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two current teams with the same name


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Recently, while reading an article about the revival of the Forest Hills Tennis Stadium in New York City, I found out that there will be a new World Team Tennis team playing there this year called the New York Empire.  (The New York Sportimes, which for a decade had played at the Sportime centre on Randall's Island, moved to San Diego a couple of years ago.)

 

A few days later, I was looking through the WatchESPN app, and I saw that a match for the New York Empire was taking place.  I thought to myself, "That's funny; I could have sworn that the World Team Tennis season begins in July."  So I launched that match, and it turns out that it was not tennis, but a match from the American Ultimate Disc League.  (And, by the way, a great match!  I never knew that ultimate frisbee was such a cool game to watch, or that there was a pro league.  Indeed, there are two pro leagues: the AUDL and also something called Major League Ultimate. But, it seems that only the AUDL has its games on WatchESPN.  But that's beside the point here.)

If the AUDL's New York Empire are now (as I later learnt) in their fourth season, why would World Team Tennis use the same name for its new team in New York?  Also: how could they do that?  How is it possible to just juse a name that is currently in use, albeit by a minor sports team?  And how did the WTT team's attorneys approve of this?

 

Here are the logos of the teams:

 

 

  tumblr_static_webempire.png   empirebannerstory.png   

 

 

The AUDL team's logo is pretty well designed.  The capital E's at each end of the word make a nice near-symmetry.  And the skyline looks nice within the shield, with the Empire State Building standing at its centre, and poking up to its highest point.

The World Team Tennis team's logo is not as good. The use of the Empire State Building for the letter I is understandable; but the choice to have it extend upward higher than the rest of the word is questionable, given that it is not in the middle of the word.  If the top of the bulidng had been level with the top of the other letters in "Empire", it would probably look a lot better.

The AUDL team's home jerseys are a bit of a mess, with a skyline scene that wraps around the shirt:

 

SIC_NYE_DCB_2013-06-02_00571-ZF-5170-345

 

At one time their road jersey was just an inverse version of that garish home jersey:

Breeze_Empire_20130616_151850_KWL_8635-Z

 But their current road jersey is beautifully understated:


p937838273-3.jpg

 

It features a wordmark that is reminiscent of the famous picture of John Lennon:
 

ny-empire-jersey-road.png   JOHN_LENNON_BOB_GRUEN_NEW_YORK_CITY_SHIR

 

 

Anyway, as mentioned, the questions are: why and how can a new team open up using the name that another team is currently using? 

 

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2 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

Recently, while reading an article about the revival of the Forest Hills Tennis Stadium in New York City, I found out that there will be a new World Team Tennis team playing there this year called the New York Empire.  (The New York Sportimes, which for a decade had played at the Sportime centre on Randall's Island, moved to San Diego a couple of years ago.)

 

A few days later, I was looking through the WatchESPN app, and I saw that a match for the New York Empire was taking place.  I thought to myself, "That's funny; I could have sworn that the World Team Tennis season begins in July."  So I launched that match, and it turns out that it was not tennis, but a match from the American Ultimate Disc League.  (And, by the way, a great match!  I never knew that ultimate frisbee was such a cool game to watch, or that there was a pro league.  Indeed, there are two pro leagues: the AUDL and also something called Major League Ultimate. But, it seems that only the AUDL has its games on WatchESPN.  But that's beside the point here.)

If the AUDL's New York Empire are now (as I later learnt) in their fourth season, why would World Team Tennis use the same name for its new team in New York?  Also: how could they do that?  How is it possible to just juse a name that is currently in use, albeit by a minor sports team?  And how did the WTT team's attorneys approve of this?

 

Here are the logos of the teams:

 

 

  tumblr_static_webempire.png   empirebannerstory.png   

 

 

The AUDL team's logo is pretty well designed.  The capital E's at each end of the word make a nice near-symmetry.  And the skyline looks nice within the shield, with the Empire State Building standing at its centre, and poking up to its highest point.

The World Team Tennis team's logo is not as good. The use of the Empire State Building for the letter I is understandable; but the choice to have it extend upward higher than the rest of the word is questionable, given that it is not in the middle of the word.  If the top of the bulidng had been level with the top of the other letters in "Empire", it would probably look a lot better.

The AUDL team's home jerseys are a bit of a mess, with a skyline scene that wraps around the shirt:

 

SIC_NYE_DCB_2013-06-02_00571-ZF-5170-345

 

At one time their road jersey was just an inverse version of that garish home jersey:

Breeze_Empire_20130616_151850_KWL_8635-Z

 But their current road jersey is beautifully understated:


p937838273-3.jpg

 

It features a wordmark that is reminiscent of the famous picture of John Lennon:
 

ny-empire-jersey-road.png   JOHN_LENNON_BOB_GRUEN_NEW_YORK_CITY_SHIR

 

 

Anyway, as mentioned, the questions are: why and how can a new team open up using the name that another team is currently using? 

 

I dunno but I love the disc golf team's logo. Love the shade of green they picked for secondary, and I think it does go well with black as they chose for the primary color. Agreed that the tennis team's logo is meh. Heck, just having a tennis ball in a logo is meh in and of itself. It doesn't look right.

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20 minutes ago, dont care said:

Why were there 2 NY Giants teams, 2 NY Yankees teams, 2 Boston Braves teams etc, because no one is going to confuse a football team with a baseball team, or a tennis team with an ultimate frisbee team.

Don't forget two St. Louis Cardinals teams for a long time.

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1 minute ago, MCM0313 said:

Don't forget two St. Louis Cardinals teams for a long time.

Though in fairness the Cardinals was an accident...as the Chicago Cardinals relocated to St. L.

 

I am not even sure what the second Yankees team is...

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34 minutes ago, OnWis97 said:

Though in fairness the Cardinals was an accident...as the Chicago Cardinals relocated to St. L.

 

I am not even sure what the second Yankees team is...

A football team that only lasted for like 4 years, was just making a point.

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I get why it used to happen. Many moons ago, it was regarded more as a unified city/locale identity, before teams were treated as brands and trademarked names. 

 

I have a close friend who is a para in an IP law firm, I just asked her. She said that the New York vs. NY is possibly being seen as enough to distinguish. She said that it is more likely that, with such small leagues, it is possible that the previously existing team has never trademarked, or that they don't see it as worth the cost of a legal battle for something "infringing" that slipped by the system.

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1 minute ago, BeerGuyJordan said:

I get why it used to happen. Many moons ago, it was regarded more as a unified city/locale identity, before teams were treated as brands and trademarked names. 

 

I have a close friend who is a para in an IP law firm, I just asked her. She said that the New York vs. NY is possibly being seen as enough to distinguish. She said that it is more likely that, with such small leagues, it is possible that the previously existing team has never trademarked, or that they don't see it as worth the cost of a legal battle for something "infringing" that slipped by the system.

 

Thanks for taking the time to put this question to your friend.

While the WTT team's logo says "NY", they use the full name "New York" in their publicity material.  But I suspect that the other two conjectures of your friend are pretty sound.

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The Real OG's of this fad, From the CFL.

Ottawa Rough Riders :1876-1996, 2014-pres* (In everything but name)
1302503374369_ORIGINAL.jpg?quality=80&si

Saskatchewan Roughriders : 1910 - pres (Should really rename them selves the GREENWHITES)

cfl-roughriders.jpg

Played each other 4 times in the Grey Cup, Current Record: Ottawa 3 - Saskatchewan 1

1951: Ottawa Rough Riders 21 - Saskatchewan Roughriders 14 - Varsity Stadium, Toronto 


hqdefault.jpg

1966: Saskatchewan Roughriders 29 - Ottawa Rough Riders 14 - Empire Stadium, Vancouver


1966.jpg?quality=65&strip=all&w=620

1969: Ottawa Rough Riders 29 - Saskatchewan Roughriders 11 - Autostad, Montreal
 

o-GREY-CUP-1969-570.jpg

1976: Ottawa Rough Riders 23 - Saskatchewan Roughriders 20 - CNE Stadium, Toronto

gabriel-tony-940-8col.jpg

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9 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

Thanks for taking the time to put this question to your friend.

While the WTT team's logo says "NY", they use the full name "New York" in their publicity material.  But I suspect that the other two conjectures of your friend are pretty sound.

No problem, it got me wondering, too. She certainly knows her stuff, but she also said that IP law is so tricky and screwy that it could be any number of scenarios. She just gave me what she saw as the most likely reasons based on the limited info I gave her.

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14 minutes ago, Hat Boy said:

Putting any legal issues aside, why names a new pro team after an existing pro team in the same city (especially when "Empire" isn't even a good moniker)?

to gain attention. "You like the New York Giants? Check out the New York FOOTBALL Giants."

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3 hours ago, OnWis97 said:

Though in fairness the Cardinals was an accident...as the Chicago Cardinals relocated to St. L.

 

I am not even sure what the second Yankees team is...

 

To piggyback on our apathetic friend's answer, the New York Yankees/Yanks were an AAFC team in the late 1940s. I believe they became the Bulldogs, then eventually the Colts? I think there were two iterations and the latter one eventually turned into the Colts, IIRC. The first one went defunct and was succeeded by the second.

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2 hours ago, MCM0313 said:

 

To piggyback on our apathetic friend's answer, the New York Yankees/Yanks were an AAFC team in the late 1940s. I believe they became the Bulldogs, then eventually the Colts? I think there were two iterations and the latter one eventually turned into the Colts, IIRC. The first one went defunct and was succeeded by the second.

Nice....

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Because if you look at the trademark, it's always in reference to the particular sport the team plays. You can't just trademark something for 'any and all things'. Microsoft ran into that with 'Windows' thinking it covered them for all computing relating aspects, and the courts decided only "Microsoft Windows" is trademarked, and Windows can be used by anyone. Trademarks are 'trade' marks. You have to specify the 'trade' and be readily distinguishable from others without vague or everyday words.

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