BJ Sands

NHL changes 2019-20

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1 minute ago, Morgo said:

The 1988 redesign was about imitating the Raiders, not trailblazing new ground.

That was new ground for hockey. And it seems to follow the 90s design trends you arbitrarily decided are the only benchmark a design needs to have to be considered 90s.

 

4 hours ago, Morgo said:

When it was worn isn't really the point. 

It very much is. A jersey designed in the late 80s, that was worn through the 90s, and helped kickstart trends that took off in the 90s is a 90s design. The team called it a "90s" throwback!

 

To me a jersey that was designed and/or worn during the 90s is a 90s design. I don't care if it meets your arbitrary gatekeeping. And yeah, 1988 is pretty damn close considering the Kings were one of the first NHL teams to usher in the metalics and darker colour trend.

 

 

 

 

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Considering the most important moment in franchise history (acquiring Wayne Gretzky) came in that white jersey, it's not a shock they're bringing it back; even if I would have liked to see the early-00's purple set come back in some form (though maybe they'll do it for their Stadium Series game this season, who knows).

 

And technically, the actual design debuted in 88-89, but that's so absurdly tail-end 80's that I'd say it's just easier to call it a 90's design. They wore it for most of the decade anyways, so there's no real reason not to call it that.

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1 hour ago, Ice_Cap said:

That was new ground for hockey. And it seems to follow the 90s design trends you arbitrarily decided are the only benchmark a design needs to have to be considered 90s.


What's arbitrary about listing the actual characteristics that defined the aesthetics of the decade? 
 

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It very much is. A jersey designed in the late 80s, that was worn through the 90s, and helped kickstart trends that took off in the 90s is a 90s design.


Kings debut their black jersey in 1988, 2 full seasons pass before we see another team follow suit.

Northstars debut their black jersey in 1992, two teams follow suit the next season.  Devils add black the season after that, Flames do the same the season after that.  Then the season after that we see the Sabres going to black, red and metallic silver. 

 

The Northstars and Sharks started the trends of the 90's.  The Kings were copying the Raiders which is further evidenced by the fact they toned down their striping during the change.
 

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The team called it a "90s" throwback!


They can call it whatever they want.  By that logic the Habs are wearing 90's throwbacks because that's what they wore throughout the decade.

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28 minutes ago, DastardlyRidleylash said:

 

And technically, the actual design debuted in 88-89, but that's so absurdly tail-end 80's that I'd say it's just easier to call it a 90's design. They wore it for most of the decade anyways, so there's no real reason not to call it that.

The fact is that culture rarely segments itself so neatly into decades. When we talk about "the 50s" we're describing a period of time that lasted into the early/mid 60s. What we think of as the "60s" is really the mid/late 60s.

 

Design isn't any different. It's not like the calendar turned 1 January 1990 and everyone decided to adopt teal, navy, and purple. Design trends peculate. The first case of "black for black's sake," one of the hallmarks of 90s design, came in 1981 when the North Stars added it to their home whites. That was still very restrained, however. Black didn't appear on the road greens, and was absent from the helmets and pants. Then 1988 rolls around and the North Stars commit to the black. It's added to the road green sweaters, it becomes the dominant pants colour, and it's added to the logo full time. It's also the year the Kings traded purple and gold for black and silver.

The trends we see emerging throughout the 80s- the addition of darker colours and the experimentation with metallic shades- is built upon and expanded upon in the 90s. The North Stars redesigned again in 1991, just three years later, adopting an all black road look and a new logo that traded athletic gold in for metallic old gold. OF COURSE that was a response to what the Kings were doing.

And the Stars took that identity to Dallas, where it was eventually built off of to get the ASG-style jerseys that we think of as the quintessential "90s" Stars sweaters. That identity, however, isn't possible without the identity that preceded it. And that isn't possible if they don't look to what the Kings were doing in '88 for inspiration. And then these trends get built upon and eventually we have the more out-there designs we think of when we think "90s."

 

So yeah. The Kings' 1988-1998 identity is very much a 90s design. It helped usher in the major trends of the decade, even if it is pretty restrained. The first steps of a bold new direction usually are.

 

16 minutes ago, Morgo said:

Kings debut their black jersey in 1988

Again, assuming the trends that defined the 90s can't predate the calendar year of 1990 is a fallacy.

If you'd like another example? Teal and purple were dominant colours in 90s design. Teams across the Big Four adopted one or both throughout the decade. You know what sports uniform kicked that trend off? The Charlotte Hornets. Who debuted their eye-catching and different teal and purple uniforms in 1988. The same year the Kings went with their black and silver look. That 1988 Hornets uniform is Patient Zero for the Sharks, Marlins, Raptors, Bucks, Jaguars, Ravens, Diamond Backs, etc... 90s uniforms.

As explained above? The Kings' '88 uniforms very much helped usher in the design trends of the decade to follow.

 

16 minutes ago, Morgo said:

What's arbitrary about listing the actual characteristics that defined the aesthetics of the decade? 

Because you're basically declaring that only the very experimental stuff to be authentically "90s" and that is at best taking too narrow of view of how design trends work and at worst being obstinate to try and redefine what "90s" uniforms are to fit your own personal tastes.

You can't get to the Capitals' slate blue and bronze eagle or the Oilers' navy and copper if you don't have the North Stars/Stars' black, green, and metallic gold. Which likely doesn't occur if the Kings' don't use their acquisition of the greatest player of all time to roll out new and eyecatching black and silver sweaters.

 

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28 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

The fact is that culture rarely segments itself so neatly into decades. When we talk about "the 50s" we're describing a period of time that lasted into the early/mid 60s. What we think of as the "60s" is really the mid/late 60s.


I mean, :censored:, new wave & synthpop music really got the ball rolling in ~1977-78, and grunge & alt-rock likewise flared up in the late-80s. Still doesn't stop us from calling them 80s & 90s music respectively, because they dominated those decades after they hit their stride.
 

38 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

The first case of "black for black's sake," one of the hallmarks of 90s design, came in 1981 when the North Stars added it to their home whites. That was still very restrained, however. Black didn't appear on the road greens, and was absent from the helmets and pants. Then 1988 rolls around and the North Stars commit to the black. It's added to the road green sweaters, it becomes the dominant pants colour, and it's added to the logo full time. It's also the year the Kings traded purple and gold for black and silver.


Don't forget too, that the North Stars were apparently set to introduce a black away jersey in '81 but shelved it at the last minute, possibly because they went to the Cup Finals (not that it stopped them a decade later)
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That was why the home suddenly had a black stripe on it, to better match this jersey that never saw the light of day.
(That jersey feels so wrong and I'm glad they shelved it, yet I actually kinda like the striping on it, go figure.)

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1 hour ago, Ice_Cap said:

The fact is that culture rarely segments itself so neatly into decades. When we talk about "the 50s" we're describing a period of time that lasted into the early/mid 60s. What we think of as the "60s" is really the mid/late 60s.  Design isn't any different. It's not like the calendar turned 1 January 1990 and everyone decided to adopt teal, navy, and purple. Design trends peculate. The first case of "black for black's sake," one of the hallmarks of 90s design, came in 1981 when the North Stars added it to their home whites. That was still very restrained, however. Black didn't appear on the road greens, and was absent from the helmets and pants. Then 1988 rolls around and the North Stars commit to the black. It's added to the road green sweaters, it becomes the dominant pants colour, and it's added to the logo full time. It's also the year the Kings traded purple and gold for black and silver.

The trends we see emerging throughout the 80s- the addition of darker colours and the experimentation with metallic shades- is built upon and expanded upon in the 90s. The North Stars redesigned again in 1991, just three years later, adopting an all black road look and a new logo that traded athletic gold in for metallic old gold. OF COURSE that was a response to what the Kings were doing.


Emphasis on black is just one characteristic of 90's hockey uniforms though.  The Kings checked off that box in 1988 but that was the only characteristic the uniforms contained.  Without black, that's a traditional design.

 

The Northstars redesign & Sharks inaugural jerseys checked off multiple boxes which is why I'm more comfortable calling them kick-starters for the shift in aesthetics.  As you said, the Northstars had already experimented with black as early as 1981 so they weren't necessarily copying the Kings.  It was more of a natural evolution (or devolution depending on your taste).

 

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So yeah. The Kings' 1988-1998 identity is very much a 90s design. It helped usher in the major trends of the decade, even it is pretty restrained. The first steps of a bold new direction usually are.


It arguably ushered in one trend.  But there were teams using black as a base before 1988 too.
 

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Again, assuming the trends that defined the 90s can't predate the calendar year of 1990 is a fallacy.

 

One of the trends does.  Most of them started when the 90's had already rolled around.
 

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Because you're basically declaring that only the very experimental stuff to be authentically "90s" and that is at best taking too narrow of view of how design trends work and at worst being obstinate to try and redefine what "90s" uniforms are to fit your own personal tastes..

 

The 90's were an experimental decade.  They tried everything and that was the main characteristic of that decade's design trends.  Some of the designs were awful, some of them were great.  You didn't really see the return to retro aesthetics until a few years after the RBK Edge implementation.
 

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No, the league was starting to calm down before the Edge sweaters. The home/road changeover of '03 might be a better marker: the Coyotes went from having like eight different colors to CCCP ripoffs, the Mighty Ducks had their script/lace-up third, the Wild had their roundel/lace-up third, the Flames demoted the Firesnot crest to secondary-only and went with the black C and (again!) lace-up collar at home, and a bunch of teams started wearing throwbacks, starting with the Oilers and Habs in the Heritage Classic. There was still a lot of wacky stuff going on, for sure, but the vintage promotion and overnight propagation of lace-up collars pointed us to where the league was heading, aesthetically speaking, if you were paying attention.

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Yeah yeah yeah I know I'm several pages behind...

 

The leaping panther is the first thing I think of when I think of the Florida Panthers and should absolutely return in some capacity.

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I disagree. They chose to abandon their logo and color scheme for something new, I think they have to commit to it now. It's either still their logo or it isn't, you know?

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34 minutes ago, the admiral said:

No, the league was starting to calm down before the Edge sweaters. The home/road changeover of '03 might be a better marker: the Coyotes went from having like eight different colors to CCCP ripoffs, the Mighty Ducks had their script/lace-up third, the Wild had their roundel/lace-up third, the Flames demoted the Firesnot crest to secondary-only and went with the black C and (again!) lace-up collar at home, and a bunch of teams started wearing throwbacks, starting with the Oilers and Habs in the Heritage Classic. There was still a lot of wacky stuff going on, for sure, but the vintage promotion and overnight propagation of lace-up collars pointed us to where the league was heading, aesthetically speaking, if you were paying attention.

 

Yeah it was starting to calm down but the league hardly embraced retro aesthetics to the degree they did after the Edge switchover.  This era was nice because you saw existing designs being improved in subtle ways.  The Flames bringing back red, going with a laceup while retaining the chevron striping & black being a great example.  This short-lived era felt like a natural evolution of what was already established while the aftermath of the Edge implementation felt like a gross over-correction.

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Florida are dumb for abandoning their leaping panther motif.

 

The kings throwbacks are nice. But that logo is trash. Not saying their current shield is great, but to say the throwbacks are better just because nostalgia...thats invalid to me. Bring back the crown.

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LA Kings Latest to Throw Back to 90s, Announce Heritage Uniform Nights

September 1, 2019 - 10:23 AM

What was I just saying about the ’90s being “in”? Add the Los Angeles Kings to the list of teams getting in on the 90s wave, unveiling their heritage jersey of that era via a surprise midnight Tweet on Saturday […]

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14 minutes ago, SportsLogos.Net News said:

What was I just saying about the ’90s being “in”?

You said it ChrisBot 2000!

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The way I see it, a "90's design" is a jersey that was designed in that general era of aesthetics (so like '88-2000, since by 2003, the design aesthetic had settled tremendously). You don't get a team as boldly experimental with their colors as the Sharks without the massive overhaul the Kings pulled and made work or the experimentations of the North Stars (more pertinent, since the Stars are the Sharks' parent franchise).

 

Yes, the Sharks were still using a traditional base, but they were one of the hottest-selling jerseys when they debuted for a reason; they absolutely were entrenched in the style of design that was so popular in that era. Not every 90's team needs to be designed like the Mighty Ducks or Avalanche to have a distinctly 90's aesthetic.

 

 

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17 hours ago, Morgo said:

I'd hardly call that Kings jersey a 90's design. 

 

I get what Morgo's saying here.

Yes, it was a 90's era sweater (worn in the 90's), but hardly a shining example of what we would consider a "90's style".

 

I'd say that this '95 sublimated offering (woof) from the Kings would be more 90's style-ish...

 

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On 8/30/2019 at 6:58 PM, BellaSpurs said:

They need to update it like the leaping panther logo.

Just realized there’s a cleaned up version in updated colors in their 25 anniversary logo, why didn’t they use it?

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1 hour ago, sparky chewbarky said:

I get what Morgo's saying here.

Yes, it was a 90's era sweater (worn in the 90's), but hardly a shining example of what we would consider a "90's style".

I think comparing it to expansion teams that debuted in that era makes a bit more sense then using thirds, IMO. And 90's expansion teams were still fairly conservative with their actual jersey designs, for the most part.

 

The Sharks, Lightning, Senators and Panthers all kept to pretty basic hockey aesthetics with their jerseys and didn't go crazy with the designs, even if some used more uncommon color combinations. The most "out there" 90's expansion teams in design were the Mighty Ducks, who were quite conservative outside of using diagonal stripes and the team colors, and the Predators. There's the Thrashers, too, but they're also literally the tail end of the 90's, so it kinda feels weird to say they fall into 90's design when they really line up more with 2000's-era design.

 

The third jersey program is basically what teams used to dump all that ridiculous 90's style kitsch without really doing too much to the main jersey. It was basically an excuse to go nuts and completely deviate from the standard look of the team. The general style was still pretty conservative, design wise, even if the colors often were not.

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1 hour ago, BellaSpurs said:

Just realized there’s a cleaned up version in updated colors in their 25 anniversary logo, why didn’t they use it?

 

Good question. That would’ve looked nice on the helmet.

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The Kings are getting in on the 90's wave that currently includes two teams :rolleyes:

Lets for argument's sake ignore the fact that all the Kings did in 1988 was apply a 50+ year old colour scheme to a toned down version of their previous jerseys and used a minor update of a logo from 1975 as a crest.  We'll ignore all that and call it a 90's jersey just to support Ice Cap's narrative...

The jersey is being worn two times.  It's not even entering the regular rotation as an alternate and this is being touted as proof of the 90's being the hot trend.  Talk to me when they follow in the footsteps of the Lightning and Hurricanes, at the height of the retro trend, and use it to replace the cup winning set.

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1 hour ago, Morgo said:

We'll ignore all that and call it a 90's jersey just to support Ice Cap's narrative...

Get over yourself.

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