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Racial Injustice's Impact on Sports


CS85

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The sad truth is that these issues aren't going to magically go away if there's a new administration running the country next year.  There will almost certainly be another minority that's killed or beaten by police sometime next year.  While it's unlikely that most venues will be at 100% capacity, it's more likely than not that there will be some live fan presence come April, which means that baseball, basketball, and hockey will be playing in home arenas in front of live audiences.  When that next murder occurs, do the teams / leagues shut down again?  It's one thing to do it now, when it doesn't really matter, but when the owners, arena managers, and fans have a stake in it, will they still sit out?  I think now that the precedent is set, they have to, or this year's will seem like a hollow gesture.

"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."

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1 hour ago, BBTV said:

The sad truth is that these issues aren't going to magically go away if there's a new administration running the country next year.  There will almost certainly be another minority that's killed or beaten by police sometime next year.  While it's unlikely that most venues will be at 100% capacity, it's more likely than not that there will be some live fan presence come April, which means that baseball, basketball, and hockey will be playing in home arenas in front of live audiences.  When that next murder occurs, do the teams / leagues shut down again?  It's one thing to do it now, when it doesn't really matter, but when the owners, arena managers, and fans have a stake in it, will they still sit out?  I think now that the precedent is set, they have to, or this year's will seem like a hollow gesture.

 

You can't change your name AND your user icon at the same time!

1 hour ago, ShutUpLutz! said:

and the drunken doodoobags jumping off the tops of SUV's/vans/RV's onto tables because, oh yeah, they are drunken drug abusing doodoobags

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3 hours ago, BBTV said:

The sad truth is that these issues aren't going to magically go away if there's a new administration running the country next year.  There will almost certainly be another minority that's killed or beaten by police sometime next year.  While it's unlikely that most venues will be at 100% capacity, it's more likely than not that there will be some live fan presence come April, which means that baseball, basketball, and hockey will be playing in home arenas in front of live audiences.  When that next murder occurs, do the teams / leagues shut down again?  It's one thing to do it now, when it doesn't really matter, but when the owners, arena managers, and fans have a stake in it, will they still sit out?  I think now that the precedent is set, they have to, or this year's will seem like a hollow gesture.

 

Postponements are inevitable no matter what the circumstances are.

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As a black man, I have to say that I'm encouraged by the dialogue in this thread. Not that I'm the authority when it comes to such dialogue, but the conversation has been very civil, people actually looking for action, and people listening and responding rather than talking over each other. That's how it should be done regardless of the issue.

 

As for social injustice/police brutality, I do think this is a tricky issue. There are some things I feel are certain: the players are 100% correct in voicing their opinions and peacefully protesting (i.e. kneeling for the anthem) to get their messages across. While I myself am uncomfortable with kneeling, it is a completely viable, logical, and effective way to at least start a discussion, and the act of kneeling doesn't make one 'un-American' - in fact quite the opposite. You yourself might not agree with it, but at least respect the player's decision whatever it may be.

 

As for player/team walkouts/boycotts, this is a trickier issue for me. While I understand the premise behind it, a move of that nature necessitates further action outside the forum of sports. It's one thing to abstain from work due to causes of the job, I mean, labor unions stage workouts yearly. But to boycott your profession for a stance that is unlikely to end anytime soon (possibly ever), that requires real action, tangible action. Granted, some teams, to their credit, have gone forward and taken the steps necessary to implement changes outside sports: the Baltimore Ravens come to mind. But I just don't see how Giannis not dunking, or Mookie not swinging actively improves police interactions with black people, if anything it's just an exaggerated form of kneeling, and we've already crossed that bridge. It seems as though the boycotts are coming to a close, with the NBA resuming and MLB teams coming back into the fold, so this issue may have solved itself.

 

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The sad truth is that these issues aren't going to magically go away if there's a new administration running the country next year.  There will almost certainly be another minority that's killed or beaten by police sometime next year.

Unfortunately true, because a new administration is unlikely to affect the thousands of police bureaus that litter the country. The police union, as a whole, needs cleaned and revamped, to the point that it might be unrecognizable to us currently. I really do believe the issue stems there before going down the pipeline and to the courts, etc.

 

What's funny is that many of the same people championing smaller government back the militarization of police, a move I find hypocritical; how can you demand to close public schools and lampoon socialized healthcare but at the same time raise the police budget under the premise of freedom? Where's the fiscal responsibility in that?

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I guess maybe the benefit of going 'on strike' could be that people that might otherwise not care about whether black people live might care that they can't watch them dribble or bet on their games, so they might support some kind of reform just so they can get their TV show or gambling fix back.  Doesn't change that they don't care though.  It's unfortunate that in an era where we very recently had a black president, the leaders are still the athletes.  Their well intentioned, and clearly have the biggest platform and financial ability to effect change, but they need a leader that has the background necessary to organize and direct their voices toward some tangible results.  I guess for now that person is Lebron, but 1) he usually has 100 basketball games to play, and 2) doesn't have beyond a high-school education - which doesn't make anything he says any less valid - just from the standpoint of organizing and running what is essentially the largest and most powerful reform movement, he could benefit from guidance from someone with experience and education.  A former president comes to mind.

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Question - how the hell are NBA arenas supposed to function as polling places?  I'm not sure if PA is unique, but I have a polling place in my neighborhood that everyone that's registered in my district/ward has to go to.  How would the logisitcs work if they were to turn a huge arena into a polling place?  Would all of the local ones shut down (granted, most already have) and everyone has to go to the arena?  Or would you have options?  If the latter, how would the roster be managed to ensure I don't vote in both locations?  Id imagine you'd need to declare well in advance which one you're going to.  The idea, while good on the surface, doesn't seem feasible.

 

I don't think it works here anyway because the basketball team doesn't own or manage the arena, but even if they could do it, I'm not sure how it solves any problem.

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15 minutes ago, BBTV said:

Question - how the hell are NBA arenas supposed to function as polling places?  I'm not sure if PA is unique, but I have a polling place in my neighborhood that everyone that's registered in my district/ward has to go to.  How would the logisitcs work if they were to turn a huge arena into a polling place?  Would all of the local ones shut down (granted, most already have) and everyone has to go to the arena?  Or would you have options?  If the latter, how would the roster be managed to ensure I don't vote in both locations?  Id imagine you'd need to declare well in advance which one you're going to.  The idea, while good on the surface, doesn't seem feasible.

 

I don't think it works here anyway because the basketball team doesn't own or manage the arena, but even if they could do it, I'm not sure how it solves any problem.

Only way I can see it working would cause more confusion. Add more voting precincts to have less people at each once and make it easier, but that will result in people forgetting where to vote and be counter productive.

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4 minutes ago, _J_ said:

Only way I can see it working would cause more confusion. Add more voting precincts to have less people at each once and make it easier, but that will result in people forgetting where to vote and be counter productive.

 

In my part of South Philly, they closed more than half the polling places, and consolidated to a few that are ill equipped to handle the added influx.  Additionally, there's a good number of people that don't know where to go anymore.  Granted, that information is easy for someone with internet access and the desire to know to find out, but not every voter is like that.  I'd have no issue walking across the park by my house to go vote at the rec center like I usually do, but I'm not going to the new place, considering where it is and the mask-wearing (or lack thereof) habits of the people in the neighborhood it's located.  My option is then to vote early by mail, and I'm ready everyday about how that's not going to work for some reason.  People are being disenfranchised at a rate I've not seen before in my 24 years as a voter - and it's not due to Covid.  

 

The arena plan would help some people.  If the equipment existed (which for some reason... in 2020... it doesn't) to have separate queues for each district / ward so as to limit contact with others, I'd probably do it.  But we don't have the polling machines to do it, and more importantly - the people that need to vote the most don't have any way of enduring longer-than-ever lines, because they need to work their usual 10-hr shift at an 'essential business'.  

 

Maybe Lebron can make election day a holiday, and limit 'essential worker' shifts to 4 hours that day.

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If I had never voted before but could also not afford to see an NBA game in person, I would think the opportunity to vote in an arena would be pretty sweet and might move me to register and show up on election day. For some people, that's all it takes. 

 

And if I'm Lamar Jackson or Dak Prescott or Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers, I'm thinking about asking why those big ass football stadiums with big ass parking lots can't also be polling places. And maybe also thinking about similarly striking until that decision is made. Basketball can start a conversation and move things along, but football is so, so much more culturally powerful. 

 

I was talking to a friend that LeBron James has become one of the great civil rights leaders of our time. He normalized political activism among athletes in a way that hadn't been done since Muhammad Ali, and he came out on the other side. Couple that with his school building, and you can see a post-playing career that looks a lot different than what other guys have done with their platform. 

 

The other thing we were saying is how small do Peyton Manning and Tom Brady look right now? Like, maybe they could have shown some spine during the Kap protests? Think of the lost opportunities since 2017. 

1 hour ago, ShutUpLutz! said:

and the drunken doodoobags jumping off the tops of SUV's/vans/RV's onto tables because, oh yeah, they are drunken drug abusing doodoobags

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21 minutes ago, DG_ThenNowForever said:

If I had never voted before but could also not afford to see an NBA game in person, I would think the opportunity to vote in an arena would be pretty sweet and might move me to register and show up on election day. For some people, that's all it takes. 

 

And if I'm Lamar Jackson or Dak Prescott or Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers, I'm thinking about asking why those big ass football stadiums with big ass parking lots can't also be polling places. And maybe also thinking about similarly striking until that decision is made. Basketball can start a conversation and move things along, but football is so, so much more culturally powerful. 

 

I was talking to a friend that LeBron James has become one of the great civil rights leaders of our time. He normalized political activism among athletes in a way that hadn't been done since Muhammad Ali, and he came out on the other side. Couple that with his school building, and you can see a post-playing career that looks a lot different than what other guys have done with their platform. 

 

The other thing we were saying is how small do Peyton Manning and Tom Brady look right now? Like, maybe they could have shown some spine during the Kap protests? Think of the lost opportunities since 2017. 

 

2017:

- The NFL could've just stopped all uses of the National Anthem.

- As you said, Brady and other players could've spoken up in defense of Kap.

- On the flip side, ABC, ESPN and Fox could've said "No" to Vince McMahon's relaunch of the XFL because of his No Kneeling/No Criminality pledge. It didn't take a rocket scientist to figure out whom Vince was specifically catering to.

- Herschel Walker could've expressed some regret for having played for the New Jersey Generals and for that owner who bullied a spring league into moving to fall.

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I still have questions about how Lebron can reconcile what he's doing here in the US with his stance on China.

 

It's one thing for him to be silent about the Uyghur genocide and Hong Kong, but it's another thing for him to call for a punishment for someone speaking out about the actions of the Chinese government.

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5 hours ago, BBTV said:

Question - how the hell are NBA arenas supposed to function as polling places?  I'm not sure if PA is unique, but I have a polling place in my neighborhood that everyone that's registered in my district/ward has to go to.  How would the logisitcs work if they were to turn a huge arena into a polling place?  Would all of the local ones shut down (granted, most already have) and everyone has to go to the arena?  Or would you have options?  If the latter, how would the roster be managed to ensure I don't vote in both locations?  Id imagine you'd need to declare well in advance which one you're going to.  The idea, while good on the surface, doesn't seem feasible.

 

I don't think it works here anyway because the basketball team doesn't own or manage the arena, but even if they could do it, I'm not sure how it solves any problem.

I would think it allows those people of the precinct that it is in to have a polling place that allows for more distancing. AT&T Center is actually located in an area that is more commercial so I'm not sure if they'll have areas marked off for certain districts or just that district. It's also possible that they can set the ballots after you state which district you're from. I won't be too worried because my kid's school is where I vote.

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26 minutes ago, ManillaToad said:

Why is that their responsibility?

 

Why isn't appreciating and respecting the humanity of all people not all of our responsibility?

1 hour ago, ShutUpLutz! said:

and the drunken doodoobags jumping off the tops of SUV's/vans/RV's onto tables because, oh yeah, they are drunken drug abusing doodoobags

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42 minutes ago, ManillaToad said:

Why is that their responsibility?

They've been the faces of the league during their tenure. They should be at the forefront of the league's commitment to social justice.

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14 minutes ago, neo_prankster said:

 

They've also been complicit towards the NFL's collusion to keep Kaepernick out of the league the last three years.

 

And in one case, openly supportive of an administration that publicly denounces social-justice causes.  I hope that's not considered a political comment, because IMO it relates specifically to the topic.  

 

 

They're two needle movers from the biggest sport in the country, and two white people with a lot of influence.  While it shouldn't be the case, the indisputable fact is that our athletes are looked at as role models and leaders in their community.  It's a very big responsibility to bear, and many have failed to live up to their responsibility, but that's just how things are.  

 

Right now, with the leaders from the other sports taking stands and making statements, their absence is noticeable.

 

I guess I'm speaking more about Brady.  It all applies to Manning too, but he just films State Farm commercials these days so maybe there's another star or 10 from the League that could speak up.

 

MJ got beat up for the lack of stand he took in the name of protecting his brand.  These guys have a chance to be better.

"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."

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9 hours ago, JWhiz96 said:

As a black man, I have to say that I'm encouraged by the dialogue in this thread. Not that I'm the authority when it comes to such dialogue, but the conversation has been very civil, people actually looking for action, and people listening and responding rather than talking over each other. That's how it should be done regardless of the issue.

 

As for social injustice/police brutality, I do think this is a tricky issue. There are some things I feel are certain: the players are 100% correct in voicing their opinions and peacefully protesting (i.e. kneeling for the anthem) to get their messages across. While I myself am uncomfortable with kneeling, it is a completely viable, logical, and effective way to at least start a discussion, and the act of kneeling doesn't make one 'un-American' - in fact quite the opposite. You yourself might not agree with it, but at least respect the player's decision whatever it may be.

 

As for player/team walkouts/boycotts, this is a trickier issue for me. While I understand the premise behind it, a move of that nature necessitates further action outside the forum of sports. It's one thing to abstain from work due to causes of the job, I mean, labor unions stage workouts yearly. But to boycott your profession for a stance that is unlikely to end anytime soon (possibly ever), that requires real action, tangible action. Granted, some teams, to their credit, have gone forward and taken the steps necessary to implement changes outside sports: the Baltimore Ravens come to mind. But I just don't see how Giannis not dunking, or Mookie not swinging actively improves police interactions with black people, if anything it's just an exaggerated form of kneeling, and we've already crossed that bridge. It seems as though the boycotts are coming to a close, with the NBA resuming and MLB teams coming back into the fold, so this issue may have solved itself.

 

Unfortunately true, because a new administration is unlikely to affect the thousands of police bureaus that litter the country. The police union, as a whole, needs cleaned and revamped, to the point that it might be unrecognizable to us currently. I really do believe the issue stems there before going down the pipeline and to the courts, etc.

 

What's funny is that many of the same people championing smaller government back the militarization of police, a move I find hypocritical; how can you demand to close public schools and lampoon socialized healthcare but at the same time raise the police budget under the premise of freedom? Where's the fiscal responsibility in that?

This deserves more likes. So very well said. 

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Considering history, any changes will come slowly. It took decades to get from the end of slavery to voting rights and from there to ending segregation in many areas. It may very well take decades before there is a "fairer" voting system, or police forces that the black community can trust. 

The players should be applauded for speaking up, but I also commend the league ownership for at least listening the way the NFL never did, or even care.

I saw, I came, I left.

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