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17 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

Red and blue are two of the most common colours found on flags. In fact only one national flag in the world doesn’t include the colours red, white, or blue (Jamaica). 

Having red and white can certainly reflect the flags of many Latin American countries, but they also reflect the flags of the US, UK, France, and the Neatherlands. The shades of red and blue the Marlins use probably closest matches Luxembourg’s flag of all countries. 

 

As for saving the current identity? I would say the colours are great. The new Marlin is great. I would ditch the new M and wordmark though. It’s too soulless. It’s not Vice/80s/vaporwave, it’s not Miami nightlife, it’s not classic baseball...it’s just a pseudo-script someone rendered on a computer. 

 

So I would say they need to design to a new M/wordmark that commits to a direction and emphasize the bright blue and red more. 

 

Or they could simply just give Marlins fans, who've had to endure a lot over the years, what they truly want and create a branding that is a modern take inspired by the original teal and black. This was actually what I was expecting them to do originally, because it's a pretty conspicuous slight to Loria, who made it clear he disliked teal.

 

I understand that Jeter wants to mark his territory and "look forward, not behind" (blah blah blah), but brand consistency is also important. Nostalgia sure seems to be integral to baseball.

The 2012-2018 identity was surely a Loria induced misfire, but from a marketing perspective, it's not very wise to unveil something completely new which yet again has Marlins fans yearning for teal and black. A branding works best if it feels like it actually has some staying power. Obviously a team should hit the reset button if a look simply isn't working, but this latest refresh of the team's identity feels tiresome and calls the firesales to mind. The Marlins would be smart to follow what the Blue Jays did to regain brand consistency; bury the two awful rebrandings and come full circle to a look that fans already associated with the franchise and its glory years.

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2 hours ago, Marlins93 said:

Or they could simply just give Marlins fans, who've had to endure a lot over the years, what they truly want and create a branding that is a modern take inspired by the original teal and black

 

They certainly know better than anyone whether that’s true or not.  

 

And the fact that they haven’t brought it back, even as a Brewers- or Padres-style alternate speaks volumes. 

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23 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

 

They certainly know better than anyone whether that’s true or not.  

 

And the fact that they haven’t brought it back, even as a Brewers- or Padres-style alternate speaks volumes. 

 

Well, they have arranged throwback dates this year and last, so it’s possibly that they’re on their way to doing it.

 

Either way, it needs significant clean-up.

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According to local media, they said the pirates are doing something with the 79 series team and said they’d wear black jerseys Saturday. They traditionally wear the yellow on Sunday. Hope they break out yellow hats-pants and mix it up on Sundays, but that won’t happen. Wonder why they didn’t make it a weekend and wear the 79 pinstripes Friday? Bet the Phillies packed powder blue and if they didn’t, it’ll be a waste.

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1 hour ago, Gothamite said:

 

They certainly know better than anyone whether that’s true or not.  

 

And the fact that they haven’t brought it back, even as a Brewers- or Padres-style alternate speaks volumes. 

Even if they had data that indicated that teal was a fan preference, that would not automatically suggest to me that they would follow through with implementing it. A plausible scenario is that they know there's a preference for teal but they nevertheless want to "look forward" and do something different. They clearly saw how difficult it has been drawing fans in the new ballpark so are experimenting with new marketing strategies, with "nightclub" aesthetic being the latest attempt. This season the front office is marketing the team as a "social experience" more than anything else in a not so subtle way. This franchise also has so much stigma attached to it that they probably wanted to start from scratch. I understand that mindset, but I think that most of the anger is directed toward what became of the Marlins since the 2012 season, not so much the during teal era.

 

And I would not draw comparisons to the Brewers or Padres alternates here. It's unwise to have a regular throwback alternate schedule during the first season of a rebranding. My guess is that's why they waited until early July to announce that the throwback weekend was even occurring. Early in the season would have directed attention away from the new look they were unveiling. Pure speculation on my part, but they are probably holding this year's throwback weekend based on the success of last year's. It speaks volumes to me that they are holding another one.

 

Finally, logistically speaking, the fact that the teal era cap with the F insignia no longer accurately reflects the actual team name, is a plausible explanation why they aren't having more frequent throwback alternate days. I personally wouldn't mind it, but I can see why that small point makes the throwbacks more suitable for specific weekends.

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8 hours ago, Marlins93 said:

Even if they had data that indicated that teal was a fan preference, that would not automatically suggest to me that they would follow through with implementing it. A plausible scenario is that they know there's a preference for teal but they nevertheless want to "look forward" and do something different.

 

A much more plausible scenario, though, is that the teal isn’t as popular as you think it is or would like it to be.

 

Seems a stretch to say that they’re deliberately leaving that much money on the table. If the old teal was really the overwhelming favorite, they would have included it somewhere in the rebrand.  Especially since, as you say, they know they’re struggling to connect with the fan base.  It beggars belief to think they’re deliberately ignoring the fans’ clear preferences.   Unless they’re not actually so clear.

 

But now we have a chance to find out.   The Brewers brought back their old logo because fans in Milwaukee made it the #1 selling Cooperstown Collection cap.  The Padres listened to their fans and their fans spoke loudly about bringing back the brown. Well, Marlins fans have an opportunity to demonstrate their preferences at the cash register.  We’ll see what the next couple seasons bring. 

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11 hours ago, hormone said:

According to local media, they said the pirates are doing something with the 79 series team and said they’d wear black jerseys Saturday. They traditionally wear the yellow on Sunday. Hope they break out yellow hats-pants and mix it up on Sundays, but that won’t happen. Wonder why they didn’t make it a weekend and wear the 79 pinstripes Friday? Bet the Phillies packed powder blue and if they didn’t, it’ll be a waste.

 

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Not sure about the weather in PGH, but it's 100 and humid here.  If it's similar out there, then they may regret the black-on-black look (if you buy into the whole dark-color = hotter thing.)

 

Related - next Saturday is the Phillies "Saturday Night Special" tribute, where they will wear the "Saturday Night Special" uniforms that only saw the field once in history.

 

D0mhRoYXgAAgmJ1.jpg  D69OdRhWsAEpQ0T.jpg

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Their new blue is CLOSE to teal (in certain light), their misfire was not using it enough.  Hopefully Nike will correct it.

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40 minutes ago, CaliforniaGlowin said:

Their new blue is CLOSE to teal (in certain light), their misfire was not using it enough.  Hopefully Nike will correct it.

I wonder how it would look if the Marlins did the old look but just replaced the teal with the new blue. It might look amazing. 

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14 hours ago, Gothamite said:

 

A much more plausible scenario, though, is that the teal isn’t as popular as you think it is or would like it to be.

 

Seems a stretch to say that they’re deliberately leaving that much money on the table. If the old teal was really the overwhelming favorite, they would have included it somewhere in the rebrand.  Especially since, as you say, they know they’re struggling to connect with the fan base.  It beggars belief to think they’re deliberately ignoring the fans’ clear preferences.   Unless they’re not actually so clear.

 

But now we have a chance to find out.   The Brewers brought back their old logo because fans in Milwaukee made it the #1 selling Cooperstown Collection cap.  The Padres listened to their fans and their fans spoke loudly about bringing back the brown. Well, Marlins fans have an opportunity to demonstrate their preferences at the cash register.  We’ll see what the next couple seasons bring. 

Well, there's one factor that you and I have disagreed on in the past. I refuse to believe that merchandise sales are the only--or possibly even primary--driver behind the the visual identity that a team wants to adopt or sustain. As mentioned in my last post, this front office has taken a marketing approach that is directed towards demographics which they've been less successful in reaching in the past. That's why they are emphasizing the social experience at the ballpark (Jeter himself said along these lines that it's about people who show up, don't even know if the Marlins won or lost, spent money, and had a good time) and their uniform rebranding that they are trying to make more suggestive of casual streetwear, particularly monochromatic black jersey.

 

In other words, longterm Marlins fans who care about teal are not the team's primary target group in their marketing campaign, of which the rebranding is a big part. The Marlins are very different from the Brewers or Brewers because their respective cities have much older franchises and larger fanbases. It's clear to me that the Marlins are desperately trying to expand their tent; every move they've made so far reeks of this. I can't say I blame them, but sustained winning and the capacity to retain star talent will be the only things that succeed in the end.

 

In short, Miami is very different from San Diego/Milwaukee and faces a unique set of marketing challenges. Secondly, I don't think the "we wear what sells" mantra is always so cut and dry, especially in Miami. The Marlins are looking at a much bigger picture than trying to rake in the very modest revenue that they generate from the merchandise sales split evenly among all MLB teams (with the exception of what's sold at the team store, of course). They are wearing what they are because it's part of a broader attempt to reach fans they never have before. For what it's worth, a team employee did tell me last June that the teal 25th anniversary caps sold very well (I don't doubt it because it felt like half the fans at those games were wearing one).

 

Let's continue this in the dedicated Marlins thread so people can shift the discussion to other teams, such as the Pirates and Phillies throwbacks.

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6 hours ago, Gothamite said:

Seems a stretch to say that they’re deliberately leaving that much money on the table. 

Why? The Padres did that due to owner preference for years. 

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2 hours ago, CaliforniaGlowin said:

Their new blue is CLOSE to teal (in certain light), their misfire was not using it enough.  Hopefully Nike will correct it.

Yeah, the shades of blue and red they're using are very close to teal and pink. It makes me wonder why they didn't just go full-out Miami Vice, especially after seeing how much money the Heat made from doing that.

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32 minutes ago, Lights Out said:

Yeah, the shades of blue and red they're using are very close to teal and pink. It makes me wonder why they didn't just go full-out Miami Vice, especially after seeing how much money the Heat made from doing that.

The whole identity seems like an exercise in half-measures. Someone wanted a Vice look but someone else wanted a traditional baseball look. So they split the difference and now no one's happy.

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1 hour ago, Ice_Cap said:

The whole identity seems like an exercise in half-measures. Someone wanted a Vice look but someone else wanted a traditional baseball look. So they split the difference and now no one's happy.

I do not want a Vice look at all, despite liking those Heat jerseys as alternates. Having said that, a Vice look would certainly be superior to what the Marlins are wearing now.

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On 7/19/2019 at 4:29 PM, Ice_Cap said:

 

 

As for saving the current identity? I would say the colours are great. The new Marlin is great.

 

I was sitting behind a car at a traffic light with a window sticker for this company 

pisces-sportfishingLR-Logo.jpg?w=1170&ss

 

this visual is less like the marlins logo but the window sticker I saw had some wear on it and it bore more similarities.  It’s almost like a combination of the previous M’s abstract marlin and the new one. 

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 but if they did go with a vice look they be laughed at for copying them.  this is like their version of the vice look, just needs more color.

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18 minutes ago, CaliforniaGlowin said:

 but if they did go with a vice look they be laughed at for copying them.

 

No they wouldn't. Did people laugh at the Penguins the two times they went to black and athletic gold or the Pirates when they dropped red?

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