gold.

I think we'd still be talking about it not quite as much and a different tone. "A bunch of college kids beat the Soviets, the greatest team in the world, in 1980...but unfortunately lost the next game and were not able to win the gold."

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What if the 1994 Expos are able to play in the World Series that year, but they lose?

Yeah, I'm not full on some defacto '94 Yankees v Expos WS as if no other team would get in their way.

Semi-tangent question: how popular would Major League Baseball be today if the 1994 strike never occurs (or even did occur but resolved in time for the 1994 postseason to play out)? Would there still be Super Bowl-like ratings for the World Series as were the case in the 1970s/1980s? Would media coverage of MLB be to the levels of the NBA and NFL of today (unlike the actual case of the "neglected red-haired stepchild" baseball coverage has been against football and basketball)? Would the saga of ramped and silenced steroid use in the late-1990s still occur to bring back fans to the game? Would the Yankees, Red Sox, Giants and Cardinals still get the disproportionate amount of media love and interest they actually get today? Would FOX (and to a lesser extent, TBS) even broadcast MLB to begin with (i.e. would the ill-fated Baseball Network venture of the league and ABC/NBC still have television rights today)?

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When Magic Johnson came out for the draft in 1979, the Bulls and Lakers (with a pick from the Jazz in the Gail Goodrich trade) flipped for the #1 pick.

1. What if the Bulls won that flip, and got Magic?

2. What if the Lakers drafted Sidney Moncrief (the coach or GM wanted to, but owner Jerry Buss told them to take Magic)?

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Would we still be talking about the "Miracle on Ice" if the U.S. lost their last game against Finland, after beating the Soviets, and did not get the Gold Medal?

That's a good question. Some people still think that was for the gold.

I think we'd still be talking about it not quite as much and a different tone. "A bunch of college kids beat the Soviets, the greatest team in the world, in 1980...but unfortunately lost the next game and were not able to win the gold."

I think we'd still celebrate the miracle, but completely gloss over the fact that they lost the next game. For instance, look at Aaron Boone's extra inning walk-off in 2003 - it won the Yankees a pennant, but they lost the World Series. It's still celebrated, and would be more so had the Red Sox not won the next year. Carlton Fisk's walk-off in 1975 is one of the most famous moments in baseball history, and it was entirely futile in retrospect since the Red Sox lost the next game.

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Suppose Major League baseball was aligned like this by 1970....

AL East

Atlanta Firebirds (Formerly replacement Washington Senators 1961-69)

Boston Red Sox

Cleveland Indians

Detroit Tigers

New York Yankees

Philadelphia Athletics

AL West

Chicago White Sox

Denver Zephyrs (1969 Expansion)

Kansas City Royals (1961 Expansion)

Los Angeles Angels (Since 1954; Formerly Washington Senators 1901-53)

San Francisco Seals (Since 1954; Formerly Milwaukee Brewers 1901, St Louis Browns 1902-53)

Texas Rangers (1969 Expansion)

NL East

Baltimore Orioles (Since 1946; Formerly Philadelphia Phillies 1883-1945)

Brooklyn Dodgers

Cincinnati Reds

Minnesota Giants (Since 1957; Formerly New York 1883-1956)

Montreal Expos (1969 Expansion)

Pittsburgh Pirates

NL West

Chicago Cubs

Hollywood Stars (1962 Expansion)

Houston Astros (1962 Expansion)

Milwaukee Braves (Since 1953; Formerly Boston 1871-1952)

Seattle Pilots (1969 Expansion)

St Louis Cardinals

Would the landscape of baseball be radically different from then on?

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