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Washington NFL Franchise Retires Name and Logo

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Alright, that's enough of that. Stick to the topic at hand instead of piling on.

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Other than removing the helmet logos and collar wordmark, is there any reason why the current uniform can’t stay? If there’s any need for a placeholder logo, just put a vague golden W on the helmet. (mind you, I’m saying all this because I don’t have time to read the entire thread)

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9 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

What would be really strange is if they start as just "Washington NFL", and then the league suspends operations, and then they come back to finish the season as the Washington Red Tails, they'd likely be the first major team to completely change its identity midway through the season.

 

The Los Angeles Angels changed their name to California Angels during the 1965 season, altering their cap logo from LA to CA, in anticipation of their move to Anaheim for 1966.

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37 minutes ago, Moseph said:

I get that the history will still be there, but to me there will be a break in the lineage with only having the city, colors, and possibly a hashtag connecting the two versions of the franchise. If they were able to keep the same theme albeit with a new name I think that would help bridge the gap. Maybe I'm just being salty though about it being taken away from us and wouldn't mind if all Native American sports team imagery got rebranded so more fanbases could join in on this misery.

 

College fans went through this over a decade ago. It's honestly not a big deal. I remember some people saying they weren't going to be fans if Arkansas State changed, but those people either kept being fans and got over the change before it even happened, or weren't fans to begin with that just wanted to take a fake stand against nothing.

 

Honestly, the least important part of a team is its nickname. My favorite baseball team is named after baby bears, and my favorite hockey team has a trying-way-too-hard 90's Xtreme name.

 

Has it been said what they plan to do about a name this season? Will they just be the Washington NFL Team with no real logos? I remember Southeast Missouri State did that at some point as they prepared to transition from Indians to Redhawks.

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I definitely understand the issue with the nickname. But is there a good reason to move away from Native American imagery? Like is there not a way to honor and build up people who have long been oppressed? 
 

Now I am not Native American, so I might be misunderstanding something, or not fully aware, and I am just curious, and want to build up, rather than mock and bring down Native Americans. 

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2 hours ago, Sec19Row53 said:

I think they need to NOT be hung up on making #HTTR still work. As a Packer fan, if we had to lose "Packers", the last thing I would want is to have a nickname be hemmed into some notion that Go Name Go had to work in the same manner as Go Pack Go. I'd want to turn the page so as to not be reminded of what used to be -- move it forward and start something new.

 

And before you say 'yeah, that ain't happening', it seems very much like divorce, even an amicable one. I'm very familiar with that concept 🙂

So, there's really the idea that being able to keep the #HTTR social media tag is important? I did not know the tag existed...granted that's not my team. I'm a Vikings fan.  And I don't know what their twitter tag is. I suppose it's #Skol, but I wouldn't bet tons of money on it. I didn't realize the twitter tag was supposed to become a tradition-rich thing.  I figured teams probably changed them from time to time, like #Skol for a year or two, then #GoVikes, then #Norse, etc.

 

It never would have occurred to me for a second that there'd be any concern with maintaining that when the team name is going away.  Maybe I'm just old.

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Not to target anyone specifically or be provacative (quite the opposite), but when it comes to making a case regarding Native American/First Nations/etc imagery in sports, please be aware of what the Slippery Slope fallacy is and how it, as a fallacy, is by definition an unsound argument. 

 

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If mods feel like this post is more harmful than helpful, feel free to edit.  Not trying to stir the pot at all, just trying to educate.

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6 minutes ago, chcarlson23 said:

I definitely understand the issue with the nickname. But is there a good reason to move away from Native American imagery? Like is there not a way to honor and build up people who have long been oppressed? 
 

Now I am not Native American, so I might be misunderstanding something, or not fully aware, and I am just curious, and want to build up, rather than mock and bring down Native Americans. 

 

Let me preface this by saying that I'm only half "NA" and my family hasn't lived on a Rez since the 1870's. My opinion does not carry much weight with these issues. That being said, is there one "catch-all" name that would honor "NA" people? Probably not. The question becomes this; by honoring one Nation are you inadvertently dishonoring another? For example, what might work with for the Onondaga may not work for the Cherokee and so on. As much as I admire your intent, I think the more prudent move would be to leave "NA" inspired team names to the past. Not saying they were all bad, just that it might be time to stop trotting out new ones.

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5 minutes ago, CherryMX said:

If mods feel like this post is more harmful than helpful, feel free to edit. 

 

This mod is fine with it.

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5 minutes ago, OnWis97 said:

So, there's really the idea that being able to keep the #HTTR social media tag is important? I did not know the tag existed...granted that's not my team. I'm a Vikings fan.  And I don't know what their twitter tag is. I suppose it's #Skol, but I wouldn't bet tons of money on it. I didn't realize the twitter tag was supposed to become a tradition-rich thing.  I figured teams probably changed them from time to time, like #Skol for a year or two, then #GoVikes, then #Norse, etc.

 

It never would have occurred to me for a second that there'd be any concern with maintaining that when the team name is going away.  Maybe I'm just old.

#HTTR is more than a hashing. I compare it more to Go Pack Go. Or Roll Tide.

 

I don't know that it is actively being pursued, but it HAS come up among fans in this thread.

 

Similarly I hear in this thread that Red Somethings is a/the favorite.  Not sure how anyone can know that other than speculation. 

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, chcarlson23 said:

I definitely understand the issue with the nickname. But is there a good reason to move away from Native American imagery? Like is there not a way to honor and build up people who have long been oppressed? 
 

Now I am not Native American, so I might be misunderstanding something, or not fully aware, and I am just curious, and want to build up, rather than mock and bring down Native Americans. 

 

I don't think there is a way for this particular franchise to honour and build up indigenous people without it seeming disingenuous, given how long protests have fallen on ownership's deaf ears. There are ways to do it -- the examples of the Spokane Indians and the FSU Seminoles were brought up earlier in the thread -- but I think  it's best for the Washington NFL franchise to not go down that road.

 

Edited by officeglenn
Took out a broad generalization.

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10 minutes ago, officeglenn said:

 

I don't think there is a way for this particular franchise to honour and build up indigenous people without it seeming disingenuous, given how long protests have fallen on ownership's deaf ears. There are ways to do it -- the examples of the Spokane Indians and the FSU Seminoles were brought up earlier in the thread -- but I think  it's best for the Washington NFL franchise to not go down that road.

 

That makes sense. The name definitely needed to go, but knowing that a Native American designer created the logo, it’s disappointing to see their work scrapped because of the awful name that no one would change. 

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22 minutes ago, Sec19Row53 said:

#HTTR is more than a hashing. I compare it more to Go Pack Go. Or Roll Tide.

 

I don't know that it is actively being pursued, but it HAS come up among fans in this thread.

 

Similarly I hear in this thread that Red Somethings is a/the favorite.  Not sure how anyone can know that other than speculation. 

The letters HTTR?

 

Or are you saying that "Hail to the RedWolves" may become a semi-suitable replacement for "Hail to the Redskins?"  And if so, would "Hail to the Warriors" not because then HTTR becomes HTTW?

 

Clinging to those four letters seems odd...I guess I can kinda buy "Hail to the Red...." As better than "Hail to the something else."  It's probably something I just don't understand that people like, like "Rip City."

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7 minutes ago, oldschoolvikings said:

Is anybody else picturing the Mods all pouring big cups of coffee and planning for a late night? 


This is definitely the CCSLC mod equivalent of landing a spacecraft on a comet. 

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I just hope they keep the colors/uniform design. Obviously remove the logos/wordmark, but other than that don't change a damn thing. I think Washington has a really beautiful color scheme and uniform set, and it would be a shame if the entire branding changed

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10 minutes ago, oldschoolvikings said:

Is anybody else picturing the Mods all pouring big cups of coffee and planning for a late night? 

GGRBsTL.jpg

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18 minutes ago, OnWis97 said:

So, there's really the idea that being able to keep the #HTTR social media tag is important? I did not know the tag existed...granted that's not my team. I'm a Vikings fan.  And I don't know what their twitter tag is. I suppose it's #Skol, but I wouldn't bet tons of money on it. I didn't realize the twitter tag was supposed to become a tradition-rich thing.  I figured teams probably changed them from time to time, like #Skol for a year or two, then #GoVikes, then #Norse, etc.

 

It never would have occurred to me for a second that there'd be any concern with maintaining that when the team name is going away.  Maybe I'm just old.

 

The hashtag is not important, but "Hail To The Redskins" is the title and lyrics of the team's fight song, which their marching band has played since 1938. Many fans would like to see a name that can fit into the fight song. Sure, that could be any two syllable name, but "R" is preferred, since the HTTR shorthand has existed for a while, even before hashtags. And like @Sec19Row53 pointed out, it has become the "Go Pack Go" or "Roll Tide" type motto of Washington fans.

 

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10 minutes ago, oldschoolvikings said:

Is anybody else picturing the Mods all pouring big cups of coffee and planning for a late night? 

 

If I'm going to be honest, I'm surprised this topic is still up. When I logged in, I was expecting to see the little lock icon.

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52 minutes ago, chcarlson23 said:

I definitely understand the issue with the nickname. But is there a good reason to move away from Native American imagery? Like is there not a way to honor and build up people who have long been oppressed? 
 

Now I am not Native American, so I might be misunderstanding something, or not fully aware, and I am just curious, and want to build up, rather than mock and bring down Native Americans. 

 

I think that highlighted part right there is the issue. This debate, whether it be centered on Washington or Tallahassee or Grand Forks, North Dakota, has always hinged on the beliefs of the well-intended that imagery and names depicting someone else's culture should be perceived as an honor or is meant to elevate their culture.

 

The trouble is, unless you're of the culture being depicted, how can you say whether or not a brand "builds you up?" And who decides what's appropriate? It's not a universal thing, and it's nearly impossible to get any sort of consensus on this issue. It's too subjective. Plus, some cultures just don't enjoy being the showpieces for professional sports franchises. 

 

I lived through this in North Dakota. I loved, and still do, the Fighting Sioux. But I didn't have a leg to stand on if my argument was about how proudly the logo depicted Native Americans. I'm as white as the driven snow. I'm not about to tell someone from another culture that they should be proud of the football helmet that bears a symbol from their culture.

 

That's why the most prudent and expedient path is to avoid all Native American imagery. Clean break. Move along. 

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