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NFL Merry-Go-Round: Relocation Roundelay


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2 hours ago, dfwabel said:

Arlington (Tarrant) and Frisco, TX (northern Collin County) are very willing to do it as a way to keep from adding the DART light rail tax. San Jose was ready for the Athletics. But Atlanta and other parts of the south seem happy to cough up $$$ too since Birmingham will build a 50K stadium for UAB to replace Legion Field who draws much less.

 

No kidding. It feels like we can't be too far from the Birmingham Bills, Tulsa Jaguars or Omaha Seahawks. Smaller cities will bypass monorails and go straight to bad stadium deals. It's coming.

1 hour ago, ShutUpLutz! said:

and the drunken doodoobags jumping off the tops of SUV's/vans/RV's onto tables because, oh yeah, they are drunken drug abusing doodoobags

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Speaking as a Utahan, I'm particularly interested in the Raiders move to Vegas because of how many fans it could potentially attract from Utah. Though Broncos territory, I do have a few friends who are die-hard Raider fans already and the team certainly has a decent small following in the area. 

 

Of course that's not the big market they're going for and I don't intend to make it sound like a bigger deal than it is, but I do think the Raiders would be really smart to advertise to Utah fans and see if they can sway those in the state who don't have a particular team. They'll be able to claim that they're the closest team in proximity now (and I'm positive that will matter - much easier to catch an NFL game there than Denver or Glendale), and if they are still competitive by then, may be all the more appealing overall. Plus, any little bits and pieces you can chip out of Broncos territory can't hurt.

 

I can't speak for how the areas in California closer to Vegas would sway (or how many are Raider fans already), but let's say you get a decent following in those areas, are solid in Nevada, and then get a better following in Utah? Not bad territory coverage geographically. Maybe you don't necessarily need it if you're the Raiders, but hey if it's there, why not go for it?

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51 minutes ago, DG_Now said:

 

No kidding. It feels like we can't be too far from the Birmingham Bills, Tulsa Jaguars or Omaha Seahawks. Smaller cities will bypass monorails and go straight to bad stadium deals. It's coming.

However, that doesn't mean one was a "major league city" in 1930 doesn't make one a "major league" in 2017. Folks have migrated south.

 

Does Milwaukee still deserve the Bucks and Brewers as opposed to no team in say, Virginia or South Carolina?

 

The whole "Major League City" tag is essentially East Coast bias and Pilgrims landed in Massachusetts.

 

And the thing is Arlington Texas always seems to pay off the debt EARLY!

http://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/community/arlington/article77646132.html

Edited by dfwabel
Cowboys Stadium debt
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10 hours ago, Cosmic said:

WHAT

 

The noise during that moment of "silence" would have registered at the local earthquake monitoring station.

Yep. When Modell died, the NFL announced, unilaterally, that there would be a moment of silence in every stadium that weekend. Well, the Browns were hosting a game that weekend. And the Browns, even realizing it was a horrible idea, tried to get the NFL to let them out of doing it. But, the NFL insisted the Browns have a moment of silence. The fans were livid. Whether the NFL really were persuaded by the Modell's or not, they used the Browns fans as some sort of heathens and propped the Modell Family up as some paragon of righteousness by saying the Modell's had asked the NFL not to require the Browns to have a moment of silence because they didn't want any 'issues'.

 

So, rather than letting teams do their own thing, one team was about to be forced to do something 99% of their fan base would disapprove. Something the team knew was trouble and didn't want to do. Then, when the NFL realized their brazen mistake, passed it off as some magnanimous act by the Modell's.

 

And yes, had they went through with it, it would've been the loudest boos the stadium had ever heard.

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12 hours ago, DG_Now said:

 

The best "new" stadium is Hard Rock Cafe in Miami, in part because it was the right combo of thrift, elegance, and focusing on the field. When taxpayers are removed from the equation, teams can spend wisely and still manage to come up with good solutions to stadium problems.

 

I don't know how we get there, but all teams following the Miami remodel-model would be nice.

 

Don't forget Kroenke and his Inglewood palace. Whether or not he can get the Rams to relevance remains to be seen, but he's building it on his own dime as well.

 

And to add my 2¢ into this discussion: It sure feels a lot like the 1996 all over again, doesn't it? Within the span of 12 months, we've had 2 teams relocate and a 3rd most likely will be settling into their new digs after a 2-year limbo. We'll have to see if the Raiders try to pull an Oilers (hopefully without a renaming at the end of it) and just rip off the band aid if one lame-duck season in Oakland becomes one too many (provided they get approved to move).

 

As for the moves themselves, the Rams reclaiming Los Angeles as their home is easily the one move of these 3 making the most sense, restoring LA's longest-tenured NFL team to the city that it made its rightful home (50 seasons in LA as opposed to 9 in Cleveland and 21 in St. Louis), and all without any major taxpayer contributions.

 

The next one down is the Raiders going to Las Vegas. While I certainly despise the city (and state, IIRC) giving up $750M to build a stadium, besides that I can at least see the logic behind it: Las Vegas is an event town, the NFL is an event league (no more than about 10 home games in a playoff year), Mark Davis fits in as a Las Vegas businessman,* and the Raiders (will) still have a large and loyal following in California and nationwide--anyone who's driven on Interstate 15 between Las Vegas and southern California during the weekends can attest to how it becomes a parking lot for miles on end. Given that they would be staying in the same general region as California (instead of going to, say, San Antonio), they can keep much of their fanbase, as sports fans in Las Vegas historically tend to be California-based (Lakers, Dodgers, LA Kings, etc.). Also, as fellow Utahan (Utahn?) @FinsUp1214 said, the Raiders could possibly market to parts of Utah and Nevada due to proximity.**Don't get me wrong, and I'd hate to see them leave Oakland again, and it is a big gamble (no pun intended) given the economic situation in Las Vegas. The Raiders will have to push that regional fanbase hard if they want long-term success (because they won't be getting it from Las Vegas alone), but for all the reasons I listed above, if any pro team can work out in Las Vegas, it's the Raiders.

 

And the worst move of them all is clearly the Chargers going to Los Angeles. Now, I will say that there was a time where moving to LA could've been a reasonable, relatively painless move for the Chargers--they may have even kept some goodwill towards San Diego by playing the "regional team" card. That time was around 10-15 years ago, when Georgia Frontiere was still alive and the last thing the St. Louis Rams, their fanbase, and pretty much any other NFL franchise and fanbase had on their mind was a move to Los Angeles (aside from empty threats). What did Dean Spanos do then? Really, nothing, except the insistence that the Chargers need a downtown stadium and that the city needed to foot the bill. Once Madame Ram passed away and her heirs divested themselves of the team? Same rhetoric. When Stan Kroenke bought the majority of the team and a few years later bought the Hollywood Park site? Same rhetoric, maybe a little louder, but still, no new ideas. When Kroenke kicked the St. Louis endgame into gear? Spanos writes a letter complaining how the Rams want to move back into a region they abandoned 21 years prior while partnering with the owner of the other team that abandoned the same region 21 years prior and would thusly be abandoning the first region said other team abandoned 34 years ago and oh no I think I've gone cross-eyed. When the Rams were approved for relocation to Los Angeles via Inglewood instead of Spanos' Chargers and Mark Davis' Raiders via Carson? Still, pretty much the same old "I won't pay for it, you will, San Diego" rhetoric for a stadium that went to a vote in November 2016--and was turned down rather emphatically by San Diegans. With about a week to go before the relocation deadline and with some hope that something might, just might, get done in San Diego? Spanos drops the sports-team-owner's equivalent of Ron Burgundy's on-air f-bomb, except he has enough self-awareness that he knew what happened, then has the gall to come up with the new, ironic tagline "Fight for LA," which he never did when LA could've all been his and when he never fought for San Diego (like @Lights Out has basically said). On top of that, he spurns San Diego for ultimately playing second fiddle to the Rams and, before that, playing second fiddle to an MLS team with MLS crowds. Say what you will about Mark Davis and the Raiders in Las Vegas, at least he has enough of his father's vision to not play second fiddle to anyone.

 

*Already looking like a tracksuit-wearing, Las Vegas-based Kathy Geiss and appears to be a couple years away from OCD with levels comparable to that of Howard Hughes.

**Even if most NFL fans in Utah tend to be Broncos and 49ers fans, the option to shave 100 miles off a road trip to Denver or 300 to San Francisco could lure in quite a lot fans from there.

 

 

Edited by DustDevil61
Added diatribe on Spanos/LA Chargers and thoughts on Las Vegas Raiders and Los Angeles Rams
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17 hours ago, FinsUp1214 said:

Speaking as a Utahan, I'm particularly interested in the Raiders move to Vegas because of how many fans it could potentially attract from Utah.

Commitment To Posthumously Baptizing Jews

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♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫

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55 minutes ago, the admiral said:

Commitment To Posthumously Baptizing Jews

 

Well this isn't the place for a religious discussion, so I'm just gonna leave that one be.

 

My only point in bringing up Utah was that, the way I see it, a Raiders move to Vegas absolutely affects football fans here. I'm a Colts fan, so the Raiders wouldn't necessarily sway me, but if I want to finally catch an NFL game, its a whole lot easier to get to Vegas from here than it is to get to Denver, Phoenix, SF or LA (and most certainly, in my case, Indianapolis). I feel like many football fans would come to the same conclusion, but also, many may even take interest in the Raiders for good. 

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there's something about the thought of the black hole being comprised of mormons wearing paint and spikes that makes me simultaneously laugh and cry.

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"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."

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4 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

there's something about the thought of the black hole being comprised of mormons wearing paint and spikes that makes me simultaneously laugh and cry.

It's the magic underwear but with spikes and a leather jacket and instead of threatening to shiv you he just tries to sell you boxes and boxes of essential oils.

♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫

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14 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

there's something about the thought of the black hole being comprised of mormons wearing paint and spikes that makes me simultaneously laugh and cry.

Imagine the tailgating.  Lots of milk and green Jell-o being pounded.

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15 hours ago, Wings said:

So the Raiders expect to be in Vegas by 2020. So that's 3 lame duck seasons in Oakland. I hope they win a Super Bowl during that time and make it really awkward. 

 

2-3 lame duck years does appear to be their plan for now. But I have a feeling that will change. The NFL's history is littered with reasons you do not play lame duck years, worst example being the Oilers last year in Houston. Given they've allowed the Chargers to play in a 27,000 seat soccer stadium, I have a feeling Sam Boyd Stadium will end up looking mighty appealing.

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On 1/14/2017 at 3:21 PM, JQK said:

Any chance the owners vote against the Raiders move, considering the Ronnie Lott plan, as far as I understand, is still on the table?

 

Yeah the NFL has described the Lott plan and Oakland as "unsalvageable" so I'm not thinking that will be much of an impediment.

 

Meanwhile in Los Angeles, Dean Spanos got the welcome he deserved. I don't often give LA fans kudos, but in this case I will. Boos for the team and Chargers players from the LA fan base. And Dean Spanos there to see it all

 

http://thebiglead.com/2017/01/14/los-angeles-chargers-logo-gets-booed-relentlessly-at-lakers-clippers-game/

 

Also this weekend more kudos to the San Diego and Los Angeles area movers who have both informed the Chargers they will not be moving his football team for him. Time to rent a bunch of U-Hauls Dean.

 

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/sports/San-Diego-Companies-Refuse-to-Move-Chargers-to-LA-410785025.html

 

 

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