The Pointless Realignment Outpost

[loogodude90]

My NBA:

West - Blazers, Warriors | Kings, Clippers | Lakers, Suns | Jazz, Nuggets | Thunder, Mavericks |

(Most of these teams are in the Pacific or Mountain time zone. I didn't want to separate Dallas from Houston and San Antonio, but this was the best I could do.)

Central - Spurs, Rockets | Grizzlies, Hornets | Wolves, Bucks | Bulls, Pacers | Pistons, Cavaliers |

(Most are in the Central time zone.)

East - Raps, Nets | Celtics, Knicks | Sixers, Wizards | Bobcats, Hawks | Magic, Heat |

(All of these teams are in the Eastern time zone)

SEASON

Division opponents 4x (36), other divisions twice each (40), one rival four more times(4). (total 80)

PLAYOFFS

Top 5 in each division qualify, plus the best 6th-place team. All teams seeded 1-16.

4 rounds determine the league champion.

3 things -

1)I would have Dallas in the Central instead of San Antonio. It just makes more sense.

2)I would have CLE in the East, and ATL in the Central. Again, it just makes more sense.

3)I'm not a big fan of the Rivals thing. I feel like that's not fair to a team that gets stuck with a really good rival.

[Magnus]

1)I would have Dallas in the Central instead of San Antonio. It just makes more sense.

Yeah, I flip-flopped on that one for a while.

2)I would have CLE in the East, and ATL in the Central. Again, it just makes more sense.

See, I don't really get that. Ohio seems like a more central state than Georgia, which has Atlantic coastline. Plus it would break up the geographical integrity to have Georgia shifted to the Central and Ohio stuck out with the Atlantic states. I get that maybe it would bring Cleveland in line with the other Great Lakes cities, but then I'd be moving Atlanta away from Florida and Carolina.

3)I'm not a big fan of the Rivals thing. I feel like that's not fair to a team that gets stuck with a really good rival.

To those teams: Suck it up, buttercup. This isn't high school basketball.

[pmoehrin]

If anyone would like, I have an excel sheet that gives you excat milledge "as the crow flies" for how far away every team is in comparison to another.

I have MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL, MLS and D1A College Football.

Just give me your e-mail and I can send you the excel file.

Added team colors to the cells. Cleaned up some of the conference mistakes with college football, and also added the AAA baseball, the AHL, and NBDL.

BTW I truly hate any team with a blue green color combo. Pain in the ass to do teams like the Charlotte Knights and Connecticut Whale. The cells are all easy to read though which is more what I was going for then color accuracy although I tried to get as close as I could where possible.

[McCall]

My NBA:

West - Blazers, Warriors | Kings, Clippers | Lakers, Suns | Jazz, Nuggets | Thunder, Mavericks |

(Most of these teams are in the Pacific or Mountain time zone. I didn't want to separate Dallas from Houston and San Antonio, but this was the best I could do.)

Central - Spurs, Rockets | Grizzlies, Hornets | Wolves, Bucks | Bulls, Pacers | Pistons, Cavaliers |

(Most are in the Central time zone.)

East - Raps, Nets | Celtics, Knicks | Sixers, Wizards | Bobcats, Hawks | Magic, Heat |

(All of these teams are in the Eastern time zone)

SEASON

Division opponents 4x (36), other divisions twice each (40), one rival four more times(4). (total 80)

PLAYOFFS

Top 5 in each division qualify, plus the best 6th-place team. All teams seeded 1-16.

4 rounds determine the league champion.

This is a good example of how geography can't be the only reason behind a realignment. If you look at this map, you'll see that the geographically, the 8 teams out west, the 10 in the south and the 12 up north would be the best geographical alignment for what you were trying to do. But that leaves the total number of teams in each division uneven. So then you're forced to break up a good grouping (South) which actually has 10 teams, to even out the west. And then move south teams into a Central and East divisions and thus breaking up a pretty good north layout. If I was doing this, at this point, I would realize it's not a plan that's really going to work, and move on to another one. It sometimes comes down to a process of elimination. You have an idea, but once you start putting it down on paper, or MS Word, then you start to see some flaws that really kind of complicate the whole plan. This was a good idea to pursue, but the current team locations just kind of make the whole "Time Zone" plan a difficult one.

[Thad]

Not really realignment, but sort of is along the same string. A lot of smaller schools around NC complain that the "Big 4" don't play them often enough, so I've come up with the "North Carolina Basketball Championship". Conference opponents would treat these games like baseball teams do - they don't count in the conference standings. I think this would be a boon for the NC economy and would give more meaning to an in-season tournament. I ranked teams using their RPI ranking at the end of last season:

The tournament tree would look something like this:

What does everyone think of this idea?

[nash61]

With Thrashers most likely moving to Winnipeg, it makes sense for them to be placed in the Northwest Divison. This would most likely move Nashville to the Southeast, and the Wild to the Central.

New Central Division

New Southeast Division (plus the Panthers, they were off the bottom of the map)

[The_Admiral]

Can't realign till we know if the death rattles of the Coyotes and Blue Jackets have concluded.

[McCall]

With Thrashers most likely moving to Winnipeg, it makes sense for them to be placed in the Northwest Divison. This would most likely move Nashville to the Southeast, and the Wild to the Central.

New Central Division

New Southeast Division (plus the Panthers, they were off the bottom of the map)

This is what I believe SHOULD happen. Now, does that mean it's actually going to?

[Magnus]

Whatever actually happens, I just want the teams to remain solvent for a good number of years, whatever markets they may be in.

While I'm here...

it's an MLB realignment! (with some colour schemes borrowed off of other members' concepts). I also changed a couple of teams' schemes because there is way to much red-blue going on in baseball. Interleague play happens for the odd team out of 5 while intradivisional play is going on for the other 4, and is featured on TV as the Interleague Matchup of the Week.

[crashcarson15]

With Thrashers most likely moving to Winnipeg, it makes sense for them to be placed in the Northwest Divison. This would most likely move Nashville to the Southeast, and the Wild to the Central.

New Central Division

New Southeast Division (plus the Panthers, they were off the bottom of the map)

This is what I believe SHOULD happen. Now, does that mean it's actually going to?

And this image clearly shows that Columbus is considerably closer to Washington and closer to Raleigh than Nashville is. As well as being a considerably distance farther east. Remember that without Atlanta, Nashville isn't within 500 miles of a single conference opponent. The Jackets would be within 500 miles of 2 division opponents, and 4 other conference opponents (Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Toronto, Philadelphia). They'd be within 500 miles of nearly half the conference, while Nashville wouldn't be within 500 miles of any of the East.

[pmoehrin]

Atlanta moving to Winnipeg is going to increase distances between teams no matter what.

The total sum for distances that Atlanta is compared to the other 29 NHL teams is 28404 miles.

For Winnipeg its going to be 33220 miles. That's about another 166 miles added on per team.

Biggest winners in order are going to be Edmonton, Calgary, Vancouver, San Jose, Minnesota, Colorado, Los Angeles, Anaheim, and Phoenix. Every other city will lose and the biggest ones will be Florida, Tampa Bay, Carolina, Nashville and Washington.

So you are looking at the Southeast taking a big blow distance wise here.

If you just looking at the four teams left in the Southeast division and trying to find the epicenter of the division, Nasvhille would be about 78 miles closer then Columbus would, and those are the two closest teams. Columbus is also 98 miles closer to the epicenter of the other four teams in the new Central division then is Nashville and again those are the two closest teams. With that in mind I would say that's the move that would probably make the most sense, without getting too crazy with the alignments.

[loogodude90]

With Thrashers most likely moving to Winnipeg, it makes sense for them to be placed in the Northwest Divison. This would most likely move Nashville to the Southeast, and the Wild to the Central.

New Central Division

New Southeast Division (plus the Panthers, they were off the bottom of the map)

This is what I believe SHOULD happen. Now, does that mean it's actually going to?

And this image clearly shows that Columbus is considerably closer to Washington and closer to Raleigh than Nashville is. As well as being a considerably distance farther east. Remember that without Atlanta, Nashville isn't within 500 miles of a single conference opponent. The Jackets would be within 500 miles of 2 division opponents, and 4 other conference opponents (Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Toronto, Philadelphia). They'd be within 500 miles of nearly half the conference, while Nashville wouldn't be within 500 miles of any of the East.

I agree... if ATL moves to WIN, the the eastern-most Western Conference team should move east. I believe that team is CLB.

[pmoehrin]

I agree... if ATL moves to WIN, the the eastern-most Western Conference team should move east. I believe that team is CLB.

For those wondering looking at the map if perhpas Detroit may have a case for that title. Columbus is further east by just over two miles.

[yh]

I think the focus will be more on the markets than the geography, not to the complete exclusion of the latter. I think it would make more sense from a rivalry standpoint to replace Atlanta with another Southern city, i.e. Nashville, to maintain Columbus/Ohio's Rust Belt rivalries with Detroit and Chicago, and to bring Minnesota back into a quasi-Norris Division configuration with old mates Chicago, Detroit and St. Louis.

[Sport]

The NHL doesn't need divisions when it is conference standings that determine who makes the playoffs.

Add 4 more regular season games, play everyone in your conference 4 times and everyone in the other conference twice.

Western Conference

Anaheim, Calgary, Chicago, Colorado, Columbus, Dallas, Detroit, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Minnesota, Nashville, Phoenix, San Jose, St. Louis, Vancouver.

Eastern Conference

Atlanta, Boston, Buffalo, Carolina, Florida, Montreal, New Jersey, New York Islanders, New York Rangers, Ottawa, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Toronto, Washington.

This brings up an issue regarding NBA (and NHL, I think) divisions that I think about every once in a while... Why do they even exist? Is it just to create a feeling of regional rivalries? It seems kind of pointless when it is a team's position in the conference, not division, that really matters.

The reason for divisions is because they get the teams to play the closer by teams more often than the teams further away, which reduces travel time and costs. They also want to promote rivalries. (which has been already stated)

But really how much more travel is it? Using Dallas as an example, my system means they make one fewer trip to California, and one more trip to the northeast. It's not that much more travel, it's different travel. Plus, the benefits of a perfectly balanced schedule would offset the problems created by new travel.

[McCall]

I think the focus will be more on the markets than the geography, not to the complete exclusion of the latter. I think it would make more sense from a rivalry standpoint to replace Atlanta with another Southern city, i.e. Nashville, to maintain Columbus/Ohio's Rust Belt rivalries with Detroit and Chicago, and to bring Minnesota back into a quasi-Norris Division configuration with old mates Chicago, Detroit and St. Louis.

Exactly. If it were Detroit, being an original 6 team, WANTING to switch to the East then I'd understand. I think they could make some concessions for them over 2 teams who have been around less than 15 years. However as was pointed out you have to look at what best aligns each of the divisions involved. Columbus is just fine geographically with the teams in their current division and if you were to add Minnesota. Nashville fits in great with the Southeast (Washington fits better with more northern teams but you gotta get the best alignment possible with the locations you have and unfortunately that puts them into the south).

[jkrdevil]

Well since it looks like the NHL is going to need to realign I think it wouldn't be a bad idea to share with you guys my idea. Some of which I've posted here before.

First thing is to recognize that outside of needing to move Atlanta/Winnipeg to the West and a team needing move east is that the NHL has other problems in regards to alignment. Mainly there aren't enough teams in the Mountain and Pacific time zones to sustain a big Western conference because of travel and time zones. That means there a large chunk of games for each team at bad televised teams. Particularly for Eastern Time Zone teams like Detroit and Columbus where they have a significant amount of times at 10pm local time. Another issue is every team does not visit every building, which is a big deal for some.

I think the better solution is to break the conference down further. Instead of having 2 large conferences, have 4 smaller ones. Conference playoffs first two rounds of the playoffs and then you reseed the final 4 teams and have a league wide Semi-final and Final. It is basically the 82-93 playoff format except the divisions become the conferences and they because of expansion are larger so you won't have the same amount of repeats every single year.

The schedule would work like this:

-Play every team outside your conference twice (home and away).

-For the 7 team conferences you play each time 6 times (3 home and 3 away).

-For the 8 team conferences you play 3 teams 6 times (3 home and 3 away) and the other 4 teams 5 times (3 home and 2 away or vice versa, alternating every year).

Total: 82 Games

Top four teams make the playoffs from each conference.

Now for the Conferences:

Western Conference:

Vancouver Canucks

Edmonton Oilers

Calgary Flames

Colorado Avalance

San Jose Sharks

Los Angeles Kings

Anaheim Ducks

Phoenix Coyotes

Central Conference:

Dallas Stars

St. Louis Blues

Minnesota Wild

Winnipeg Jets

Chicago Blackhawks

Detroit Red Wings

Nashville Predators

Northeast Conference:

Boston Bruins

Montreal Canadiens

Ottawa Senators

Toronto Maple Leafs

Buffalo Sabres

Pittsburgh Penguins

Columbus Blue Jackets

Atlantic Conference:

New York Islanders

New York Rangers

New Jersey Devils

Philadelphia Flyers

Washington Capitals

Carolina Hurricanes

Tampa Bay Lightning

Florida Panthers

No division takes up more than 1 timezone. Preserves for the most part existing rivalries and strengthens them with the playoff format.

[loogodude90]

Well since it looks like the NHL is going to need to realign I think it wouldn't be a bad idea to share with you guys my idea. Some of which I've posted here before.

First thing is to recognize that outside of needing to move Atlanta/Winnipeg to the West and a team needing move east is that the NHL has other problems in regards to alignment. Mainly there aren't enough teams in the Mountain and Pacific time zones to sustain a big Western conference because of travel and time zones. That means there a large chunk of games for each team at bad televised teams. Particularly for Eastern Time Zone teams like Detroit and Columbus where they have a significant amount of times at 10pm local time. Another issue is every team does not visit every building, which is a big deal for some.

I think the better solution is to break the conference down further. Instead of having 2 large conferences, have 4 smaller ones. Conference playoffs first two rounds of the playoffs and then you reseed the final 4 teams and have a league wide Semi-final and Final. It is basically the 82-93 playoff format except the divisions become the conferences and they because of expansion are larger so you won't have the same amount of repeats every single year.

The schedule would work like this:

-Play every team outside your conference twice (home and away).

-For the 7 team conferences you play each time 6 times (3 home and 3 away).

-For the 8 team conferences you play 3 teams 6 times (3 home and 3 away) and the other 4 teams 5 times (3 home and 2 away or vice versa, alternating every year).

Total: 82 Games

Top four teams make the playoffs from each conference.

Now for the Conferences:

Western Conference:

Vancouver Canucks

Edmonton Oilers

Calgary Flames

Colorado Avalance

San Jose Sharks

Los Angeles Kings

Anaheim Ducks

Phoenix Coyotes

Central Conference:

Dallas Stars

St. Louis Blues

Minnesota Wild

Winnipeg Jets

Chicago Blackhawks

Detroit Red Wings

Nashville Predators

Northeast Conference:

Boston Bruins

Montreal Canadiens

Ottawa Senators

Toronto Maple Leafs

Buffalo Sabres

Pittsburgh Penguins

Columbus Blue Jackets

Atlantic Conference:

New York Islanders

New York Rangers

New Jersey Devils

Philadelphia Flyers

Washington Capitals

Carolina Hurricanes

Tampa Bay Lightning

Florida Panthers

No division takes up more than 1 timezone. Preserves for the most part existing rivalries and strengthens them with the playoff format.

What are the divisions? Or did you mean conferences? And if you did, I think 2 of the conferences take up more than 1 timezone.

[McCall]

Well since it looks like the NHL is going to need to realign I think it wouldn't be a bad idea to share with you guys my idea. Some of which I've posted here before.

First thing is to recognize that outside of needing to move Atlanta/Winnipeg to the West and a team needing move east is that the NHL has other problems in regards to alignment. Mainly there aren't enough teams in the Mountain and Pacific time zones to sustain a big Western conference because of travel and time zones. That means there a large chunk of games for each team at bad televised teams. Particularly for Eastern Time Zone teams like Detroit and Columbus where they have a significant amount of times at 10pm local time. Another issue is every team does not visit every building, which is a big deal for some.

I think the better solution is to break the conference down further. Instead of having 2 large conferences, have 4 smaller ones. Conference playoffs first two rounds of the playoffs and then you reseed the final 4 teams and have a league wide Semi-final and Final. It is basically the 82-93 playoff format except the divisions become the conferences and they because of expansion are larger so you won't have the same amount of repeats every single year.

The schedule would work like this:

-Play every team outside your conference twice (home and away).

-For the 7 team conferences you play each time 6 times (3 home and 3 away).

-For the 8 team conferences you play 3 teams 6 times (3 home and 3 away) and the other 4 teams 5 times (3 home and 2 away or vice versa, alternating every year).

Total: 82 Games

Top four teams make the playoffs from each conference.

Now for the Conferences:

Western Conference:

Vancouver Canucks

Edmonton Oilers

Calgary Flames

Colorado Avalance

San Jose Sharks

Los Angeles Kings

Anaheim Ducks

Phoenix Coyotes

Central Conference:

Dallas Stars

St. Louis Blues

Minnesota Wild

Winnipeg Jets

Chicago Blackhawks

Detroit Red Wings

Nashville Predators

Northeast Conference:

Boston Bruins

Montreal Canadiens

Ottawa Senators

Toronto Maple Leafs

Buffalo Sabres

Pittsburgh Penguins

Columbus Blue Jackets

Atlantic Conference:

New York Islanders

New York Rangers

New Jersey Devils

Philadelphia Flyers

Washington Capitals

Carolina Hurricanes

Tampa Bay Lightning

Florida Panthers

No division takes up more than 1 timezone. Preserves for the most part existing rivalries and strengthens them with the playoff format.

What are the divisions? Or did you mean conferences? And if you did, I think 2 of the conferences take up more than 1 timezone.

Western: Edmonton, Calgary, Colorado and Arizona (depending on where they stand with the Daylight Savings Time) are in the Mountain Time Zone while the rest of the conference is in the Pacific.

Central: Detroit is in the Eastern TZ while the rest is in the central.

[Magnus]

Just a prediction for some time in the next couple of NHL seasons:

WESTERN CONFERENCE

PACIFIC: Vancouver(PAC) San Jose(PAC) Los Angeles(PAC) Anaheim(PAC) Phoenix (MTN) |4-1 split|

NORTHWEST: Edmonton(MTN) Calgary(MTN) Colorado(MTN) Minnesota(CEN) Winnipeg(Thrash) (CEN) |2-3 split|

CENTRAL: Dallas (CEN) Nashville* (CEN) St. Louis (CEN) Chicago (CEN) Detroit (EDT) |4-1 split|

EASTERN CONFERENCE

NORTHEAST: Quebec (or NY) Islanders*, Toronto, Montreal, Buffalo, Ottawa |All EDT|

ATLANTIC: Columbus*, Boston, Philly, Rangers, Jersey |All EDT|

SOUTHEAST: Pittsburgh*, Washington, Carolina, Tampa, Florida |All EDT|

(*given the option to switch with any other starred one if they prefer*)

15 opposite conference opponents: 20 games

(One division on the road (5), one division home (5), one division 2x (10))

[i.e. Northeast faces Northwest on the road, Central home and away, and Pacific home]

The division that will be played for 10 games will rotate each season.

10 same conference teams: 30 games

4 divisional rivals: 32 games

TOTAL 82