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NFL 2017 changes?


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33 minutes ago, kroywen said:

The 49ers easily could've fit the three stripes on their sleeves if they wanted to. I'm not sure what the motivation was - wouldn't be surprised if it was Nike's influence - but going with two stripes is an awfully strange decision.

 

My explanation: the Yorks are a pile of morons who will always make the wrong decision, like making the wrong adjustments to the uniform (i.e. don't fix angled sleeves in 2012 like the Bills did, and delete a stripe instead of making them all straight).

 

BTW, Nike had no problems with a straight tri-stripe pattern on the QB/kicker cuts back in 2012:

 

y-niners-1-jumbo.jpg

 

I blame the 49ers' brass before citing a Nike conspiracy.

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28 minutes ago, BJ Sands said:

Slightly O/T, the Bears and/or Nike moving the TV numbers was such a great idea. 

 

Honestly, just about every team should move the TV numbers up to the shoulders, save for teams with vertical stripes on their shoulders (Jets, Colts, Panthers, Rams, etc.). It looks so much better in most cases, and leaves far more room for actual sleeve stripes.

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7 minutes ago, kroywen said:

 

Honestly, just about every team should move the TV numbers up to the shoulders, save for teams with vertical stripes on their shoulders (Jets, Colts, Panthers, Rams, etc.). It looks so much better in most cases, and leaves far more room for actual sleeve stripes.

 

The one thing I'd say is that for the fan jerseys they should have kept the numbers on the sleeves. To my brain, the stripes and numbers are  a unit. So as sleeves disappeared and the whole thing had to move higher and higher, keeping the numbers above the stripes and looking good meant the numbers happen to land on the shoulders of player jerseys. But since fan jerseys have sleeves, the stripes are further down and the big gap between the stripes and numbers looks off.

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29 minutes ago, SFGiants58 said:

 

My explanation: the Yorks are a pile of morons who will always make the wrong decision, like making the wrong adjustments to the uniform (i.e. don't fix angled sleeves in 2012 like the Bills did, and delete a stripe instead of making them all straight).

 

BTW, Nike had no problems with a straight tri-stripe pattern on the QB/kicker cuts back in 2012:

 

y-niners-1-jumbo.jpg

 

I blame the 49ers' brass before citing a Nike conspiracy.

I just thin the 49ers want to continue to the illusion of the 3 stripes being at the very lowest point possible on the sleeve. They probably want as much separation from the TV numbers to the stripes. I don't know why they would but that resulted in the truncated stripes. 

 

Also, when these stripes were first introduced by Reebok, it just felt that the stripes were an afterthought and different cuts were all acceptable and eliminating some in the process was OK. 

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2 hours ago, Old School Fool said:


I don't think Nike cares about three stripes especially in a sport where a number of stripes are prevalent. It was definitely an Adidas thing when the Patriots first got those uniforms, but that point is gone and I don't even think Nike even realizes or cares. It's like Reebok getting mad at the Broncos for their Nike design, it doesn't even matter because it's what the team wants and there's nothing the manufacturer can do about it.

 

 

I think you're mostly right that Nike normally doesn't care what sort of stripes an NFL team has. You look at a team with triple stripes like the Bears and it's unlikely someone would confuse it as the Adidas tri-stripe. However, in the 49ers case, the uniforms displays three identical and monospaced white stripes, which is iconic to the Adidas brand.

 

77044.jpg

 

Let's just say that if my company paid over a billion dollars for an apparel deal, I would want to not give any free advertising to my main competitor, no matter how inadvertent or accidental that is.

 

And for those of you saying "Well, Nike made 49ers uniforms with the three stripes on it before," they had to because that was the uniform. They couldn't make a Bears jersey with only two stripes. But if Nike went to the Bears and said "We're having trouble with getting all your stripes onto our new template, can we tweak your uniform?" and mysteriously a stripe disappeared, they could then make two-striped Bears uniforms.

 

Look, I'm not saying that this was 100% Nike's decision. But I think if given the choice, Nike would probably prefer to sell 49ers merchandise without the three stripes and Jed York likely doesn't care or notice the difference. Ultimately, I think it's as good an explanation as any as to why the third stripe disappeared, but even if it's not true, it's fun to think about. 

 

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'Look, whether or not Nike liked the 9ers' three stripe look is immaterial. I promise you, they didn't (and couldn't) go to the 9ers and demand a change based on their rivalry with Adidas. That's not how the NFL/Nike relationship works.

 

My guess is they (meaning the 49ers) did it because they got tired of the complaints about the cut-off stripes, and it occurred to someone that two stripes would match the helmet and pants.  With the new look the helmet, white jersey, and pants all have two red stripes... and the red jersey is a simple reverse.  I'm pretty sure that's the reason.

 

Not that I like it, personally... the three stripes are a 49er trademark IMO.

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3 hours ago, RichO said:

 

The one thing I'd say is that for the fan jerseys they should have kept the numbers on the sleeves. To my brain, the stripes and numbers are  a unit. So as sleeves disappeared and the whole thing had to move higher and higher, keeping the numbers above the stripes and looking good meant the numbers happen to land on the shoulders of player jerseys. But since fan jerseys have sleeves, the stripes are further down and the big gap between the stripes and numbers looks off.

or, just dont make fan jerseys with sleeves that go down past the elbow.. to me, that's the main issue.. i realize most fans probably don't really want "players cut" jerseys - like most players wear with the cap-sleeves and elastic cuffs, but the typical QB/K cut that hangs down like a t-shirt would be ideal.. it would offer full sleeves with enough space to put full striping patterns, but not so big that you get awkward gaps of empty space between numbers and stripes, or even worse - awkwardly ending stripes like on the Seahawks' fan jerserys.. 

 

here i shortened the sleeves on a couple images in paint.. mine on the left, real on the right.. plus, matt flynn's QB-cut Seahawks jersey..

NikeDolphinsJerseyCompare.png

 

 

BearsJerseyChange.png

Matt-Flynn.jpg

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19 hours ago, WavePunter said:

or, just dont make fan jerseys with sleeves that go down past the elbow.. to me, that's the main issue.. i realize most fans probably don't really want "players cut" jerseys - like most players wear with the cap-sleeves and elastic cuffs, but the typical QB/K cut that hangs down like a t-shirt would be ideal.. it would offer full sleeves with enough space to put full striping patterns, but not so big that you get awkward gaps of empty space between numbers and stripes, or even worse - awkwardly ending stripes like on the Seahawks' fan jerserys.. 

 

here i shortened the sleeves on a couple images in paint.. mine on the left, real on the right.. plus, matt flynn's QB-cut Seahawks jersey..

NikeDolphinsJerseyCompare.png

 

 

BearsJerseyChange.png

Matt-Flynn.jpg

 

much better

 

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On 5/24/2017 at 9:10 AM, kroywen said:

Three stripes can easily fit on a sleeve with Nike's template:

 

chi_e_bearsnikeunis_07.jpg

 

gsc32901.jpg?w=1000&h=667

 

55c7b854dfb9c0735896b4c5d9a2471d.jpg

 

The 49ers easily could've fit the three stripes on their sleeves if they wanted to. I'm not sure what the motivation was - wouldn't be surprised if it was Nike's influence - but going with two stripes is an awfully strange decision.

 

Funny how the bottom stripe is cut off on your first example, barely if at all on your second, and the third is of a college team.  With the swoosh on the players' chests, there's room to move the stripes up.  Not possible on the pro jerseys.

 

So your examples hardly prove that "(t)he 49ers easily could've fit the three stripes on their sleeves if they wanted to".  They actually demonstrate just the opposite.

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26 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

 

Funny how the bottom stripe is cut off on your first example, barely if at all on your second, and the third is of a college team.  With the swoosh on the players' chests, there's room to move the stripes up.  Not possible on the pro jerseys.

 

So your examples hardly prove that "(t)he 49ers easily could've fit the three stripes on their sleeves if they wanted to".  They actually demonstrate just the opposite.

 

1.  I'm pretty sure Urlacher's stripe isn't cut off.  The elastic just bunched up around it.  Presumably, if it was cut off, the same thing would have happened on the opposite sleeve.

 

2.  The Lions sleeve again just shows the elastic bunching at the end of the sleeve.

 

3.  The Steelers/Iowa example is easily distinguished as a result of both (a) the NCAA/NFL Nike swoosh placement, and (b) the massive size of the total stripe pattern.

 

The 49ers' traditional stripe pattern takes up much less space than any of the examples shown, including the Bears.  Therefore, I disagree with your conclusion that the pictures "actually demonstrate the opposite" (i.e., that the 49ers could not have fit three stripes on their sleeves easily).

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11 minutes ago, leopard88 said:

The 49ers' traditional stripe pattern takes up much less space than any of the examples shown, including the Bears.  Therefore, I disagree with your conclusion that the pictures "actually demonstrate the opposite" (i.e., that the 49ers could not have fit three stripes on their sleeves easily).

 

I will agree to disagree, but at the very least I think it's clear that the pictures failed to prove what they were intended to prove.   :D

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Urlacher's bottom stripe on one side is definitely partially cut off.. i'd attribute it more to shoddy craftsmanship and poor quality control, but it's not just an "elastic bunching" issue..

 

bottom line is this:

if the 49ers were Hell-bent on having 3 stripes on their sleeves, they absolutely could have it - no problem..

the issue lies in the fact that they:

     A: seem to be pretty adamant that the stripes run perfectly horizontal (parallel to the ground when worn)

     B: seem to be pretty adamant about how far down the stripes must begin.

 

starting the stripes slightly higher and allowing them to be angled more like the cut of the sleeve would facilitate the full 3-stripe pattern.. however, angling them downward to achieve the "horizontal" orientation puts the outer portion of the stripes in jeopardy due to the cuff; and starting the pattern so low basically ensures all but the top stripe will be cut off by the cuff.

 

like so:

49ersStripes.png

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There are plenty of ways that the niners could have put three stripes on there, even if they made them thinner and moved them up a bit. 

 

I dont think for a second that Nike simply said they're not making three stripes, but I do bet that they proposed the change to the 9ers and sold it as an aesthetic improvement with the unexpressed motivation of removing their competitor's trademark. 

 

Of course in 2017 stripes on sleeves are dumb anyway, so any reduction is a win. 

 

There's less (if any) need for TV numbers these day(HDTV helps, and even newspaper photographs are so good now that you can identify a player without needing the small number) so maybe they should just do striping vertically - like racing stripes and eliminate the numbers or put them over the stripes. 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said:

There are plenty of ways that the niners could have put three stripes on there, even if they made them thinner and moved them up a bit. 

 

I dont think for a second that Nike simply said they're not making three stripes, but I do bet that they proposed the change to the 9ers and sold it as an aesthetic improvement with the unexpressed motivation of removing their competitor's trademark. 

 

Of course in 2017 stripes on sleeves are dumb anyway, so any reduction is a win. 

 

There's less (if any) need for TV numbers these day(HDTV helps, and even newspaper photographs are so good now that you can identify a player without needing the small number) so maybe they should just do striping vertically - like racing stripes and eliminate the numbers or put them over the stripes. 

 

 

TV numbers are definitely still helpful.. football is different from other sports where you generally have very few players, more space between them, and less movement.. in football, you have roughly 16 players in a fairly tight space colliding into one another, quickly running past one another, piling on top of one another, and all are constantly moving, twisting, spinning, falling, etc.. TV numbers dont just help fans identify the ball carrier while watching their favorite team.. They help coaches while breaking down film, they help TV and radio broadcasters identify various players for a multitude of reasons, they help statisticians give credit accurately, they help the PA announcer identify players, they help the numerous spotters who work with the various aforementioned individuals, and the even help equipment managers while handling inventory (simply pulling jerseys for various uses can be a huge pain, even when they're hanging in numerical order, if they don't have TV numbers).. 

this is the same reason colored football jerseys should always have white, yellow/gold, or silver numbers.. colored numbers may look great on a mockup or concept, but picking out a narrow outline in the crowds and at the speeds mentioned above is difficult for the human eye, and even on film with HD cameras.. in baseball, a guy is virtually standing still at bat, so you get plenty of time to take a good look at a red number on a blue jersey, so it's not difficult to see, but identifying a tackler in a pile, surrounded by a crowd, moving at high speeds, when you have red numbers on a blue jersey (even with a white outline) is very tough.. its why the Browns went away from the orange #'s in the 80's, why they'll likely swtich back to white as soon as possible with their current brown jerseys, and possibly why the Jaguars don't wear their teal jerseys very often.. 

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2 minutes ago, WavePunter said:

this is the same reason colored football jerseys should always have white, yellow/gold, or silver numbers.. colored numbers may look great on a mockup or concept, but picking out a narrow outline in the crowds and at the speeds mentioned above is difficult for the human eye, and even on film with HD cameras.

To be honest with you, I would extend this to most sports, especially soccer. There are some teams that will always look great with color-on-color numbers (Bulls, Oilers, NYR, Red Sox), but for the most part white/light numbers on colored jersey is the way to go.

NSFCvyu.png

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1 hour ago, leopard88 said:

 

1.  I'm pretty sure Urlacher's stripe isn't cut off.  The elastic just bunched up around it.  Presumably, if it was cut off, the same thing would have happened on the opposite sleeve.

 

2.  The Lions sleeve again just shows the elastic bunching at the end of the sleeve.

 

3.  The Steelers/Iowa example is easily distinguished as a result of both (a) the NCAA/NFL Nike swoosh placement, and (b) the massive size of the total stripe pattern.

 

The 49ers' traditional stripe pattern takes up much less space than any of the examples shown, including the Bears.  Therefore, I disagree with your conclusion that the pictures "actually demonstrate the opposite" (i.e., that the 49ers could not have fit three stripes on their sleeves easily).

 

There is one tiny portion of Urlacher's stripe that is cut off, but I think that's more a production issue than anything. If you look at his other sleeve, the three stripes are there in full.

 

In this in-game photo: all three stripes appear to be in tact and complete:

 

chi_brianurlacher_00.jpg

 

If these three stripes can fit on a tiny sleeve like Urlacher's, then clearly the thinner 3 stripes of the 49ers can fit as well.

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On 5/23/2017 at 10:12 PM, upperV03 said:

The jerseys at the draft (which were the on-field version of the VU template) had two stripes, so it's definitely not just a mistake. The new retail jerseys with the two stripes are indeed indicative of what will be worn on the field.

IMG_3705.thumb.JPG.bb79b44e8bdf02ca8470ebc8a53586a5.JPG

IMG_3729.PNG.a7cd8d9ac0cb8b641bd444466f7e6d74.PNGIMG_3730.PNG.00ab9438a80fb4ac8b77b08e7249c2b6.PNG

 

54 minutes ago, WavePunter said:

Urlacher's bottom stripe on one side is definitely partially cut off.. i'd attribute it more to shoddy craftsmanship and poor quality control, but it's not just an "elastic bunching" issue..

 

bottom line is this:

if the 49ers were Hell-bent on having 3 stripes on their sleeves, they absolutely could have it - no problem..

the issue lies in the fact that they:

     A: seem to be pretty adamant that the stripes run perfectly horizontal (parallel to the ground when worn)

     B: seem to be pretty adamant about how far down the stripes must begin.

 

starting the stripes slightly higher and allowing them to be angled more like the cut of the sleeve would facilitate the full 3-stripe pattern.. however, angling them downward to achieve the "horizontal" orientation puts the outer portion of the stripes in jeopardy due to the cuff; and starting the pattern so low basically ensures all but the top stripe will be cut off by the cuff.

 

like so:

49ersStripes.png

 

This is an interesting theory and it's consistent with the version of the jersey on the right with truncated stripes.  However, based on the photos from the draft, the stripes on the new jersey sit higher on the sleeve and follow the cut of the sleeve.

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11 minutes ago, JWhiz96 said:

To be honest with you, I would extend this to most sports, especially soccer. There are some teams that will always look great with color-on-color numbers (Bulls, Oilers, NYR, Red Sox), but for the most part white/light numbers on colored jersey is the way to go.

 

Exactly. In baseball, you can *kind of* get away with color numbers on a color jersey, since it's not nearly as important to identify players in motion in the middle of a crowded field of play. But even there, I think white/light numbers on a dark background just simply look better and are easier to distinguish.

 

Compare this:

 

washington-nationals-center-fielder-adam

 

to this:

 

9650298-andrew-miller-terry-francona-mlb

 

The white numbers both look better and are easier to read.

 

As a general rule of thumb, the only times color-on-color numbers really look good (and are easy to read) are on a brightly colored background:

 

cd0f29ca38ac940e9a00bc08d87493eb-getty-1

 

d_wade_hdr.jpg?itok=f04QqL8t

 

2fe4d55adcb2661f1741c4771d3d6ae7.jpg

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17 minutes ago, kroywen said:

As a general rule of thumb, the only times color-on-color numbers really look good (and are easy to read) are on a brightly colored background:

 

And I should mention that all three of those above color schemes I posted look good with white numbers as well:

 

9257025-nhl-stanley-cup-playoffs-florida

 

632732350.jpg

 

9599816-nba-preseason-denver-nuggets-at-

 

When your base color is very bright, generally you can go either way with number color (either white, or in a secondary color with good contrast), and make it work. If the base color is darker, though? Stick with white or very light numbers.

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23 minutes ago, kroywen said:

When your base color is very bright, generally you can go either way with number color (either white, or in a secondary color with good contrast), and make it work. If the base color is darker, though? Stick with white or very light numbers.

this was brought up a couple years back, but it was explained that it goes back to heraldry and coats-of-arms as used in battle, etc.. 

the theory is that you have "Colours" and "Metallics"

 

"Colours" are obviously what we generally think of as colors (red, blue, green, black, brown, purple, orange, and various shades/hues, etc.)

"Metallics" are either a metallic color (gold or silver typically) or a non-metallic version of a metallic color (yellow, white, light grey)

 

the idea is that "Metallics" show up best on "Colours" and vice-versa.. but "Colours" don't show up very well on other "Colours" and "Metallics" don't show up very well on other "Metallics", and since you wanted things to be easily identifiable on the battle field, you should generally follow these rules.. the same goes on the football field.. Colored jerseys should always get white, silver, light grey, yellow, or gold numbers.. (in my opinion, it should be white 95% of the time - teams like the Raiders are really the only exceptions)..

 

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