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North American Pro Soccer 2016


Gothamite
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22 hours ago, Gothamite said:

 

 

"Pro soccer" maybe, but far from a done deal that they will get MLS.  They all need to firm up their ownership groups, with the exception of San Antonio, and they all need SSS deals in place. 

 

Sacramento is the only one ready to make the move.  Detroit, St. Louis and San Antonio have a very long way to go, and could easily be leapfrogged by another market if they meet the criteria first. 

Detroit has viable owners who are currently trying to buy a downtown location to start stadium construction. Tom Gores(Detroit Pistons Owner) and Dan Gilbert (Cleveland Cavaliers Owner) have teamed up in an effort to bring the MLS to Detroit.

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On 5/2/2016 at 11:54 PM, 2001mark said:

 

I think they definitely should keep both options alive.  Relocating into hotter markets isn't as sexy as expanding, yet it keeps from diluting the league that much less.

But when you're pitching your league to a community to spend millions on a venue, you want to show your stability and longevity in a community. Moving teams, even as few as 1 in MLS, is a sign of struggle.

 

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On 5/2/2016 at 11:54 PM, 2001mark said:
On 5/2/2016 at 10:55 PM, rsaline said:

I was watching Timbers-Toronto this afternoon and I must say that I'm amazed at how much the atmosphere at these games has changed. Everyone is standing, unified around the game, it's pretty cool to watch. Same goes for Orlando, and maybe even Seattle. But I'm curious if this is the case for most of the other teams? I remember going to a Rapids game before DSG Park and it was terribly boring, worse than a minor league baseball game. If this hasn't changed, would MLS consider relocation before expansion? Obviously national interest in the league and the sport is growing, but why waste time on markets that aren't interested?

 

I think they definitely should keep both options alive.  Relocating into hotter markets isn't as sexy as expanding, yet it keeps from diluting the league that much less.

 

Relocation is much less likely in MLS, as stadiums need to be set before the expansion franchises are awarded.  What existing markets do you think the league should leave?

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1 minute ago, Gothamite said:

 

Relocation is much less likely in MLS, as stadiums need to be set before the expansion franchises are awarded.  What existing markets do you think the league should leave?

Depending on how this Tim Howard thing goes, I think Colorado is a genuine possibility. They've had a couple of good years and have started off fast, but media and public attention just hasn't been there IMO. The stadium is far away from the city center and up until this Tim Howard thing, they haven't really had any star players. Plus Kroenke has shown he's not afraid to move a team if it's to the right situation.

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That makes no sense and that is coming from someone who has been highly critical of the Rapids, Kroenke, and Denver sports fans. Moving an original MLS team in a Big 4 city would look very bad, and honestly there isn't a single city (that doesn't already have a team ready to move up) that has proven itself to be more worthy of a team than Denver. This is why I am somewhat against mass expansion, Sac and Minny are ok but I'm not sure after that.

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Agreed. That's pretty goofy. 

 

Relocation on is the nuclear option, only appropriate in the most dire circumstances.  You move the Boston Braves because when spring training opens you only have 26 season ticket holders.  You move the Tampa Bay Rays because the players have to call out their own fans for never showing up, even when they're the best team in baseball.  You don't move the Rapids because they're in a funk. 

 

There are no MLS markets where relocation makes any sense at all. 

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Both times I've driven out of Colorado I was amazed by just how far the Rapids stadium is from Denver. Granted it's not as far from Denver as the Denver airport, but nothing is farther from Denver than the Denver airport.  

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27 minutes ago, McCarthy said:

Both times I've driven out of Colorado I was amazed by just how far the Rapids stadium is from Denver. Granted it's not as far from Denver as the Denver airport, but nothing is farther from Denver than the Denver airport.  

Well the Denver airport is about the size of Denver itself 

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50 minutes ago, McCarthy said:

Both times I've driven out of Colorado I was amazed by just how far the Rapids stadium is from Denver. Granted it's not as far from Denver as the Denver airport, but nothing is farther from Denver than the Denver airport.  

Thats the frustrating thing about DSGP it's far enough that it seems so far away but it's not. It is 17 minutes from Coors Field, traffic often increases that but IMO that's not far enough to explain our attendance problems. Colorado is really spread out as it is and I'd be willing to bet that most Broncos, Rockies, Nuggets, and Avs fans travel at least that long to catch a game. Denver is very finicky and all the teams are poorly supported when they struggle (save the Broncos).

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I read somewhere that Denver is the most overextended city in US sports. This isn't a knock on Denver, but there's too many teams for a population of that size. It's natural that when one team struggles people choose to spend their sports moneys on another team in the market. I'd say that explains the Rapids' problems right there. 

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9 hours ago, kcchiefsfan said:

That makes no sense and that is coming from someone who has been highly critical of the Rapids, Kroenke, and Denver sports fans. Moving an original MLS team in a Big 4 city would look very bad, and honestly there isn't a single city (that doesn't already have a team ready to move up) that has proven itself to be more worthy of a team than Denver. This is why I am somewhat against mass expansion, Sac and Minny are ok but I'm not sure after that.

Highly critical? I made one comment. 

 

I agree it looks bad, but I think the attendance numbers are really important. They were lowest in the league last year, and I haven't seen them make any real effort (other than Tim Howard) to market themselves and advertise their product. They're almost never on national TV (like every other Denver team not named the Broncos) and it's even hard to find the games on local channels unless you want to shell out for Altitude 2. I'm not saying it will happen next year or even in five years, but right now I think they're in a downward trend. 

 

The Tim Howard signing is a bold move because it will spark some attention, but unless he performs like Peyton did (okay maybe not that good, but he can't just be a total bust), I don't think it will help the organization's numbers in the long run. 

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4 hours ago, McCarthy said:

Both times I've driven out of Colorado I was amazed by just how far the Rapids stadium is from Denver. Granted it's not as far from Denver as the Denver airport, but nothing is farther from Denver than the Denver airport.  

 

Well, duh. How else are they supposed to squeeze in all the underground bunkers for the 1%? 

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2 hours ago, rsaline said:

Highly critical? I made one comment. 

 

I agree it looks bad, but I think the attendance numbers are really important. They were lowest in the league last year, and I haven't seen them make any real effort (other than Tim Howard) to market themselves and advertise their product. They're almost never on national TV (like every other Denver team not named the Broncos) and it's even hard to find the games on local channels unless you want to shell out for Altitude 2. I'm not saying it will happen next year or even in five years, but right now I think they're in a downward trend. 

 

The Tim Howard signing is a bold move because it will spark some attention, but unless he performs like Peyton did (okay maybe not that good, but he can't just be a total bust), I don't think it will help the organization's numbers in the long run. 

I meant myself, I have been highly critical, both on and off these boards in the past. 


To address your other points, usually the Rapids are on regular Altitude not 2. That is really no different than the Nuggets, Avs or Rockies being on local cable channels. The national TV thing is on the Rapids partly for sucking the last few years but is mostly on MLS for not spreading it out more evenly. (Who else is tired of watching SKC, LA, Orlando, NYC and NYRB?)

 

The Howard move was for people like you (who, excuse me if I'm wrong, don't seem to follow the team very well) but the team has made a serious effort to improve. They brought in Gashi who was playing in UEFA Champions League matches a few years ago and is still in his prime, Pappa a guy who is a known high quality MLS player, and Jones who is also a US star who has brought strength and toughness to a team that desperately needed it. So far, it appears to be paying off as the Rapids are  leading the Supporters Shield race. Now is not the time to bash the Rapids for putting out a bad product because they seem to be really trying to fix the problems of the last few years.

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1 hour ago, kcchiefsfan said:

I meant myself, I have been highly critical, both on and off these boards in the past. 


To address your other points, usually the Rapids are on regular Altitude not 2. That is really no different than the Nuggets, Avs or Rockies being on local cable channels. The national TV thing is on the Rapids partly for sucking the last few years but is mostly on MLS for not spreading it out more evenly. (Who else is tired of watching SKC, LA, Orlando, NYC and NYRB?)

 

The Howard move was for people like you (who, excuse me if I'm wrong, don't seem to follow the team very well) but the team has made a serious effort to improve. They brought in Gashi who was playing in UEFA Champions League matches a few years ago and is still in his prime, Pappa a guy who is a known high quality MLS player, and Jones who is also a US star who has brought strength and toughness to a team that desperately needed it. So far, it appears to be paying off as the Rapids are  leading the Supporters Shield race. Now is not the time to bash the Rapids for putting out a bad product because they seem to be really trying to fix the problems of the last few years.

This is exactly my point, if they want to bring in the casual fan like me, they're going to have to make more moves like this. If such moves work, it will make me more willing to drive 40-60 minutes to the field, and will likely turn me into a bigger fan. But if Howard flops, they need to keep going after big name players, otherwise their fan base and interest will remain static.

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9 hours ago, rsaline said:

I agree it looks bad, but I think the attendance numbers are really important. They were lowest in the league last year, and I haven't seen them make any real effort (other than Tim Howard) to market themselves and advertise their product. 

 

So they have a bad couple years, and you think relocation is a possibility?  Sheesh.  They've been tops in the league before, they may well be again.  No need to panic when they hit a minor funk. 

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26 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

 

So they have a bad couple years, and you think relocation is a possibility?  Sheesh.  They've been tops in the league before, they may well be again.  No need to panic when they hit a minor funk. 

Understandable. You asked if I had any suggestions for relocation-prone franchises and I chose Colorado because they haven't seemed to be following the typical brand of soccer that the MLS has been pushing for. 

 

Rather than diluting the league with more teams. I was thinking it would be more feasible to move one of the teams into a different (possibly more suitable) market.

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You and I will just have to agree to disagree, my friend. 

 

I don't see how this current run of expansion can possible be characterized as "diluting" the league, since a bigger and stronger league will earn more money and make it possible to spend more on international talent, improving the pool overall.  Controlled but aggressive growth seems a smart plan for the future. 

 

And if Colorado is in a bit of a funk at the moment, we'll see if they can take advantage of that growth.  Nothing need last forever.

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BMO Field is finally a proper stadium.  I wasn't there of course, $70 to watch TFC, I'll pass.  However, the canopy certainly seemed to make the place sound louder on tv.  

Of course it was damp & rainy tonight downtown, which can toy with sound, yet it finally looks & sounds like a major league stadium.  

 

1-0 doesn't hurt either.

 

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There may be a new NASL team called the Atlanta Chiefs.

 

The NASL are morons for even entertaining this. Who the hell is going to come to their games? 

 

All the remaining Silverback fans have pledged to back the Silverbacks in the NPSL and what uninitiated soccer fan is going to pick the Chiefs over Atlanta United? 

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