MLB: The Defunct Saga - Bibliography Added

[teeray01]

On 8/14/2019 at 1:13 AM, Frylock said:

I love all of these updates to the Expos, particularly the Whips inspired updates. My only criticism is that there is too much mixing of red and blue elements, it reminds me of the headache down in Texas. Red hats with blue jerseys, blue jerseys with read hats... Too much. Otherwise, I’m totally on board!

Nice updates on the latest version.  Great improvements each time, but the latest one is your best.  Well done!!

 

[SFGiants58]

On 8/13/2019 at 12:09 PM, bcon_731 said:

If these jerseys were for sale, you single handed make me a poorerer college student. 

 

Thanks!

 

On 8/13/2019 at 2:44 PM, ItDoesntMatter said:

I gotta say, you were right. I do like this version of the logo much better. Great stuff!

 

Thank you. I still prefer the "eM" to the "M-Fleur-de-Lis," but they're neck-and-neck in my book. 

 

On 8/13/2019 at 5:57 PM, BigRed618 said:

I love this latest version of the Expos logo you made. See, I too am a big follower of the Paul Rand-style movement. Simple shapes, no unnecessary details, just get to the point.

 

Thanks! I like how you've handled similar designs in your concepts. The simple, geometric format was something that I felt was important to the Expos' brand.

 

On 8/13/2019 at 7:23 PM, PowderedWater said:

What if you put a b where the fleur is? Like the b on the eMb logo. Just a thought.

 

Since "b" isn't an initial for the team (or part of the 1969-2004 logo's original intent), I figured it wouldn't work. Trying to cram those three letters into any of the designs makes things look too busy.

 

On 8/14/2019 at 12:13 AM, Frylock said:

I love all of these updates to the Expos, particularly the Whips inspired updates. My only criticism is that there is too much mixing of red and blue elements, it reminds me of the headache down in Texas. Red hats with blue jerseys, blue jerseys with read hats... Too much. Otherwise, I’m totally on board!

 

Thanks! I can see where you're coming from with the mixing of red and blue, but part of the whole point of the design would be that the two colors are co-dominant, kind of like what the Cubs did in the '90s-early '00s:

 

   

 

While I don't like this look as much for the Cubs (I prefer the 1958-68 road uniforms and the '80s blue jersey), it seems perfect for the Expos. I take it further with the rocket pop socks and the striping (as well as the red jersey and red caps with the blue), but it's a good way to keep the colors in balance. This is also a nice way to set the Expos apart from the fellow royal blue/red NL team. 

 

Anyway, here's the final Expos variation (but not the final Montréal baseball design, hint hint)!

 

MONTRÉAL EXPOS, PT. III - A little "eMb"ellishment 

 

This whole series of Expos concepts began with me being dissatisfied by the "eMb." I'll reiterate what I said in the Part II design with the same quotes:

 

Spoiler

 

(From 2014, by  @Gothamite)

 

Quote

The Expos logo, on the other hand, is a bloody mess. It's supposed to look like an "M", but doesn't. The muddy silhouette, moreover, is clearly comprised of a distinctive and unmistakeable "e", "l", and "b". Which was not the intended effect.

 

(From 2014:)

On 4/5/2014 at 6:57 PM, Gothamite said:

It's a terrible logo. A formless shape that supposed to maybe look like an "M" but doesn't, and contains some other shapes that are definitely supposed to be letters and some other shapes that people think are letters but aren't.

 

(From the Expos on "Newhart" thread), by @B-Rich

 

Quote

Back on topic: The Expos brand, in my opinion is one of the worst ever in sports.

 

Briefly, though, a few thoughts before I go into that.

1. Naming a team for a world's fair that occurred 2 years before the team first played is a goofy idea. I know the World's Fair was a great success and was a point of pride for those of Montreal, but seriously? Expos? Not to be outdone, Montreal did the same type of thing again a few years later, naming their first NASL team the Olympiques, one year after the city was awarded that event.

2. The concept of the logo, as one can see from the discussion on the board, the Newhart clip, and other references, is shoddy. Is it an "M" or not? There is clearly a lower case "e" in red, but is the right half of the logo a lowercase "b"? And what about the white section? Is it an "I", a "J", or something else, or negative space? Plus the whole original team name "expos" being done in lower case looks dumb. I am aware that use of all lowercase may have been a "thing" in the late 60s, but it still looked stupid.

 

(Technical material, relevant to a later concept)

 

(From this year's MLB thread, follow the arrows to the originals):

 

On 5/29/2019 at 7:53 AM, Gothamite said:

(In reference to the BiG)

Funny you should mention this, because I’ve always thought the logos were of a kind.  Separated by less than a decade, both use sweeping lines and bulbous curves.  They both combine multiple letterforms into a larger image.  They very much start from the same place. 

 

The difference is that the Brewers logo succeeds and the Expos logo fails.  Spectacularly.

 

The evidence for that is patently obvious; when you show somebody the hidden letters in the glove, they invariably say “OMG HOW DID I NOT SEE THAT BEFORE THATISBRILLIANT”.   When you show somebody the hidden “e” and “b” in the Expos’ “M”, the response is usually some variation on “Huh.  But what does the white “l” stand for?  Or “Is that really supposed to be an M?”

 

Even knowing what’s supposed to be in the “elb” logo doesn’t help, because they’re still not clear.  The “e” reads clearly, the rest not so much. 

 

(And this isn’t a biased fan talking; I don’t particularly love the glove logo, and it isn’t even in my top five Brewers logos of all time.  But I can’t deny that it’s really well-designed, and it just works.)

 

The Expos logo is iconic, but that doesn’t make it good.  It’s iconic in the way a Ford Pinto is.  Or Enron.  Longevity and nostalgia spread a thin layer of cheap gloss on a very, very bad design. 

 

On 5/24/2019 at 10:19 AM, SFGiants58 said:

The Expos’ wordmarks, colors, and jersey designs were fine. Sure, 1992-04 designs could use a tweaking to get them less “bulbous” looking, but they were still good.

 

The “eMb”/“Meb”/“elbM” is one of the single worst logos in baseball history. I think it’s an ugly blob that fails to accomplish its goal. It tries to cram too much into one design, creates ambiguity over the various shapes (hence why people think there’s a hidden “l,” when there is none), and the letters are poorly-constructed.

 

Say what you want about the “curly W”/“interlocking DC” or any other part of the Nationals’ identity, it’s at least clear what all the letters are meant to be. The team has some inconsistencies, sure, but it has no elements as awful as the “Meb” blob. Heck, the “M-blob” is also a terrible example of the “French Canadian” style. Compare it to what the Alouettes and Nordiques did:

 

 

I don’t even like the Nordiques’ crest that much, but it’s better than the Expos’ design. Affiliates also nailed the aesthetic of the club without having a blob logo.

 

 

I don’t mind the name coming back, especially for how Expo ‘67 was such a shining moment in the city’s history (without the baggage of what happen in 1976 and how that Olympics kind of doomed the Expos). I just don’t want that crummy logo back.

On 5/29/2019 at 10:32 AM, Digby said:

If the “elb” formation is nonsensical, don’t make your damn logo look like it says “elb”.

On 5/28/2019 at 6:29 PM, Gothamite said:

 

On 5/28/2019 at 5:09 PM, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

Contemporary reports described the logo as being an M, and containing an E (with no mention of a B).

 

 

 

The team later referred to a B in its official description of the logo. But the lack of any contemporary allusion to a B leads to the conclusion that the logo was not intended to include that letter.

 

Todd Radom wrote the whole matter up on his blog several years ago.

 

Todd’s piece is fantastic.  And he nails the problem with their eMb logo:

 

Quote

The club seemingly gave a definitive explanation starting in the late 80s and early 90s—"The Expos logo is composed of three letters, the largest of which is the overall stylized "M" for Montréal. Represented in the lower left of the logo is a lower case "e" for expos and on the right hand side of the logo, in blue, is the letter "b" for baseball." While this may stand as the final word, it seems unusual that this explanation came some two decades after the logo's debut.

 

The fact that they were still developing a changing explanation after decades of use shows us how lousy it really is. 

 

 

One of the most influential (to me, at least) was reading what @B-Rich had to say about it. He looked at the logo's flaws structurally, pointing out why it might not have worked as an "M" with additional shapes. Details in the spoiler tags:

 

Spoiler

Quote

3. Now on to the design itself. As per the earlier discussion, there is a general consensus backed up by the official description that the logo in its entirety represents a capital "M", with big rounded serifs on both bottom ends. However, it is not just any "M". but what I would call a "closed" M. For comparison's sake, let's look at an open "E" and a closed "E":

Both adequately convey the letter "E", but the one on the right is "closed" with only lines and no space differentiating the arms of the capital "E".

Let's start by disregarding the 3 colors and the "e" and "b", and begin with a look at the outline of the "M", provided by Cesarano:

Now, to turn this into an "M", you would need to add three lines; one from the top down and two from the bottom up. The indentations in between the rounded curves indicate where these lines would go (see 1st picture below). But if you add the lines, keeping them parallel with the existing parallel outside lines of the "M" (and overall italicization of the logo), look at what you come up with (2nd pic below):

It's unbalanced and irregular. It doesn't work. We can try a different track, and point the interior lines to the midpoint of each opposite curve (see 1st pic below). It looks a little better, but is still something that is imbalanced and irregular. The fact that all vertical lines are not parallel works against the eyes. It may be better if the lines separating the "legs" of the M diminished to a vanishing point, rather than the straight edge ends that I used here, but I don't think so:

That being said, could the original Montreal Expos "M" logo (1st pic below) be tweaked and fixed? I took a shot at it, based upon maintaining the parallel lines concept and the closed "M". I also added a "hole" to better advertise the "b". I tried several iterations to mirror the curlicue of the "e" to make the loop of the "b", but none of them worked. I think the capital "M" is a little more noticeable-- the curl of the "e" indicates the break in between two legs, and the white/blue centered break does the same-- but that's about the only improvement.

 

This analysis (and the fix) provided an excellent starting point for realizing a repaired "eMb." These goals included:

 

1. Enlarge the hole on the "e" and create a hole in the "b" (to fulfill the retcon outlined by Todd Radom)

2. Use the "e" to point out one of the upward lines in the "M."

3. Eliminate the "l" or "j" in the logo that emerged via accident.

4. Thicken the blue outline on the white part.

5. Make the "M" look like it has curved-up strokes on each end.

 

With these tasks in mind, I have rendered a fix to the "eMb."

 

 

This one accomplishes the goals of the original, while also incorporating the "b" retcon and eliminating the unintended shape.

 

The other big fix was with the Clarendon of the '69-'91 Expos. The variant they used looked far too rough and oddly distorted. Using a combination of Clarendon BT (for the wordmarks) and two of its condensed variants (regular and bold), I've cleaned up that aspect of the design as well. Here's a comparison:

 

 

The logo sheet uses my standard "abstract" Expos format (description in the link), with the same roundel and wordmarks adapted for the new fonts and logos.

 

 

The uniforms now feature the new "eMb" and wordmark, while also using Clarendon Condensed Bold NOB's. I figured that going all-in with the font would be a good step towards cohesiveness. Clarendon Extra Condensed would be the version used for long names. 

 

 

The alternates include the standard blue and red jersey, with the royal blue one now featuring an updated "Montréal" script. It has a less "pointy" look, therefore bringing it closer to the '92-'04 script. 

 

 

The second set of alternates includes the pinwheel cap on the home uniform (where it is best used) and a Canada Day jersey with the "eMb." Note: using white outlines around all elements instead of outlining red in royal blue is the best way to handle multiple colors on the powder blue top.

 

 

The jacket features the new "eMb" and wordmark.

 

 

While I am still not a fan of the "eMb," I think I've solved some of its issues without mutilating it too much. It could have used a bit of a tweak over the years (like the Blue Jays' bird, the Stick-in-Rink, and the Atlanta Hawks and Falcons' birds), something that I've hopefully accomplished. C+C is appreciated, as always!

 

I'd also like to cite @the admiral's Quebec Nordiques concept as a big inspiration for the shield/flag-based designs. It was a way to tie into local iconography without trying to develop another abstract secondary or a bland roundel.

 

Up next, the Expos weren't always going to be the Expos. What could they have been?

[_DietDrPepper_]

I’m sorry but I don’t think this salvages the “emb” while the e and b are more pronounced, the already invisible and hard to read m, becomes less of the prominent feature, creating more of the shapeless blog you tried to get away from. I think splitting the middle of the m between the blue of the b and the white of the... white, creates an awkward point that emphasizes the already awkward white J like shape. Honestly, I don’t think the “emb” in theory could be fix while maintaining most features like you did here. Your previous incarnations of the updated circular “em” logo is much better. 

Thats actually one of the reasons, although people seem to miss the expos dearly, I don’t, from a design standpoint, everything about them was disgusting. Even from the play onto the field to the uniforms they wore. That’s nothing against your designs though, you’re work is phenomenal, I dont think any one could really improve the “emb” logo.

[BigRed618]

6 hours ago, SFGiants58 said:

"Naming a team for a world's fair that occurred 2 years before the team first played is a goofy idea. I know the World's Fair was a great success and was a point of pride for those of Montreal, but seriously? Expos? Not to be outdone, Montreal did the same type of thing again a few years later, naming their first NASL team the Olympiques, one year after the city was awarded that event."

 

I like to think the name Expos has a second, deeper meaning besides just commemorating an event that happened 50+ years ago. After all, this was the World's Fair. I wasn’t alive yet to see the last WF in the US, but I can understand how big a deal the Expo can be. It’s a celebration of the achievements of the world, and more importantly, it’s a sneak peek into what's to come in the future. When people walk into these beautifully designed pavilions, they’re filled with hope, inspiration, and dreams of a glorious tomorrow. 

 

I think that's what the Expos were going for with their image. Never stop dreaming. Never give up hope. Remember the future.

[teeray01]

Honestly, I'm not a fan of the eMb update.  I still think Part II b is your best work on this one.  Would be cool to see what could have been had they chose the name Royals instead.

[coco1997]

I actually really like the updated “eMb.” It’s much clearer to me, and I imagine it would be to Joe Q. Public, that there’s an “e” and “b” within that strange shape. 

[sky1324]

While the updated eMb is nice, it's not personally what I'd go for. I think the best way to update it is to split the M, and make the right side with the b resemble the side with the e, in that the b kinda fades into the M. If you were to make it so that you could write all three letters with one stroke, that's how the logo should be. I can't really express it with words, so I made a very quick example in Paint. Ideally, the M would be somewhat open, to allow the idea of the letters flowing into each other be more obvious.

 

https://imgur.com/a/JzSxbLM (Imgur never seems to work for me, but here's the link.)

[Dalcowboyfan92]

It's a slight upgrade over what they had, but I'm not used to the donut hole in the B, probably because it never existed and it's taking a while to get used to that visually in the update.

[MJD7]

I think you did about as much as you can, but I have to say this pretty much shows there’s not much that can be done with the Expos’ logo to redeem it.  Adding the hole in the “b” does provide nice visual symmetry with the “e,” while also making the shape of the “M” slightly more apparent. Your use of the Clarendon is nice and the two options with the pinwheel caps are my favorites. Nice job overall.

[B-Rich]

On 8/18/2019 at 12:40 AM, SFGiants58 said:

One of the most influential (to me, at least) was reading what @B-Rich had to say about it. He looked at the logo's flaws structurally, pointing out why it might not have worked as an "M" with additional shapes. 

 

This analysis (and the fix) provided an excellent starting point for realizing a repaired "eMb." These goals included:

 

1. Enlarge the hole on the "e" and create a hole in the "b" (to fulfill the retcon outlined by Todd Radom)

2. Use the "e" to point out one of the upward lines in the "M."

3. Eliminate the "l" or "j" in the logo that emerged via accident.

4. Thicken the blue outline on the white part.

5. Make the "M" look like it has curved-up strokes on each end.

 

With these tasks in mind, I have rendered a fix to the "eMb."

 

 

Good work, young padawan. 

 

I like your redoing of the bottom curve of the "e" to connect to the point of the upward line of the "M".

 

 

Incidentally, I just noticed your personalized rank/sig line, "The Mellow Midori".   A bottle of that green liqueur travels with me to the family beach vacation every year, to be combined (many times) with white rum, pineapple juice, and a wedge of lime.  Essentially, a 'Pearl Harbor' substituting rum for vodka.  Delicious, visually attractive tropical drink that doesn't go flat while you're sipping it on under a beach umbrella.

[Joke Insurance]

With the current mulling of the Orioles moving to Nashville, would you consider doing a concept on them?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=baltimore+orioles+nashville

[PrimalCookie]

The new eMb is great, and an incredible improvement. I really can't tell if I prefer the eM or this new eMb more. 

[MilSox]

On 8/18/2019 at 7:17 AM, BigRed618 said:

 

I like to think the name Expos has a second, deeper meaning besides just commemorating an event that happened 50+ years ago. After all, this was the World's Fair. I wasn’t alive yet to see the last WF in the US, but I can understand how big a deal the Expo can be. It’s a celebration of the achievements of the world, and more importantly, it’s a sneak peek into what's to come in the future. When people walk into these beautifully designed pavilions, they’re filled with hope, inspiration, and dreams of a glorious tomorrow. 

 

I think that's what the Expos were going for with their image. Never stop dreaming. Never give up hope. Remember the future.

This.  It's hard for anyone born after the older Gen Xers to imagine now what a big deal it used to be to host a World's Fair, but many cities that hosted them still cite that as the point where they were able to establish themselves as a world class city.  Montreal is no exception.  Seattle, which hosted in 1962, is the same way.  Two of the four stars on Chicago's flag symbolize the expos they hosted in 1893 and 1933.  Even New York, which was already well established by 1939, though enough of hosting that year's expo that all three of their teams wore a patch symbolizing it.



Sidenote: The 1939 expo was the first time a significant amount of people saw television for the first time.  The first baseball and football games ever on television were part of that exhibit.

[The_Admiral]

all alone at the '39 World's Fair

eighty dolls yelling "patch with large orange ball"

[coco1997]

I wonder if the "M" part of the "eMb" would be more apparent if the top of the logo and the middle part between the "e" and "b" was squared off? 

[Whittier S]

The Expo left a significant mark on Montreal's architecture, with the pavilions still in use in various capacities. It's arguably the most important modern architecture in the city. So Expos make sense as a team name, even today. The one city where the name would make more sense is Vancouver--ask a Vancouverite about Expo '86 to see what I mean.

[MilSox]

Vancouver did have a team named for the 1986 Expo at one point. 

[coco1997]

3 minutes ago, NicDB said:

Vancouver did have a team named for the 1986 Expo at one point. 

 

Is that Tom Cruise?

[DellFan Productions]

1 hour ago, coco1997 said:

 

Is that Tom Cruise?

It almost looks like him from the cover.

[SFGiants58]

On 8/18/2019 at 1:28 AM, BellaSpurs said:

I’m sorry but I don’t think this salvages the “emb” while the e and b are more pronounced, the already invisible and hard to read m, becomes less of the prominent feature, creating more of the shapeless blog you tried to get away from. I think splitting the middle of the m between the blue of the b and the white of the... white, creates an awkward point that emphasizes the already awkward white J like shape. Honestly, I don’t think the “emb” in theory could be fix while maintaining most features like you did here. Your previous incarnations of the updated circular “em” logo is much better. 

Thats actually one of the reasons, although people seem to miss the expos dearly, I don’t, from a design standpoint, everything about them was disgusting. Even from the play onto the field to the uniforms they wore. That’s nothing against your designs though, you’re work is phenomenal, I dont think any one could really improve the “emb” logo.

 

I'm inclined to agree with you here. While I think my tweaks do improve the design, I'm not sure it goes far enough in fixing the concept behind it. I like the "eM" or the "M Fleur-de-Lis" more than the fixed "eMb" (if we're talking abstract designs).

 

You're not alone in not missing the Expos. I think it's better for the business of baseball to have a team in DC rather than in Montréal (the US capital vs. the major metropole of French Canada). The lack of the messy "eMb" also helps matters.

 

I'd also like to add that I consider expanding into Montréal a mistake, given what happened with the Separatists, the exile of the business community, and the failure of Le Stade Olympique. If MLB had to do it over again, Montréal would never have had a team. However, if MLB had to expand to Canada in 1969, Toronto would have been a far safer bet. Exhibition Stadium, while not particularly good for baseball, would probably be better as a long-term home than Le Stade Olympique. 

 

On 8/18/2019 at 7:17 AM, BigRed618 said:

 

I like to think the name Expos has a second, deeper meaning besides just commemorating an event that happened 50+ years ago. After all, this was the World's Fair. I wasn’t alive yet to see the last WF in the US, but I can understand how big a deal the Expo can be. It’s a celebration of the achievements of the world, and more importantly, it’s a sneak peek into what's to come in the future. When people walk into these beautifully designed pavilions, they’re filled with hope, inspiration, and dreams of a glorious tomorrow. 

 

I think that's what the Expos were going for with their image. Never stop dreaming. Never give up hope. Remember the future.

On 8/19/2019 at 5:18 PM, NicDB said:

This.  It's hard for anyone born after the older Gen Xers to imagine now what a big deal it used to be to host a World's Fair, but many cities that hosted them still cite that as the point where they were able to establish themselves as a world class city.  Montreal is no exception.  Seattle, which hosted in 1962, is the same way.  Two of the four stars on Chicago's flag symbolize the expos they hosted in 1893 and 1933.  Even New York, which was already well established by 1939, though enough of hosting that year's expo that all three of their teams wore a patch symbolizing it.



Sidenote: The 1939 expo was the first time a significant amount of people saw television for the first time.  The first baseball and football games ever on television were part of that exhibit.

On 8/19/2019 at 5:49 PM, the admiral said:

all alone at the '39 World's Fair

eighty dolls yelling "patch with large orange ball"

On 8/21/2019 at 8:09 AM, Whittier S said:

The Expo left a significant mark on Montreal's architecture, with the pavilions still in use in various capacities. It's arguably the most important modern architecture in the city. So Expos make sense as a team name, even today. The one city where the name would make more sense is Vancouver--ask a Vancouverite about Expo '86 to see what I mean.

 

I'm glad we got to the World's Fair talk! Taking late-19th/early-20th century history courses in both undergrad and grad school, the World's Fairs always brought with them an exceptional gravitas. Dreams of future technology, celebrations of culture, and a constant desire for glory are a constant. It makes sense why people commemorate them, be it through team names or anniversary celebrations (e.g., Seattle in 2012). Granted, a lot of the early ones are particularly famous for advancing imperialism, promoting scientific racism (e.g., St. Louis in 1904, more than just Rat Poison and Brandy), and general dismissal of non-Western European culture. Still, there's a kind of exceptionalism brought about by hosting the World's Fair, one which the Expos honored fairly well.

 

Of course, you can also look at Expo '67 as the "last hurrah" of Montréal as Canada's cultural capital. The passage of Bill 101 and the exodus of Anglophones/the business community to Toronto/Southern Ontario kind of trashed that for Montréal's status. That's the more cynical take on the name, a reminder of what the city once was before "the Separatists and their language police tried to ruin it." I might be getting a bit political here, but it's relevant to the topic at hand.

 

If you want to know what song Admiral is referencing,

 

 

On 8/21/2019 at 4:16 PM, NicDB said:

Vancouver did have a team named for the 1986 Expo at one point. 

On 8/21/2019 at 4:19 PM, coco1997 said:

 

Is that Tom Cruise?

On 8/21/2019 at 5:40 PM, DellFan Productions said:

It almost looks like him from the cover.

 

Yeah, I can kind of see a bit of Tom Cruise in him. Tom's face is a bit wider, his nose is far more narrow, and the hair is slightly different. Take this meme from Top Gun:

 

 

Not that similar, but the same "vibe." I'm not a big Tom Cruise guy, as I only really like him in Magnolia, A Few Good Men, and Interview with a Vampire (he's easily the best part of that movie, carrying a sleepwalking Brad Pitt and a tiny Kirsten Dunst). 

 

On 8/18/2019 at 9:58 AM, teeray01 said:

Honestly, I'm not a fan of the eMb update.  I still think Part II b is your best work on this one.  Would be cool to see what could have been had they chose the name Royals instead.

 

Thanks. Let's just say that Royals (or more accurately, a translation will come soon).

 

On 8/18/2019 at 10:11 AM, coco1997 said:

I actually really like the updated “eMb.” It’s much clearer to me, and I imagine it would be to Joe Q. Public, that there’s an “e” and “b” within that strange shape. 

 

Thanks!

 

On 8/18/2019 at 10:19 AM, QueenCitySwarm said:

While the updated eMb is nice, it's not personally what I'd go for. I think the best way to update it is to split the M, and make the right side with the b resemble the side with the e, in that the b kinda fades into the M. If you were to make it so that you could write all three letters with one stroke, that's how the logo should be. I can't really express it with words, so I made a very quick example in Paint. Ideally, the M would be somewhat open, to allow the idea of the letters flowing into each other be more obvious.

 

https://imgur.com/a/JzSxbLM (Imgur never seems to work for me, but here's the link.)

 

Thanks! I'll get that link working for you (right-click "copy image address" when hovering over the image, then paste here).

 

 

I see where you're going with this and I can take it the rest of the way!

 

 

I'm not sure the "b" can really parallel the "e," given how the master outline and the "b" are the same color.

 

On 8/18/2019 at 6:36 PM, Dalcowboyfan92 said:

It's a slight upgrade over what they had, but I'm not used to the donut hole in the B, probably because it never existed and it's taking a while to get used to that visually in the update.

 

Thanks! It took some getting used to for me as well.

 

On 8/18/2019 at 8:19 PM, MJD7 said:

I think you did about as much as you can, but I have to say this pretty much shows there’s not much that can be done with the Expos’ logo to redeem it.  Adding the hole in the “b” does provide nice visual symmetry with the “e,” while also making the shape of the “M” slightly more apparent. Your use of the Clarendon is nice and the two options with the pinwheel caps are my favorites. Nice job overall.

 

Thanks! I'd like to think I took it as far as it could go without "mutilating" or altering it beyond recognition (its saving grace). 

 

On 8/19/2019 at 9:30 AM, B-Rich said:

 

Good work, young padawan. 

 

I like your redoing of the bottom curve of the "e" to connect to the point of the upward line of the "M".

 

 

Incidentally, I just noticed your personalized rank/sig line, "The Mellow Midori".   A bottle of that green liqueur travels with me to the family beach vacation every year, to be combined (many times) with white rum, pineapple juice, and a wedge of lime.  Essentially, a 'Pearl Harbor' substituting rum for vodka.  Delicious, visually attractive tropical drink that doesn't go flat while you're sipping it on under a beach umbrella.

 

Thanks! I'm glad you like it, given how your guide was invaluable for finding a way to improve the design. 

 

 

You know, I ought to try the cocktail you described here! I love a tropical cocktail every now and then.

 

On 8/19/2019 at 2:44 PM, Joke Insurance said:

With the current mulling of the Orioles moving to Nashville, would you consider doing a concept on them?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=baltimore+orioles+nashville

 

Judging by the reports, I doubt much will come of it.

 

On 8/19/2019 at 3:50 PM, Magic Dynasty said:

The new eMb is great, and an incredible improvement. I really can't tell if I prefer the eM or this new eMb more. 

 

Thanks!

 

On 8/19/2019 at 6:00 PM, coco1997 said:

I wonder if the "M" part of the "eMb" would be more apparent if the top of the logo and the middle part between the "e" and "b" was squared off? 

 

It kind of does, but it loses what makes the "eMb" so special - curviness.

 

 

It's like the Minecraft Expos. 

 

The next team should be up shortly.