maybe i'm crazy, but i noticed something earlier..

[ColeJ]

for my dallas stars fan site, i'm working on an overly extensive uniform history... every variation of every uniform worn by the dallas stars/minnesota north stars/oakland seals/cleveland barons... including a few rejected uniforms.

anyway, as we all know, the current dallas stars logo was adopted in the final years in minnesota (in fact, i believe it was an ice logo for a few years before they ever put it on their uniforms, so the logo is actually kinda old), only sans "DALLAS"... some people were wondering why it only said STARS, and not NORTH STARS, as the team was still officially known as the Minnesota North Stars... i think i've figured out why, and also noticed a funny quirk in the current stars logo because of it.

the stars primary logo is very simple. just a star, with the word STARS written over it... but the top point of the star is cut out to represent the A, so STARS would be more easily readable... that's what everyone has always said... but i'm starting to think that the cut out A isn't really there to made the A stand out. would anyone have been confused if the star was continuous? people wouldn't think it was the dallas STRS... they'd know it was supposed to represent the A.... which brings me to my theory. traditionally, all north stars logos had a compas-like arrow pointing up, to represent north. when they altered their logo to the modern version, i think the cut out A is there to represent a compas pointing north. maybe i'm just goofy, but that makes a lot of sense to me. it may have been the original designers intent, only back when it was unveiled for the north stars, it was before the whole modern trend of over explaining (like the oilers alternate sweater, or the minnesota wild's silly color names), so maybe it just slipped through the cracks for the past decade-plus in texas... again, call me crazy, but i think the dallas stars logo actually reads "DALLAS (NORTH) STARS" more than just DALLAS STARS...

that being said, i'd hate to see it ever majorly changed it's team history, and as boring and simple as it is, the simplicity really works well with the busy jersey design they wear.

[wheateater]

Whoa, dude. That's just way too compicated for me. The "A" represents the "A," and there's nothing more to it. That being said, this logo's got nothiing on the "N" used in the days in Minny.

[jrodsep]

An "A" is an "A".......

unless it's on the Dallas STRS. Which then means the north on a compass refering to the teams previous home state which used to have the nickname "NORTH STRS". And now has a team that calls it self the "Wild" with a star in it's logo that makes up the eye of a bear.

[LMU]

Never thought of it that way before. Yes, it definately makes sense.

[wurldwyde]

Very interesting theory, Brother Moose. Whether true or not, it certainly makes sense, and is an interesting point of conversation. I've also heard though, that during the logo overhall, from the "N", to the "STARS" logo, that Minnesota management was considering dropping the "North" from the name, making the team simply the Minnesota Stars. Any truth to that rumour?

Also, and truth to the rumour that that upon the move to Dallas, the name "Dallas Lone Stars" was under consideration?

[DawgPacPBH]

it was a kind of ramble so i read it a few times to get the idea, but man - it actually makes sense.

[ColeJ]

Very interesting theory, Brother Moose. Whether true or not, it certainly makes sense, and is an interesting point of conversation. I've also heard though, that during the logo overhall, from the "N", to the "STARS" logo, that Minnesota management was considering dropping the "North" from the name, making the team simply the Minnesota Stars. Any truth to that rumour?

Also, and truth to the rumour that that upon the move to Dallas, the name "Dallas Lone Stars" was under consideration?

yeah. there's a lot of truth to the Dallas Lone Stars name... some publications had already started calling the team the Dallas Lone Stars (when i was in elementary school, i read a school encyclopedia that listed the Dallas Lone Stars as an NHL team... printed in the summer of 1993.)

however, thankfully, bob gainey refused to use that name, which apparently norm green had wanted. bob gainey's argument was "how can it be LONE STARS? you can't be both lone and plural... it'd be like saying lone gunmen

but yeah, there's some truth to that.

as long as some people think there might be some validity to my compas theory, then i'll feel like i'm not completely insane i'm not attempting to convince the world that i'm right... as ken said, i'm just throwing out an interesting conversation peice, which is what this forum is all about. that idea had just been bothering me for a few months on and off, whenever i thought about it.

[-kj]

You're reading way too much into it, cole.

The new logo was designed so that it could easily be disconnected from Minnesota and still make sense. Y'know, a team that could be moved without having to rename them...

[habsfannova]

If it's true, then it's awfuly clever.

[ColeJ]

You're reading way too much into it, cole.

The new logo was designed so that it could easily be disconnected from Minnesota and still make sense. Y'know, a team that could be moved without having to rename them...

so you think that during the stanley cup finals run in 1991, they were already planning to relocate to a new city, and keep the same name? the stars have said in the past that the only reason they kept logos and uniforms the same, was because the name stars works in texas too... minnesota is "the north star state", while texas is "the lone star state"... if they'd moved to anaheim or denver like originally planned, they wouldn't have been the stars...

i just think that since the logo was used in publications, advertisments, ice logos, etc well before the move, and well before the infamous north stars season ticket holder letter (that basically says we can't play in this arena anymore... which arena would you guys like us to play in minnesota, that's more affordable)

basically, dallas is the only city that would have kept that logo, and dallas didn't even consider putting in a bid for the stars until like 2 years after the logo was designed.

[Puckguy14]

The A is an A but its also the arrow pointing North.

[ColeJ]

The A is an A but its also the arrow pointing North.

that's my theory

it's obviously an A, as the dallas stars and north stars old wordmark is just the STARS part, without the actual star.

however, i think that it's also an arrow pointing north, to make the original logo more of a NORTH stars logo than it would have been if the star had been solid.

that's all i'm saying, is that maybe the dallas stars logo shows a little more history than it's intending to show, by pointing north intentionally (at least originally).

not unlike how the FC Dallas crest has a flame in honor of the dallas burn history.

[amare32]

Interesting theory.

Possible, yes. Plausible, maybe. Probable, no.

Maybe you should track down the design firm the created it to get the definitive answer. You could have somebody film you and turn it into a documentary.

[ColeJ]

Interesting theory.

Possible, yes. Plausible, maybe. Probable, no.

Maybe you should track down the design firm the created it to get the definitive answer. You could have somebody film you and turn it into a documentary.

or i could talk about it on an internet forum for a day or two, until it drops out of our minds forever... but at least for that day or two, we'll have something to talk about.

[-kj]

Those jerseys were brought in after Norm Green had purchased the team, and he was already starting to have arena issues. Remember, this wasn't a sell-and-move deal, Green moved them on his own. Awfully convenient timing...

[amare32]

God bless the Internet.

[ColeJ]

Those jerseys were brought in after Norm Green had purchased the team, and he was already starting to have arena issues. Remember, this wasn't a sell-and-move deal, Green moved them on his own. Awfully convenient timing...

yeah, that's one of the things i said originally. norm green brought those jerseys out when he became owner, but the logo was used for years before that.

for instance, i know for a fact that it was an ice logo, where ads would go today while they wore the normal green, yellow, and black N logo... and in one of my dallas stars programs, it has a history of "ralph and razor" and is shows ralph strangis in his first season as the color-man in minnesota in the late 80's, next to his idol, Al Shaver. that photo was on the cover of a minnesota north stars game program... that logo was the STARS logo, not the N logo..... also, sadly, it's sitting in a red circle, which may have been the first signs of the stars and the mooterus color scheme

so like i said, the stars claim they only would use the same logos and name if the team moved to dallas, where it makes sense to be stars. the logo was designed in the 80's, and dallas didn't show interest in the team until the 90's... so i don't think that the final north stars logo was designed with the purpose to relocating the team to texas, which wasn't a market that was even interested in the team at that time.

i'm not trying to discredit you at all. i just think it's a little more complicated than "norm green bought the team and had an evil plan, that explains everything"

[-kj]

Well, those are the Minnesotan conspiracy theories, at least. I didn't live here yet when it happened--I was still a St. Louis-based Blues fan.

But I didn't think the Stars logo ended up on the ice that much before the jerseys popped up. I remember it being there the season before they changed the jerseys, but I thought Green had bought the team by then.

[ColeJ]

Well, those are the Minnesotan conspiracy theories, at least. I didn't live here yet when it happened--I was still a St. Louis-based Blues fan.

But I didn't think the Stars logo ended up on the ice that much before the jerseys popped up. I remember it being there the season before they changed the jerseys, but I thought Green had bought the team by then.

i'm not arguing that the logo was designed before norm green bought the team...

my point is that the stars have always claimed they only retained the same name and logos because texas is the lone star state, and minnesota is the north star state. if they'd moved to denver, they likely would have been the avalanche, and if they'd moved to anaheim, who knows what they'd have been...

my point is that the logo was designed BEFORE the city of dallas showed interest in an NHL team... so if you couple the reason they kept the name, with the designing of the logo, then saying that they designed the logo just so they could relocate easier makes no sense...

[-kj]

You have to admit, it's much more generic an identity than the North Stars set. That was a big complaint about it here, as I understand it.

I'm not saying I believe it, but there's evidence to support portions of the conspiracy theory.