NFL Merry-Go-Round: Relocation Roundelay

[IceCap]

Your thoughts on the move.

Already being discussed, merging topics.

[IceCap]

Team relocation sucks, and I don't support it. There was a time in sports, and this time still exists in some sports, where a professional team would lose money. In those case, sometimes relocation becomes necessarily considered. But relocation for the sake of gaining more money or to avoid spending money (on a stadium) or whatever financial greed is involved? That sucks. Because someone always gets screwed.

Kroenke is actually spending more money on his LA stadium than he would be if he accepted the St. Louis stadium proposal.

Again, Kroenke is doing what any sane, sensible sports fan has wanted to see from a billionaire owner. Spend his own money on a new stadium. He's not fleecing Inglewood. He's building his own stadium on his own land. The problem you have is that he's not doing it in your city. I get it, as a fan that sucks, but casting Stan Kroenke as greedy or selfish is just silly.

Relocation sucks. I don't wish dealing with it on anyone, whether it benefits me or not.

And yet sometimes it yields net gains. The Thrashers went from struggling Sunbelt afterthought to a team that didn't even need NHL revenue sharing in a small Canadian prairie city a fraction the size of Atlanta.

So maybe you need to re-evaluate this "I'm against relocation no matter what!" attitude. It certainly isn't pleasant, but it is sometimes necessary for both the team and the league in question. There's no doubt in my mind that the Rams will be worth more in LA than they were in St. Louis. Just like the NFL as a whole is better off with LA than it is with St. Louis.

(I will say that I don't think the Rams moving back to LA rights a wrong. I'm happy for Los Angeles fans who got a team back. Their team even. But there was nothing right about this. It's just one wrong on top of another.)

Sorry, no. I would have agreed about it just being one more wrong on top of another if, say, the Bills or Vikings moved out to LA. The Rams though? Not so much. They were the team stolen in the first place. Returning them to Los Angeles is very much righting a wrong.

[STL FANATIC]

Ice, I'm not going to get in a prolonged argument with you. You're completely wrong, though. You're misrepresenting my views, and it pisses me off. (No joke, I just threw something.)

You have no right to question my motives and integrity. I've been nothing but consistent on this.

As for Kroenke, your head is in the sand if you think he's not doing this for money. And no sensible sports fan is asking for every team owner to relocate to build his own stadium. Sports as a major business would DIE if that became the norm, and it wouldn't be because the owners were spending their own money. It would be because fans would stop spending any of theirs.

[JayMac]

So now that it's over...this ends the list of teams that were contemplating the move dating back to the late 90s. Off the top of my head (even if they were just crazy rumors) and in no particular order:

Seahawks

Jaguars

Eagles (I think, when Lurie took over)

Vikings

Bills

Saints (?)

Raiders

Chargers (still will probably happen)

Any others?

[Gothamite]

I've been very vocal in my dislike for relocation in general. But if there was ever one that could be justified, it's this one (and if there was ever another, it would be Raiders to Oakland in '95). Very rarely do fans get their team back, and when they do it's something special. Doesn't take the sting out for St. Louis, but I'm looking for a bright side.

Oh, yeah - and the Tampa Bay Rays. That is legitimately a failed market, not just the victim of an owner's avarice.

As for Kroenke, your head is in the sand if you think he's not doing this for money.

Of course he is. As Georgia did before him.

[STL FANATIC]

I've been very vocal in my dislike for relocation in general. But if there was ever one that could be justified, it's this one (and if there was ever another, it would be Raiders to Oakland in '95). Very rarely do fans get their team back, and when they do it's something special. Doesn't take the sting out for St. Louis, but I'm looking for a bright side.

I agree with the notion that "if there was ever one." I wasn't lying when I said I was genuinely happy for the LA fans who got their team back. (Maybe less so for the ones who were jackasses to St. Louis along the way, but still.)

But The simple fact is that there just aren't any relocations of profitable teams that are justifiable.

So yes, getting a franchise back to a city that was victim of an unjustifiable move is better than others. But it ain't good.

[rams80]

So now that it's over...this ends the list of teams that were contemplating the move dating back to the late 90s. Off the top of my head (even if they were just crazy rumors) and in no particular order:

Seahawks

Jaguars

Eagles (I think, when Lurie took over)

Vikings

Bills

Saints (?)

Raiders

Chargers (still will probably happen)

Any others?

Colts also threatened to move in the mid-2000s in order to get a new stadium.

[Gothamite]

Jets too. But nobody believed them, any more than we believed the Colts.

I do think you're a little hung up on the "profitable" thing. Because if I'm mildly profitable, and I'm competing against others who are wildly profitable, then my meager profits, while good, aren't good enough. So yes, I see why owners feel compelled to keep up with the Jones (as it were). I just ask that they pay for it themselves.

And sure, there were LA fans trolling St. Louis during this process. And that's disgraceful. But none of them have their city's Hall of Fame vote, which makes them significantly less harmful.

[STL FANATIC]

Bit of a forced attack on Mr. Miklasz, I think.

[Gothamite]

Too subtle?

He deserves every word of it, the scumbag. His behavior has been indefensible, all the more because he's been entrusted with a profound responsibility.

He's making noises about resigning that role. If and when he does, I'll give him full credit. Until then he's a hypocrite and a deliberate troll.

[colortv]

If Spanos goes to LA, I'd imagine he and Kroenke would team up to muster the 9 votes needed to block any team moving to San Diego, just like I imagine Mcnair and Jerry Jones would do the same for San Antonio.

[infrared41]

Ice, I'm not going to get in a prolonged argument with you. You're completely wrong, though. You're misrepresenting my views, and it pisses me off. (No joke, I just threw something.)

No joke, someone needs to step away from the computer and pour himself a nice tall glass of "I'm taking an internet forum far too seriously" ale. (Chasing it with a healthy shot of Jack wouldn't be the worst idea either)

[BlackBolt3]

So now that it's over...this ends the list of teams that were contemplating the move dating back to the late 90s. Off the top of my head (even if they were just crazy rumors) and in no particular order:

Seahawks

Jaguars

Eagles (I think, when Lurie took over)

Vikings

Bills

Saints (?)

Raiders

Chargers (still will probably happen)

Any others?

The Panthers briefly did back in 2012, presumably to get the stadium renovations that have been made. It didn't get much farther than DOR (Dusty Ol Richardson) saying he might move the team, but the Charlotte city council knew he was lying. This literally lasted about 2 days.

[IceCap]

Ice, I'm not going to get in a prolonged argument with you. You're completely wrong, though. You're misrepresenting my views, and it pisses me off. (No joke, I just threw something.)

You have no right to question my motives and integrity. I've been nothing but consistent on this.

As for Kroenke, your head is in the sand if you think he's not doing this for money. And no sensible sports fan is asking for every team owner to relocate to build his own stadium. Sports as a major business would DIE if that became the norm, and it wouldn't be because the owners were spending their own money. It would be because fans would stop spending any of theirs.

I'm sorry. I'm not trying to deliberately "misinterpret" your position. Or question your integrity. This really is just a case of me calling it as I see it.

I admitted that profit is a factor for Kroenke. How the team is worth more playing in LA, even if he does spend his own money on the stadium. There's no doubt in my mind that he's moving the team to LA because he sees dollar signs there. My point is that he's doing so, getting his big LA payday, without fleecing a single tax paying citizen. The choice for the Rams came down to a plan in Inglewood that was entirely privately financed or a plan in St. Louis that required a substantial burden on the part of the tax payers. The former won. And that's enough to make this a victory, in my opinion.

All in all? Things worked out.

LA got the team that was stolen from them two decades ago.

St. Louis is now off the hook when it comes to spending millions upon millions on a stadium for a billionaire. If they're dead set on spending some of that money on a stadium? They're free to re-work the stadium plan into a much more affordable soccer specific stadium to try and get a MLS team.

The Chargers and Raiders' joint stadium plan on a toxic waste dump is killed. Sure, one may still move to LA but the AFC West remains unified.

The NFL has indicated they're willing to help both the Chargers and Raiders secure new stadium deals in San Diego and Oakland if both end up staying. Even if one heads north to become LA2? The other can still count on assistants from the league.

The only people who lost outright were St. Louis Rams fans, but someone was always going to lose. The result we got limited that damage to a single fanbase. Tempered by the fact that the city' support for the team seemed to be eroding by the week.

[The_Admiral]

I wanna know what STL Fanatic threw.

[infrared41]

I wanna know what STL Fanatic threw.

His Kurt Warner bobblehead.

[tp49]

I wanna know what STL Fanatic threw.

A Lawrence Phillips bobblehead.

[infrared41]

I wanna know what STL Fanatic threw.

A Lawrence Phillips bobblehead.

Yeah, yours is better.

[dfwabel]

I wanna know what STL Fanatic threw.

Empty bottle of Vermeil Wines. Probably the 2012 XXXIV.

http://vermeilwines.com/buywines?orderby=PXPC.DisplayOrder%20Asc%2C%20P.ProductName%20ASC&startrow=1

[CubsFanBudMan]

Ice, I'm not going to get in a prolonged argument with you. You're completely wrong, though. You're misrepresenting my views, and it pisses me off. (No joke, I just threw something.)

No joke, someone needs to step away from the computer and pour himself a nice tall glass of "I'm taking an internet forum far too seriously" ale. (Chasing it with a healthy shot of Jack wouldn't be the worst idea either)

I'm going to have to politely agree here, STL FANATIC. Would you please log off, find Dayton Blue and show him the town?

I'm worried about you two. The NFL is dead now, so hit up Ballpark Village or Laclede's or a Blues game or Imo's. Be the wing man he deserves.

Support an owner who stands behind his town in tough times:

http://m.stltoday.com/sports/hockey/professional/blues-owner-stillman-disagrees-with-rams-view-of-st-louis/article_6c9923fb-906c-5e42-befe-c6f5f765019e.html?mobile_touch=true

Tom Stillman would never rip a team out from under its fanbase.... *cough* Peoria. (Excuse me.)

As LGB! said above, LGB!