NFL Merry-Go-Round: Relocation Roundelay

[dfwabel]

4 minutes ago, tp49 said:

According to what I've read in the RJ today (which is owned by Adelson) the CVA is going ahead with the demolition of the Rivera and the Convention Center expansion is still on.  That said, the Rivera site looks too small to fit a football stadium on and I would think Cashman Center downtown would be the same.  The more interesting site would be the festival grounds across LV Boulevard from SLS which would hopefully bring the added benefit of spurring development on the north strip.

 

And who owns the festival parcel?

 

Adelson's nemesis, MGM. 

[tp49]

Just now, dfwabel said:

 

And who owns the festival parcel?

 

Adelson's nemesis, MGM. 

Exactly, which is why I found the statement of the MGM Resorts president in the article you posted the link to interesting because I couldn't imagine MGM and Sands cooperating on this.

[Gothamite]

Yeah, MGM has openly opposed the Sands plan so far.  

[DG_ThenNowForever]

I've been to Vegas once (which is enough), but I have a basic geography question. The Riviera site is on the strip, right?

 

That area is fully congested and barely walkable now. Adding 70,000 people to the mix - several of whom will drive - seems like a disastrous idea. There aren't great transit options, though the Deuce could be improved and/or expanded.

 

I don't know. For as dense as the strip seems, there's actually some space around it. However, moving around in Vegas, whether by cab or bus or foot, is kind of a drag. 

 

Also Nevada is a desert and climate change is real and maybe we ought to instead direct limited natural resources away from entertainment complexes. Just an idea.

[dfwabel]

21 minutes ago, DG_Now said:

I've been to Vegas once (which is enough), but I have a basic geography question. The Riviera site is on the strip, right?

 

That area is fully congested and barely walkable now. Adding 70,000 people to the mix - several of whom will drive - seems like a disastrous idea. There aren't great transit options, though the Deuce could be improved and/or expanded.

 

I don't know. For as dense as the strip seems, there's actually some space around it. However, moving around in Vegas, whether by cab or bus or foot, is kind of a drag. 

 

Also Nevada is a desert and climate change is real and maybe we ought to instead direct limited natural resources away from entertainment complexes. Just an idea.

The Riviera was at the far north end of The Strip.

 

Here is a map of properties for more perspective. FULL IMAGE

 

 

The original site talked about, which is owned by UNLV is in between the MGM Grand and the Hard Rock.

 

Note: As for the "WWF Hotel", it was property formerly owned by actress Debbie Reynolds which they bought in foreclosure in 1998 and owned it until 2000.  It became a Clarion and was open until late 2014. 

[tp49]

2 hours ago, DG_Now said:

I've been to Vegas once (which is enough), but I have a basic geography question. The Riviera site is on the strip, right?

 

That area is fully congested and barely walkable now. Adding 70,000 people to the mix - several of whom will drive - seems like a disastrous idea. There aren't great transit options, though the Deuce could be improved and/or expanded.

 

I don't know. For as dense as the strip seems, there's actually some space around it. However, moving around in Vegas, whether by cab or bus or foot, is kind of a drag. 

 

Also Nevada is a desert and climate change is real and maybe we ought to instead direct limited natural resources away from entertainment complexes. Just an idea.

What you say is very true for the strip south of Sands Avenue.  North of there outside of the Wynn it's a desolate wasteland up to Sahara save for Circus Circus, SLS and a couple of condo/time share developments.  They've been trying to develop the north end of the strip for a long while now.  There are allegedly two resorts under construction (Resorts World and something else but the name escapes me) but as of last month when I was last in Vegas (and I go about 4-5 times a year) there isn't any construction equipment on the sites at all.  Then there's the almost completed Fountainbleau tower which was a proposed site for an arena years back, which is almost completed but hasn't had any actual construction for a few years as the project went bust.

 

There is also a new bus service to compliment The Deuce called the SDX which is a bit faster and for those so inclined there is the monorail.  As for driving in the area it's been known for years that if you want to get anywhere fast on the strip you have the cabbie go up Koval for the east side of Frank Sinatra/Industrial for the west side.

 

I'll say this about Las Vegas and professional sports, if there was any league that would have success there I think it would be the NFL.  Whenever I'm in Vegas on a Sunday during the NFL season it seems that damn near everyone walking around has a jersey on.  I don't think the Raiders or any other team would have difficulty selling out games due to the limited number of dates even if the people going were more there to see a road team.  To me outside of the usual issues relating to building a project of this magnitude in an urban area (funding, site location, property acquisition, etc.) the biggest problem would be competition to fill the remaining dates.  In contrast, I think the NHL in Las Vegas will be the Glendale Coyotes 2, unless the owner knows up front he's not going to be profitable and use the losses as a tax break.

[WSU151]

2 hours ago, DG_Now said:

Also Nevada is a desert and climate change is real and maybe we ought to instead direct limited natural resources away from entertainment complexes. Just an idea.

Addressed in this article.   

 

 

[Gothamite]

Well, kinda.  Even if we take all her assertions as fact. 

 

Yes, it's great that they recycle so much water.  And that they had the foresight to institute regulations so long ago. But they still have outsized consumption even so.  And that article doesn't address rising temperatures and the problem that will cause; drought is far from the only challenge climate change poses. 

[WSU151]

edit: there are a lot of factors to be considered in the area's water supply, moreso than just overconsumption and climate change.

[dfwabel]

The original Riviera Hotel tower was imploded on Monday night/Tuesday morning.  The second tower will be imploded later this summer. 

[4_tattoos]

Does the NHL's probable expansion to Las Vegas have any sort of effect on the Raiders relocating there? Whether it be positive or negative.

[dfwabel]

1 hour ago, 4_tattoos said:

Does the NHL's probable expansion to Las Vegas have any sort of effect on the Raiders relocating there? Whether it be positive or negative.

No.

 

The Raiders stadium project is contingent on the Nevada legislature applying part of the current hotel bed tax towards the project. The Southern Nevada Tourism Infrastructure Committee, commissioned by the governor, will recommend which project(s) to fund on or before July 31. However, legislature will discuss the options next year because they meet every other year.

 

Plus, Mark Davis needs to illustrate he has $300M+ for his side of stadium and team facility costs outside of the NFL's loan of $200M.

 

[Gothamite]

New details on that scumbag Adelson's plan to fleece Vegas:

 

Billionaire Sheldon Adelson wants Las Vegas to ante up the biggest subsidy in professional football history to lure the Oakland Raiders to the gambling mecca. 

The chief executive of Las Vegas Sands Corp., the world’s largest casino company, teamed up with developer Majestic Realty Co. to propose a 65,000-seat domed stadium for the National Football League team. A committee of government leaders and casino executives met Thursday to review the plan, which would raise $750 million for the coliseum with a new tax on hotel stays.

...

Nevada Governor Brian Sandoval’s top economic adviser suggested scaling back the public contribution to $500 million while increasing the private-sector share to $900 million. Steve Hill, who heads Sandoval’s office of economic development, introduced the rival plan at Thursday’s meeting of the Southern Nevada Tourism Infrastructure Committee, said Jennifer Cooper, his spokeswoman. Hill’s proposal could come up for a vote July 11, she said.

 

Seriously,  that guy.  Kroenke has shown the way - pay for your own damn stadiums. 

 

 

[DarkJourney]

Didn't that asswipe Adelson also buy the Las Vegas Review-Journal to quiet their views on taxpayers not funding stadiums. 

[dfwabel]

The state did upload all the alternative funding plans, all of which are under consideration to recommend to the governor.

 

http://www.sntic.org/meeting/11/Stadium/aguero/SNTIC Stadium Alternative Proposal Presentation FINAL.pdf

[dfwabel]

4 hours ago, Gothamite said:

New details on that scumbag Adelson's plan to fleece Vegas:

 

Billionaire Sheldon Adelson wants Las Vegas to ante up the biggest subsidy in professional football history to lure the Oakland Raiders to the gambling mecca. 

The chief executive of Las Vegas Sands Corp., the world’s largest casino company, teamed up with developer Majestic Realty Co. to propose a 65,000-seat domed stadium for the National Football League team. A committee of government leaders and casino executives met Thursday to review the plan, which would raise $750 million for the coliseum with a new tax on hotel stays.

...

Nevada Governor Brian Sandoval’s top economic adviser suggested scaling back the public contribution to $500 million while increasing the private-sector share to $900 million. Steve Hill, who heads Sandoval’s office of economic development, introduced the rival plan at Thursday’s meeting of the Southern Nevada Tourism Infrastructure Committee, said Jennifer Cooper, his spokeswoman. Hill’s proposal could come up for a vote July 11, she said.

 

Seriously,  that guy.  Kroenke has shown the way - pay for your own damn stadiums. 

 

 

Also note that the Raiders and Mark Davis' share is still little out of pocket.

 

The Majestic proposal says the Raiders' share is $410M, but between NFL G-4 money, the $100M from not moving to L.A., and assumed PSL net proceeds, dude's not going to pay much but his relocation fee and the cost of a practice facility.

 

 

[Gothamite]

The $100M is only for teams that stay in their markets.  So Davis wouldn't get that. 

 

We would, however, get to count naming rights money against his share of the costs.  Which is abhorrent but also somehow standard practice. 

[dfwabel]

15 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

The $100M is only for teams that stay in their markets.  So Davis wouldn't get that. 

 

We would, however, get to count naming rights money against his share of the costs.  Which is abhorrent but also somehow standard practice. 

For now.

[Gothamite]

Yeah, but if Vegas is countering with half a billion dollars in public money, they're obviously not going to buck the system and demand a rethinking of current practice.  

[dfwabel]

6 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

Yeah, but if Vegas is countering with half a billion dollars in public money, they're obviously not going to buck the system and demand a rethinking of current practice.  

There is a $90M difference in what the Majestic proposal was and the SNTIC alternative is with more money towards the Raiders.  The proposals also include what UNLV would pay as well.