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Digby

2020 NBA Offseason

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Trying to keep near-future talk apart from playoffs talk.

 

Silly season begins:

 

 

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I want the NBA Draft to have the crazy random fun the 2020 NFL Draft had. I was never more entertained by an NFL Draft as I had been this past year and it wasn't because of the players drafted either.  

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I don't really see Doc Rivers as the guy to fix the Sixers' issues. He's always been a wily-old-vets coach, not a young-player developmental coach, and this year's Clippers left a sour taste as far as teams with major chemistry issues go.

 

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Celtics, like Toronto, need to trade or sign a 1st or 2nd team guy to finally get them over that hump. 

No idea who they could realistically get to fit that mold, though. 

 

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13 hours ago, Digby said:

I don't really see Doc Rivers as the guy to fix the Sixers' issues. He's always been a wily-old-vets coach, not a young-player developmental coach, and this year's Clippers left a sour taste as far as teams with major chemistry issues go.

 

I just said to my brother that this won't fix anything. He may be able to pull a couple more wins out than Brown was able to, but this team is very flawed.

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I don't know why people look at a guy who could only win 1 championship with The Big 3 Celtics and believe "That guy is an amazing coach". 

He's average at best. 

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7 hours ago, JayMac said:

I just said to my brother that this won't fix anything. He may be able to pull a couple more wins out than Brown was able to, but this team is very flawed.

 

As a great man-manager and culture-resetter, at least among the players, yeah Doc will almost certainly help. But of the East's top tier, I see the Sixers as the most flawed with the least amount of room to fix it (whatever happened to that Butler guy, anyway), and between that fact and the ongoing Embiid/Simmons awkward dance... Doc has not been known as an analytics guy or particularly creative with the X's and O's, so I dunno.

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6 hours ago, AustinFromBoston said:

I don't know why people look at a guy who could only win 1 championship with The Big 3 Celtics and believe "That guy is an amazing coach". 

He's average at best. 

Are there guys available who have won multiple NBA titles?

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1 hour ago, Digby said:

 

As a great man-manager and culture-resetter, at least among the players, yeah Doc will almost certainly help. But of the East's top tier, I see the Sixers as the most flawed with the least amount of room to fix it (whatever happened to that Butler guy, anyway), and between that fact and the ongoing Embiid/Simmons awkward dance... Doc has not been known as an analytics guy or particularly creative with the X's and O's, so I dunno.

 

The sad thing is that can look to LA to see how the combination of a big point forward and an all-everything center with range can be a really effective combo. Simmons and Embiid have Laker potential and Philly youth, but are squandering it.

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2 hours ago, floydnimrod said:

Are there guys available who have won multiple NBA titles?

Point is he underachieved. 

 

2 Finals appearances, and only 1 championship? A better coach would have won at least 2 or 3 with the group. 

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8 minutes ago, AustinFromBoston said:

Point is he underachieved. 

 

2 Finals appearances, and only 1 championship? A better coach would have won at least 2 or 3 with the group. 

 

The Doc Celtics got literally kneecapped by a season-ending KG injury in year 2. The year 3 loss was as much dumb luck as anything else. Give me a break.

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45 minutes ago, Digby said:

 

The Doc Celtics got literally kneecapped by a season-ending KG injury in year 2. The year 3 loss was as much dumb luck as anything else. Give me a break.

And they got bounced in 2011 & 2012 before things really fell apart. 

He also wasn't that great before the Big 3. 

 

People in Boston loathed him before 08. 

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53 minutes ago, AustinFromBoston said:

And they got bounced in 2011 & 2012 before things really fell apart. 

He also wasn't that great before the Big 3. 

 

People in Boston loathed him before 08. 

We’ll that’s Boston, they are turning on brad Stevens now too

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1 hour ago, AustinFromBoston said:

And they got bounced in 2011 & 2012 before things really fell apart. 

He also wasn't that great before the Big 3. 

 

People in Boston loathed him before 08. 

 

They got bounced by a better team both of those seasons. Not sure what you were expecting there. I know the Celtics were up 3-2 in 2012 but that in itself was something of a minor miracle. Allen was 37, KG was 36, and Pierce was 34. The Big Three were pretty much aged out by that point.

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I don't get it, are you guys trying the arguing that Rivers is a great coach? 

 

He's an ok coach, that's overrated because of 1 championship he won a decade ago. 

I would think his tenure with the Clippers would have proved he's underachieved. 

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3 minutes ago, AustinFromBoston said:

I don't get it, are you guys trying the arguing that Rivers is a great coach? 

 

He's an ok coach, that's overrated because of 1 championship he won a decade ago. 

I would think his tenure with the Clippers would have proved he's underachieved. 

 

I'm not arguing pro- or anti-Doc in this case. I'm just saying that the Big Three was already assembled when those guys were past 30 years old, so their window was always going to be limited in scope as far as them being the focal point. They won a title, won 62 games the next season but lost KG, and then went to Game 7 of the Finals in 2010. After this point, they were aging out and a better team had taken over, almost literally overnight, in the East. 

 

If the Celtics win that Game 7, their legacy is different. And, obviously, they didn't win that game, but that goes to show more than anything else how fine the margins can be for the legacy of a team. If the Celtics don't have that miracle 2nd half comeback in Game 4 of the 2008 Finals, who knows, they could've just as easily come away with zero titles. 

 

Basically, I just think trying to pin the "failure" of the Big Three on Doc is overstating things. 

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12 minutes ago, Kramerica Industries said:

 

I'm not arguing pro- or anti-Doc in this case. I'm just saying that the Big Three was already assembled when those guys were past 30 years old, so their window was always going to be limited in scope as far as them being the focal point. They won a title, won 62 games the next season but lost KG, and then went to Game 7 of the Finals in 2010. After this point, they were aging out and a better team had taken over, almost literally overnight, in the East. 

 

If the Celtics win that Game 7, their legacy is different. And, obviously, they didn't win that game, but that goes to show more than anything else how fine the margins can be for the legacy of a team. If the Celtics don't have that miracle 2nd half comeback in Game 4 of the 2008 Finals, who knows, they could've just as easily come away with zero titles. 

 

Basically, I just think trying to pin the "failure" of the Big Three on Doc is overstating things. 

I'm not saying he's completely responsible for the Big Three only having 1 title, there were other factors like age. I'm just saying people look at that 1 championship and think he's a better coach than he actually is. He has no major accomplishments outside of the Big Three era. 

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On 10/2/2020 at 9:23 AM, AustinFromBoston said:

I don't know why people look at a guy who could only win 1 championship with The Big 3 Celtics and believe "That guy is an amazing coach". 

He's average at best. 

He really didn't do that. Thibodeau thought up the defensive scheme to win in '08, and rightfully so, he got his own head coaching job.

Doc is cool, but he doesn't fix Philly's problems. But I'll save that for the other thread ;) 

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