Wentz2Jeffery

Patriots Unveil New Uniforms

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I was just looking at "Flying Elvis" for the first time thanks to @Sport post on other applications. I think if you just shortened the tail a little the logo would be really good but I have always liked it though. I have never really looked at it on much applications other than the uniform & the score bugs so I have really never noticed the problems on other applications. If you did that it would really help with the those applications & still look good on the helmet.

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1 hour ago, Pharos04 said:

I remember when it was first introduced that the logo seemed to be ridiculed by everyone.  It replaced what was considered a beloved logo (I still don't get why and I friggan live here) and it was a very radical change.  I even recall one of the news channels (I think WBZ?) was reporting on the change and discussing the change and how dramatic of a shift it was, and then they brought up a graphic about "if this is the change from the well loved Pat Patriot, maybe the Celtics aren't too far behind?" and the graphic showed the new logo but with a shamrock instead of a star.

 

It's always been mocked and ridiculed and compared to all sorts of nonsense.  The name "Flying Elvis" was born from this due to the excessive sideburns on the logo.  I personally see it as an unofficial nickname for the team now.  One of those Athletics-White Elephants jabs that has been embraced. Maybe not officially by the team but I see it as endearing at this point.

 

As far as the blanket criticism, I have never seen any sort of insurance company with a dynamic logo like that.  And as said, if your sperm resembles that shape, see a doctor.

 

If you don't like the logo, just say it.  "I don't like the logo.  It doesn't look good to me.  I can't exactly express why but it's just not visually appealing to me".  Makes more sense than broad allusions that don't make any sense.  Hell in 1993 people were 100% upfront that they didn't like it because it was so different from what they were used to.  Not that hard to just admit you don't like something.

 

 

It isn't called flying Elvis just because of the sideburns. The facial structure looks just like Elvis :censored:ing Presley. 

 

The logo is a :censored:ing joke. It always has been. Always will be. It deserves every single bit of the hyperbolized ridicule it gets. 

 

Don't like the sperm comment? It's an exaggerated head with a long tail. Would you prefer I called it Patriot snake? 

 

The insurance company comment was made to illustrate that its a bland, boring, trying to be stylized logo that corporations tend to go for. 

 

The only reason it's still even around is because of the "laundry made us win" sentiment. 

 

If the Patriots had their dynasty wearing something similar to the :censored: show they had in Tampa last year would it and should it be beloved? 

 

Yeah, neither should Flying Elvis. 

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On 4/27/2020 at 1:28 PM, the admiral said:

I found myself reading about that a few days ago because I was thinking about the Whalers and where they even could have built a new arena if they tried (joke's on us, they were never going to try). Hartford is a very strange city to me in that it seems to have the same "things just occurring for no specific reason" approach to city planning as a big southern city, but it's compressed into a tiny, New England-sized municipality (take one step to the left or right and you're in West Hartford or East Hartford, separate cities). End result is that it's really hard to look around and find a parcel of land that could fit a new arena, unless they tore the old Civic Center down and put the new one there. 

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/01/23/nfl-new-england-patriots-abandoned-move-hartford-connecticut

 

The site for the Patriots was about as good as it was gonna get for Hartford, which was along the riverfront upon demolishing a power plant. Kraft made up some :censored:-and-bull story about the plant being too hard for the state to demolish for him as cover for staying in Mass, which was what he always wanted to do in the first place. The state ended up building a convention center on part of the parcel, though they've left the plant there, so now there's a nice new convention center next to a big ugly power plant, which again, place doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

 

Yeah, Hartford is...peculiar. You might want to take a step over and be in West Hartford, but you don't want to take a step in the other direction and be in East Hartford. Also, separating the city from the Connecticut River by putting a giant highway between them might be one of the most ill-advised decisions in the history of the city. Luckily, they have plans to redo I-91, but knowing Hartford, it'll take 30 years before its finished. They could have done something in the northern end of the city where the Xfinity Center is right now ("The Meadows" for you locals) and is filled with nothing but their original convention centers and some car dealerships. Redoing something in the XL Center's footprint though might not work. It's congested down there. 

 

The convention center is a nice building, but would have been odd to have an NFL franchise play right there. They also had plans for all parking to be in parking garages in the area of the new stadium, which means, IIRC, no open flames..which means no tailgating. I don't know how that works. Even crazier is the fact that the city was willing to spend between $150 million and $200 million for an NFL franchise in the early-to-mid 1990's (but couldn't give much money to the Whalers because reasons), and their effort with the Patriots in the late 90's was their third attempt at luring the NFL to Hartford. They tried to lure the Pats in maybe 1991 or 1992 and then a few years later...

 

rams-4.jpg?w=584

 

Heck, Walter Peyton, Paul Newman, and Tom Selleck lobbied for Hartford!

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There are indeed a lot of banks and insurance companies that use celebrity-sperm-with-sideburns logos. Dozens, maybe hundreds. 

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What if the Patriots still used the hiking Patriot on their helmets and never changed their uniforms from the ones they wore back in the 70's & 80's. I'm sure they would be still popular today.

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22 minutes ago, GrimlockAutobot said:

 

It isn't called flying Elvis just because of the sideburns. The facial structure looks just like Elvis :censored:ing Presley. 

 

The logo is a :censored:ing joke. It always has been. Always will be. It deserves every single bit of the hyperbolized ridicule it gets. 

 

Don't like the sperm comment? It's an exaggerated head with a long tail. Would you prefer I called it Patriot snake? 

 

The insurance company comment was made to illustrate that its a bland, boring, trying to be stylized logo that corporations tend to go for. 

 

The only reason it's still even around is because of the "laundry made us win" sentiment. 

 

If the Patriots had their dynasty wearing something similar to the :censored: show they had in Tampa last year would it and should it be beloved? 

 

Yeah, neither should Flying Elvis. 

man you go from 0 to 100 way to easy.  Chillax bro.

 

it's not a perfect logo by any means but it's better than the jumbled mess they had up until the change.  Could barely make out what the blob was on television during that time and it was a mess.  Not to mention that it's synonymous from the time when the Patsies were a joke of a franchise that was usually forgotten within its own market.

 

Got those awesome buzzwords going still.  You forgot "Madden Create-a-Team" though.

 

and yes, Tampa would still be ridiculed for their terrible Digital Clock numbers.  Same way the Cavs are still being jolted at because they finally won a championship for Cleveland wearing the ridiculous sleeved black alternates.

 

Elvis ain't going anywhere at this point.  Even if the laundry has now changed the logo ties to the dynasty and is forever linked to the past 20 years.

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33 minutes ago, GrimlockAutobot said:

Don't like the sperm comment? It's an exaggerated head with a long tail. Would you prefer I called it Patriot snake?

 

And generally when you make a joke comparing something to something else, that thing should vaguely resemble that other thing. You're just trying to be crass for the sake of being crass.

 

33 minutes ago, GrimlockAutobot said:

The insurance company comment was made to illustrate that its a bland, boring, trying to be stylized logo that corporations tend to go for.

 

You mean to tell me that a corporate entity whose main goal is to make massive amounts of profit uses a logo that resembles other corporate entities whose goals are to make massive amounts of profit? I'm shocked!

 

Again, if you're gonna make a comparison, give a bare minimum effort and make a comparison that works.

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46 minutes ago, Brass said:

Yeah, Hartford is...peculiar. You might want to take a step over and be in West Hartford, but you don't want to take a step in the other direction and be in East Hartford. Also, separating the city from the Connecticut River by putting a giant highway between them might be one of the most ill-advised decisions in the history of the city. Luckily, they have plans to redo I-91, but knowing Hartford, it'll take 30 years before its finished. They could have done something in the northern end of the city where the Xfinity Center is right now ("The Meadows" for you locals) and is filled with nothing but their original convention centers and some car dealerships. Redoing something in the XL Center's footprint though might not work. It's congested down there.

 

Hartford seems like it fell hard for '70s urban renewal. It's ugly in the same way that St. Louis is ugly: expressway viaducts in the worst possible places, bad Brutalist architecture (but I repeat myself), emphasis on cars and parking at the expense of transit and walking. Boston made a lot of those bad mistakes, too, but seemed to undo as many of them as they could. Hartford feels like it gave up. But yeah, the whole NH-Hartford-Springfield corridor is weird to me. Compare with Hartford's eastern WHA counterpart, Quebec City, or its dumpy counterpart, Winnipeg. They make sense to me. They're big cities with dense cores surrounded by not much else. I know Connecticut has one of the higher population densities in the country, but where is everyone? Where are the suburbs? It's like the whole state just is. (I say all this as someone who has argued as hard as anyone that a second New England team would have worked just fine with patience and creativity.)

 

Do you think a 17,000-seat arena at the convention center/aborted stadium site would have worked? Assuming Connecticut had no delusions of poaching the Patriots and ownership had no real goal of moving to Michigan, is that something that could have gotten done? Would there have been enough space left over to have some other attractions? 

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Boston didn't fall into the urban renewal trap as badly as Hartford did -- the awful highway and neighborhood razing there was of an earlier generation. Hartford is probably the worst case, but all of Connecticut just got stuck into its destiny as a bedroom community at state scale ... and now it's stuck in this cultural and economic malaise that nobody can recover from. Kind of a shame as a lot of CT has that same pastoral agricultural cachet that the other New England states do, just hasn't ever been able to capitalize on it. 

 

Kraft was always using the CT plan as leverage, though I think the Whalers could have kept alive in an alternate universe. At least, uh, Rentschler Field turned out useful as a Boston/New York midway point for US national team soccer games every other year. 

 

In Boston, imagine if this highway plan had succeeded in wiping out half of Cambridge and Somerville, and that they had built the Patriots a stadium on the Southie waterfront, maybe with the Bruins/Celtics next door. (It's basically Philly.)

 

Both-plans2.jpg 

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15 minutes ago, Digby said:

Boston didn't fall into the urban renewal trap as badly as Hartford did -- the awful highway and neighborhood razing there was of an earlier generation.

 

I was thinking of that concrete atrocity of a city hall.

 

The idea of Boston having a Sports Containment Zone is pretty grim. Maybe the new Fenway the old owners wanted would have been in there too. I also know there was a time at which the Bruins were thinking of moving to southern New Hampshire and leaving the Celtics to have the rotting Boston Garden to themselves, and I think the Celtics also looked into an arena of their own until Jacobs gave them a sweetheart deal to play at the FleetCenter. It all could have been very weird.

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Would it look weird to have the same stripe colors on the road jersey as the home? I kinda think R/W/R would look really clean on the white jersey.

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Just now, the admiral said:

 

I was thinking of that concrete atrocity of a city hall.

 

The idea of Boston having a Sports Containment Zone is pretty grim. Maybe the new Fenway the old owners wanted would have been in there too. I also know there was a time at which the Bruins were thinking of moving to southern New Hampshire and leaving the Celtics to have the rotting Boston Garden to themselves, and I think the Celtics also looked into an arena of their own until Jacobs gave them a sweetheart deal to play at the FleetCenter. It all could have been very weird.

 

I think it almost happened twice -- arena and football stadium was the plan in the renewal era, and then there was a "megaplex" of baseball, football and a convention center a la Baltimore in the 90s. Probably for the best that it ended up just being a convention center and empty glass towers in the end, it's all going to fall into the ocean soon enough. Though I think it would've been good for the area and the team had the Revolution built a stadium there, but the Krafts missed out on the 2000s land grab.

 

Soccer aside everything worked out perfectly in the end... old Fenway somehow still lives, the Garden is in its ancestral home, and the Patriots are in a strip mall next to a Bass Pro Shops.

 

Just now, Froob said:

Would it look weird to have the same stripe colors on the road jersey as the home? I kinda think R/W/R would look really clean on the white jersey.

 

The more I look at it I wish they had done that. Runs the risk of looking disconnected from the numbers, maybe, but there's probably just enough blue there. I'm usually a fan of navy blue plus red (no white) graphics on jerseys, but for some reason it bleeds into purple real bad there. (and yes I do intend to keep manically switching between the actual topic and New England development history.)

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2 hours ago, GrimlockAutobot said:

 

It isn't called flying Elvis just because of the sideburns. The facial structure looks just like Elvis :censored:ing Presley. 

 

The logo is a :censored:ing joke. It always has been. Always will be. It deserves every single bit of the hyperbolized ridicule it gets. 

 

Don't like the sperm comment? It's an exaggerated head with a long tail. Would you prefer I called it Patriot snake? 

 

The insurance company comment was made to illustrate that its a bland, boring, trying to be stylized logo that corporations tend to go for. 

 

The only reason it's still even around is because of the "laundry made us win" sentiment. 

 

If the Patriots had their dynasty wearing something similar to the :censored: show they had in Tampa last year would it and should it be beloved? 

 

Yeah, neither should Flying Elvis. 

Time to see Wheeljack, Grimlock. Your logic preceptors need a tune-up. 

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Just now, IceCap said:

Time to see Wheeljack, Grimlock. Your logic preceptors need a tune-up. 

 

spacer.png

 

“Man, I should have listened to Perceptor. Simple brains and brute strength is never a good combo.” 

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1 minute ago, SFGiants58 said:

 

spacer.png

 

“Man, I should have listened to Perceptor. Simple brains and brute strength is never a good combo.” 

 

 

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1 hour ago, the admiral said:

I know Connecticut has one of the higher population densities in the country, but where is everyone? Where are the suburbs? It's like the whole state just is. (I say all this as someone who has argued as hard as anyone that a second New England team would have worked just fine with patience and creativity.)

 

Do you think a 17,000-seat arena at the convention center/aborted stadium site would have worked? Assuming Connecticut had no delusions of poaching the Patriots and ownership had no real goal of moving to Michigan, is that something that could have gotten done? Would there have been enough space left over to have some other attractions? 

 

Fairfield County and New Haven County. Bridgeport, Stamford, New Haven, Waterbury. Then you have some pretty big suburbs like Norwalk, New Britain, and Danbury that population-wise are "cities" but physically aren't, if that makes sense.

 

As for a 17,000-seat arena, I don't see how that would fit where they put the current Convention Center to accommodate what they needed. I really don't. They would have had to expand closer to the river and that would have cut off one of the busiest areas of commuter traffic for however long it would have taken to build the stadium. NHL arena? Sure. They could have done it. And they wanted to for the Whalers in '97 before Karmanos moved them. For an NFL franchise, the smartest move would have been a stadium on the outskirts, like they did for UConn's football stadium in East Hartford. It's exactly like Foxboro. Nothing, just houses, and then BAM - NFL stadium.

 

As much as its enjoyable to poke fun at Hartford, they're doing things the right way right now by slowly developing the areas around the city and working their way in. They've completely revitalized Dillon Stadium on the south side of the city for the Hartford Athletic soccer team, and Dunkin' Donuts Park for the Yard Goats in the north end is beautiful. They're doing what they should have done for years - build up the minor leagues teams because it is a minor league city. Now, if the Wolf Pack could actually draw a crowd, they might be able to fix up the XL Center a bit...

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1 hour ago, Digby said:

In Boston, imagine if this highway plan had succeeded in wiping out half of Cambridge and Somerville, and that they had built the Patriots a stadium on the Southie waterfront, maybe with the Bruins/Celtics next door. (It's basically Philly.)

 

Both-plans2.jpg 


My gods, that’s almost as offensive an idea as putting a freeway through Greenwich Village.  Dodged a bullet there. 

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5 hours ago, Digby said:

 

Hard agree.

 

Even the silver pants look weird to me, with the jersey no longer having meaningful silver elements. The all-navy is fine!

The jersey has silver outlines on the numbers and in the logo.. that's pretty substantial imo

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3 hours ago, GrimlockAutobot said:

It isn't called flying Elvis just because of the sideburns. The facial structure looks just like Elvis :censored:ing Presley. 


You see Elvis... a lot of New Englanders see "The Old Man of the Mountain".

5ezxRt3l.jpg

Truth be told, the Patriots' current  logo is part of a pack of middle-tier NFL team primary marks. Not great, not horrible... just meh.

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Yeah. I'm with @Brian in Boston on this one. I won't pretend the Pats' logo is amazing, because it's not. It's hardly bad though. It's just sort of there? Which is strangely fitting for the dynasty it represents I suppose. 

 

I'm not the biggest fan of it, and I'm open to alternates (I love the old rejected logo @the admiral mocked up) but for what it is? It's fine. I certainly don't get the hate at all. It's better than the poorly drawn cartoon character that was Pat the Patriot. 

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