ninersdd

Rite of Spring 2018-“What happens in the playoffs stays in the playoffs”

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, smzimbabwe said:

 

The only one who comes to mind is Kevin Durant with Golden State.

incredulous.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, The Six said:

Imagine if Ovechkin had signed with the Penguins after one of those postseason losses. All the emotion, all the feelings of finally overcoming failure and redeeming yourself, would all be gone. Sure, his new team would be a juggernaut and he'd probably have 3 Cups by now, but they'd be hollow. Every postseason would turn into a joyless slog towards an inevitable result that nobody enjoys, and not even Ovechkin himself would be able to celebrate because he'd know that he did nothing more than hitch himself to a team that didn't need him.

 

There's probably a comparable player for this in another sport, but I'm drawing a blank right now.

 

Wade Boggs? ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, smzimbabwe said:

 

The only one who comes to mind is Kevin Durant with Golden State.

2uzuplh.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, smzimbabwe said:

 

The only one who comes to mind is Kevin Durant with Golden State.

[insert That’s the Joke meme here]

 

ANYWAY I kind of find it hilarious all of those “Vegas winning is making so many people mad, hahahaha go Knights go! I WANT TO FEED ON SALT” people have gone quiet. 

Funny, that. 

 

On 1/19/2018 at 10:29 PM, habsfan1 said:

This june, there will be a Stanley Cup Parade on the Vegas Strip. Screencap this.

 

 

On 5/28/2018 at 10:57 PM, habsfan1 said:

If it makes anyone feel better, not only will Vegas raise the Cup this year, but I could also see them repeating next year to become 2-time Cup Champs, looking at how fueled this franchise is.

 

 

On 5/20/2018 at 6:22 PM, habsfan1 said:

 

If it makes anyone here feel better...if the Golden Knights lose the Stanley Cup, this whole run was all for nothing.

 

:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

This june, there will be a Stanley Cup Parade on the Vegas Strip. Screencap this.

 

@Ice_Cap I came up short on my prediction. But I came up closer than myself and even others thought. I've seen users scratch off the Capitals, in a response to one of my previous posts, before the first puck drop during Game 1.

 

For the record, I was going to cheer for Vegas had it been Tampa or Pittsburgh in the east. For some reason, I didn't think the Capitals would be in the picture. When they made it, I wanted to see Ovechkin finally win his Cup, so I had mixed feelings. But I was quite happy with Ovi winning it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, The Six said:

Imagine if Ovechkin had signed with the Penguins after one of those postseason losses. All the emotion, all the feelings of finally overcoming failure and redeeming yourself, would all be gone. Sure, his new team would be a juggernaut and he'd probably have 3 Cups by now, but they'd be hollow. Every postseason would turn into a joyless slog towards an inevitable result that nobody enjoys, and not even Ovechkin himself would be able to celebrate because he'd know that he did nothing more than hitch himself to a team that didn't need him.

 

There's probably a comparable player for this in another sport, but I'm drawing a blank right now.

 

36 minutes ago, smzimbabwe said:

The only one who comes to mind is Kevin Durant with Golden State.

 

Correct.

 

But there's also Marian Hossa...

 

2008: Joins Penguins, loses Cup to Red Wings

2009: Joins Red Wings, loses Cup to Penguins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, habsfan1 said:

 

@Ice_Cap I came up short on my prediction. But I came up closer than myself and others thought. I've seen users scratch off the Capitals, in a response to one of my previous posts, before the first puck drop during Game 1.

 

And for the record. I was going to pull for Vegas had it been Tampa or Pittsburgh in the east. For some reason, I didn't think the Capitals would be in the picture. When they made it, I wanted to see Ovechkin finally win his Cup, so I had mixed feelings. But I was quite happy with Ovi winning it.

To me the manner in which Vegas was awarded a team, and the manner in which the league allowed them to build the team, made them unlikeable. 

It also ruined the whole “Cinderella” aspect.

Had this been a traditionally assembled expansion team that still made it this far? That would be different. It wasn’t though. It was an expansion team gifted a Stanley Cup champion goaltender, just as an example. 

 

Obviously there’s a bit of a difference of opinion on that, but I think I can confidently say that I’m not alone in feeling the way I do. 

And I think the way the way a lot of people glommed onto this team just because they liked seeing other people annoyed was pretty mean spirited. 

 

Seeing a deserving player like Ovie finally break through? It was a great bonus on top of seeing this ridiculous thing finally put to rest. For now at least. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Watching the Caps celebrate their Cup win is so much more fun to watch than any of the last, say, 11 winners?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

To me the manner in which Vegas was awarded a team, and the manner in which the league allowed them to build the team, made them unlikeable. 

It also ruined the whole “Cinderella” aspect.

Had this been a traditionally assembled expansion team that still made it this far? That would be different. It wasn’t though. It was an expansion team gifted a Stanley Cup champion goaltender, just as an example. 

 

Obviously there’s a bit of a difference of opinion on that, but I think I can confidently say that I’m not alone in feeling the way I do. 

And I think the way the way a lot of people glommed onto this team just because they liked seeing other people annoyed was pretty mean spirited. 

 

Seeing a deserving player like Ovie finally break through? It was a great bonus on top of seeing this ridiculous thing finally put to rest. For now at least. 

 

It wasn't fair that teams could not protect their 2 goalies, if the team were in a dueling goaling scenario like Pittsburgh. If it was 1993 NHL expansion rules, or heck any other year than this year, Vegas would have had no shot whatsover. I completely see that side of things. It's clear Gary Bettman made favorable adjustments because he wanted Vegas to be competive because it's Vegas. I cannot imagine the Nordiques ever receiving these advantages, let alone a team.

 

When I said I'd cheer for Vegas, it's because I wanted anyone but Pittsburgh and Tampa already won a Cup, but I know this whole situation has two sides for and against. Sorry Cap, my Habs fell flat as usual & I never seen an expansion team do this since the Blues in 67. So even though I'm aware of that side of things, I just coudn't help myself cause I wanted to see any expansion team just go all the way because that doesn't happen everyday.

 

I'm a BASS listener (long time fan of the podcast, BTW ?) and I remember a comment made about the need for "justice". And now that it's all set and done, Vegas has officially experienced their first heartbreak moment, so in a way justice has been served. Vegas did not win the Cup they wanted. Only this one...

 

cut.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's a better result for the discerning hockey fan? Washington over Vegas or Washington over Winnipeg?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, habsfan1 said:

It wasn't fair that teams could not protect their 2 goalies, if the team were in a dueling goaling scenario like Pittsburgh. If it was 1993 NHL expansion rules, or heck any other year than this year, Vegas would have had no shot whatsover. I completely see that side of things. When I said I'd cheer for Vegas, it's because I wanted anyone but Pittsburgh and Tampa already won a Cup, but I know this whole situation has two sides for and against.

I get the appeal of seeing something that had never been done before. I really do. It’s why I was actually excited to see Tom Brady set the record for most SB wins for a QB despite it being Brady and the Pats.

Whatever you think of them? It was cool seeing history being made. 

 

This whole thing, however, just seemed forced. It was clear the team was given a multitude of chances no other team had before. It made it feel less special and more manufactured. 

 

6 minutes ago, habsfan1 said:

I'm a BASS listener (long time fan of the podcast, BTW ?<span> )

Thanks :D

 

6 minutes ago, habsfan1 said:

and I remember a comment made about the need for "justice". And now that it's all set and done, Vegas has officially experienced their first heartbreak moment, so in a way justice has been served. Vegas did not win the Cup they wanted.

That’s true. This team had everything going for them. Everything worked. Until it didn’t. 

 

4 minutes ago, DG_Now said:

What's a better result for the discerning hockey fan? Washington over Vegas or Washington over Winnipeg?

Washington over Winnipeg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, habsfan1 said:

 

It wasn't fair that teams could not protect their 2 goalies, if the team were in a dueling goaling scenario like Pittsburgh. If it was 1993 NHL expansion rules, or heck any other year than this year, Vegas would have had no shot whatsover.

Except the 1993 Expansion Draft did only have one protected goalie per team, and it did lead to a tandem team having to give up a fairly good goalie: 
vanbiesbrouck.jpg
If you recall, thanks to Vanbiesbrouck (and the trap, but w/e) the Panthers were arguably the best pre-Knights expansion team, missing the playoffs in 1994 and 1995 by a single point both years, before going to the Finals in 1996. (I don't count the '68 Blues or the '79 WHA merger teams, because those were under fairly unusual circumstances.)

There was quite a bit of goalie-moving before that draft, actually; Beezer was actually taken from Vancouver  because the Rangers traded him there beforehand so they could protect Mike Richter, as had the Nordiques traded Ron Hextall to the Islanders so they could protect Stephane Fiset.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been thinking a lot about this - why do new teams need to be crap and pay dues for n# of years until it's OK for them to be good?

 

used to think like that, but looking at it now through different eyes, wouldn't you want a new team in a new market to be competitive right away?  Obviously an expansion team winning a title is absurd and would delegitimize the whole thing, but having them be watchable and competitive enough to develop a good local following right away could only be a good thing, no?

 

Ideally, wouldn't a 6 or 7 seed be a good spot for a new NHL or NBA team?  Maybe .500 for an NFL or MLB team?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said:

I've been thinking a lot about this - why do new teams need to be crap and pay dues for n# of years until it's OK for them to be good?

 

used to think like that, but looking at it now through different eyes, wouldn't you want a new team in a new market to be competitive right away?  Obviously an expansion team winning a title is absurd and would delegitimize the whole thing, but having them be watchable and competitive enough to develop a good local following right away could only be a good thing, no?

 

Ideally, wouldn't a 6 or 7 seed be a good spot for a new NHL or NBA team?  Maybe .500 for an NFL or MLB team?


You do have a point with that, but the Knights weren't just a 6-7 seed, .500 team*, they were more like if the 1998 Devil Rays won 100 games and the AL Pennant.

* - Ironically with how deep the NHL is now compared to 18-25 years ago, I don't think they needed to alter the expansion draft rules this time - IMO a Knights team built under the older rules might've been a wild card, one-and-done team like you mentioned, instead of an immediate powerhouse.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said:

I've been thinking a lot about this - why do new teams need to be crap and pay dues for n# of years until it's OK for them to be good?

That’s not what bugs me. What bugs me is the manner in which the Knights’ roster was assembled. 

I would have been fine with it had a traditionally assembled expansion team gone on the run the went on. 

 

4 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said:

Obviously an expansion team winning a title is absurd and would delegitimize the whole thing...

There’s that too ;) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, mcj882000 said:

Except the 1993 Expansion Draft did only have one protected goalie per team, and it did lead to a tandem team having to give up a fairly good goalie: 
vanbiesbrouck.jpg
If you recall, thanks to Vanbiesbrouck (and the trap, but w/e) the Panthers were arguably the best pre-Knights expansion team, missing the playoffs in 1994 and 1995 by a single point both years, before going to the Finals in 1996. (I don't count the '68 Blues or the '79 WHA merger teams, because those were under fairly unusual circumstances.)

There was quite a bit of goalie-moving before that draft, actually; Beezer was actually taken from Vancouver  because the Rangers traded him there beforehand so they could protect Mike Richter, as had the Nordiques traded Ron Hextall to the Islanders so they could protect Stephane Fiset.

 

Yeah, that rule was previously applied at least once prior. Took 'em 3 years to make the Cup final, though.

 

Even looking back at previously successful expansion teams, no one had it better than Vegas, ever.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm of two minds concerning the Knights from here on out:
-My gut feeling tells me have nowhere to go but down now. They won't be surprising anyone anymore; they have actual expectations put upon them now; their guys who had career years are gonna want big fat raises, which will put a strain on their payroll, especially considering they've said they're gonna be spenders in July; plus, George "My Capitals couldn't get past the 2nd round" McPhee has to start making actual player moves that aren't just taking freebies from a more generous draft. They might tread water in the deep pool they've built themselves (I'm not gonna say they will miss the playoffs, because that'd be stupid), but I do think it's all underwater for them from here otherwise.

-Having said that, with their first year out of the way now, if they were to get back to the playoffs next year I'd probably be less salty about it - there is precedent for 2nd-year expansion teams making deep playoff runs, after all (both the Jaguars and Panthers played in the NFL's Conference Championships in 1996), so them making a run in 2019 wouldn't be that unusual on its own. I'll probably never fully get on their side, being another Sunbelt team in a league with too many failing Sunbelt teams as it is, not to mention their stupid name and idiot owner(s); but I at least won't consider their presence in the playoffs a league's reputation-damaging farce anymore. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, DG_Now said:

What's a better result for the discerning hockey fan? Washington over Vegas or Washington over Winnipeg?

Winnipeg over Washington

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

It was an expansion team gifted a Stanley Cup champion goaltender, just as an example. 

And I think the way the way a lot of people glommed onto this team just because they liked seeing other people annoyed was pretty mean spirited. 

 

In 1999, the Atlanta Thrashers paid about $80 million for an expansion team (I think...correct me if I'm wrong). In their first year, they finished last in their division, never got a off to a good start and some years later were off to Winnipeg... 17 years later, Foley pays $500 million for a franchise. Whether or not you think that a franchise should have gone to Las Vegas, I think that most people were okay with expansion parameters that would be a bit more generous...But what would be the ideal equation? I think that the biggest change in the expansion draft from '99 to'17 was that each team protected 2 less players (again please correct me if I'm wrong). In hindsight, should that maybe have been 1 less player? How could you know what numbers would be the right numbers? You and I know that there are many GMs in this league that would have taken the same opportunity that McPhee had...and would have botched it completely. Then, the VGK's would have finished out of the play-offs and then, those same parameters would have been okay, right?...

Yes, McPhee was given a better leg-up than his predecessors had, but jeez, give him some credit...he rode that pony like a boss. That was some masterful horse-trading there! The Fleury thing was just pure luck. Re: the goalie part of the equation, McPhee was working with the same guidelines as those before him. (I think that Fleury was considered past his prime). Even with McPhee's masterful job, how could he have projected that Fleury would have one of his best years ever, or that several players would elevate their games to the best they ever had or probably ever will. They hired the right coach, implementing the right system, which the players executed. Throw in a lot of puck-luck (how many times through the playoffs did we see Fleury "patting the post"?), and some fortunate timing...(had Hellebuyck been on his A-game in the Vegas series, it would have been Washington-Winnipeg). The whole Vegas success was lightning-in-a-bottle... At a time when the city needed something positive, I find it almost unbelievable that "that something" was given to them by ...a hockey team??...That's great for the fans in Las Vegas, and for the NHL.

As far as being "mean-spirited" I can't believe the hate that was heaped on the VGK franchise, the city and its fans in general. I kinda felt for the fellow board members like Lee Noire that live in Vegas.

I got somewhat involved in the Las Vegas process...I made up the T-shirts for these guys in Las Vegas on their "team-announcement-night"...

yNa1VcL.jpg

 

...pretty regular folks, with pretty regular jobs, life, etc., that are ecstatic about finally getting a team of their own. I'm happy for them.

 

Off the ice...yeah, the opening schtick before the games was a little cheesy...but so what. If it works for them..great.

I probably have more reason to dislike Foley as anyone...but I have to give credit where it's due...After the botched name reveal, they seemed to do everything right...the opening night tribute to the victims and responders of the shooting... Deryk Engellend's speech...the players involvement in the community...the relationship with the city...little things like hosting some members of the Humboldt community ...Golden Pipes allowing Winnipeg fans their "True North" moment during the anthem...(telling Carrie Underwood "No Thanks")...etc. etc....I thought they showed a lot of class.

Congratulations to the Golden Knights for a great season...and to the Caps...another great story...the near-perfect ending IMO.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

George McPhee, who traded Filip Forsberg for Martin Erat (who was J.R. Smith eight years before J.R. Smith) and wasted years of Ovechkin's career with terrible coaching from Dale Hunter and Adam Oates, does not become a good GM because the Florida Panthers give everyone who works there brain lesions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.