WSU151 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Ridleylash said: The Spiders' problem isn't "bad", it's that they're known as the worst team ever to grace an MLB field. Nobody talks about the good Spiders teams, only the historically terrible one. It's hard to find anyone to share memories about the good Spiders teams. Not too many guys around that are 130+ years old. People who would have been cognizant of the Spiders' awful year might have fought in WWI and mathematically eligible to be grandparents for WWII. The Spiders' awful season occurred before Teddy Roosevelt became president, and around the time the radio was invented. I think time has healed the wounds. Smart is believing half of what you hear. Genius is knowing which half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFGiants58 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, the admiral said: It isn't that the Spiders were bad, it's that they were answer-to-a-trivia-question bad. It’s like people bringing up “The Rape Rap” to discredit Lindsay Ellis. It was so long ago and in such a different time, why does it matter? Who cares about that team? Of those who do care, how many know that it was blatant collusion that allowed it to happen? 2 minutes ago, Ridleylash said: With how Cleveland AL's history is by itself, the last thing that fanbase needs is to have the combination of "no WS titles since 1948" and "named after the worst team to play in the MLB" for opposing fans to levy at them. Meh, they’ll get over it. What fans bring up the ‘62 Mets or ‘03 Tigers on a regular basis? MLB: Project 32 (Complete), MLB: The Defunct Saga (Complete) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 I don't know what a rape rap is. I just know the Cleveland Spiders had like one of the worst records in sports history and then they folded. It wouldn't be my first choice to go to that well. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 40 minutes ago, Sport said: Spiders is the choice. Historical connection*, you can keep your colors, very cool branding possibilities, unique to sports, you can have Spiderman be a mascot. Who says no? Me, but I'm just saying no to be difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O.C.D Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 24 minutes ago, IceCap said: It can be applied to any race or ethnicity. It's such a generic statement as to either be meaningless or point to you arguing in bad faith. "Historical agency," and "context" aren't your strong suits are they? It can be applied to any race or ethnicity because it’s logically consistent. Races and ethnicities aren’t interchangeable. They’re all unique and specific. It’s neither meaningless nor a bad faith argument. my assessment of ethnic mascots is in relation to the fact that it’s become increasingly taboo to do it and it’s not worth the trouble. Nuance is has been proven to be almost unattainable in that conversation. The argument is presented as a binary; good vs bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, WSU151 said: It's hard to find anyone to share memories about the good Spiders teams. Not too many guys around that are 130+ years old. There's me and oldschoolvikings, but that's about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Wind of Doom Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 25 minutes ago, IceCap said: It can be applied to any race or ethnicity. Yes... That's the point. A dachsund is a specific breed of dog. It doesn't mean every other breed of dog is "normal" and dachsund is special or less than. Native American, Chinese, Irish, Aboriginal Australian are all more specific than "human". That's it. No ill will. It was a response to the question "Isn't 'Indians' as non-speficific as 'spiders'?" It was a simple comparison. Innocent and devoid of bias. 1 hour ago, ManillaToad said: Cleveland Clams 16 minutes ago, floydnimrod said: The Cleveland Jakes. Or better yet: The Cleveland The Jake. Each year a different Jake is rotated as the logo. Think of the merchandise sales! Is it just the amount of talk that has gone on that actually has me liking Clams and Jakes? Clams just sounds good and I kinda like Jake as being an abstract name that ties into team history. It reminds me of Knicks, Blazers, Pacers, and other such names that DO have a meaning but the identity just focuses vaguely on the sport and the name has become "This is a sports team name" rather than "This represents this part of city culture and history". 12 minutes ago, SFGiants58 said: Not really, it’s the moldy cherry on top of the fecal sundae that is the name. But then it's not an argument against the identity. The identity itself is the argument. If the other identities don't fail despite their history enduring equal and sometimes more failure than Cleveland, then arguing that the identity should be thrown out because of the team's history doesn't hold up on its own. And if the argument doesn't hold up on its own, then how is it an argument at all? It's like two guys holding a handle of a bag when one guy can easily hold the bag on his own and the other can't lift an ounce. The other guy is superfluous. One guy is enough. 12 minutes ago, SFGiants58 said: Also, Brandiose isn’t touching this. Aesthetics of the highest levels are veering away from Brandiose cancer. I hope not. And I'm mostly using the company's name to evoke the aesthetic I'm talking about. If it had no history whatsoever, Spiders would be a name that sounds like it's trying to be edgy and cool with a threatening or goofy mascot that will be of the time and dated. It's my only hesitance with it. If the Dolans don't screw it up, then awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 If Jacobs Field had kept its name all this time, Cleveland Jakes would be an intriguing possibility. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Wind of Doom Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 Just now, the admiral said: If Jacobs Field had kept its name all this time, Cleveland Jakes would be an intriguing possibility. I believe that it's kept the nickname the entire time. I don't know if they still have the locals ignoring the name brand and wearing the "I'm still calling it the Jake" caps that were being sold a decade ago, but I can see if being like the Triborough Bridge or Sears Tower where the name change tends to be ignored by the populace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco1997 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 I just can't buy the argument that the Spiders name should be avoided like the plague because it was used by a team that existed for three seasons at the turn of the 20th century and happened to have the worst all time record in MLB history. That's such an obscure factoid to anyone outside of baseball nerds such as ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 12 minutes ago, the admiral said: I don't know what a rape rap is. Neither do I, but I bet Harvey Weinstein is somehow involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco1997 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 Here's a compromise, how about the team takes the name "Spiders" but changes their logo to a photo of Michael Imperioli? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 a-boom-boom-psh, a-boom-boom-psh, well my name is Harvey and I'm here to say, I'm gonna make you blow me in a non-consensual way ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AstroCree Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 When I brought up the Cleveland Spiders as a possible name to people I know, none of them knew it was once a former team who holds the worst record in baseball. Many people still think it's the 1962 Mets. The Cleveland Spiders is not a team the casual baseball watcher know of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gothamite Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, coco1997 said: I just can't buy the argument that the Spiders name should be avoided like the plague because it was used by a team that existed for three seasons at the turn of the 20th century and happened to have the worst all time record in MLB history. That's such an obscure factoid to anyone outside of baseball nerds like ourselves. Bingo. The Green Bay Packers Uniform Database! Now in a handy blog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 Just now, coco1997 said: Here's a compromise, how about the team uses the name "Spiders" but changes their logo to a photo of Michael Imperioli? They say there's no two logos exactly the same. No two primaries, no two style sheets. But do they know that for sure? Because they would have to get all the logos together in one huge space. And obviously that's not possible. Even with computers. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco1997 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, the admiral said: They say there's no two logos exactly the same. No two primaries, no two style sheets. But do they know that for sure? Because they would have to get all the logos together in one huge space. And obviously that's not possible. Even with computers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Survival79 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 43 minutes ago, floydnimrod said: The Cleveland Jakes. Or better yet: The Cleveland The Jake. Each year a different Jake is rotated as the logo. Think of the merchandise sales! "If things have gone wrong, I'm talking to myself, and you've got a wet towel wrapped around your head." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco1997 Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 Just now, Survival79 said: I thought that was Ted Danson for a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Wind of Doom Posted December 17, 2020 Share Posted December 17, 2020 Side note, while looking for specific spiders native to Ohio, I found a page that shows all of them. None of the names are all that appealing, although I've noticed many of the logos that are actually trying to emulate the shape of a spider follow the bulbous shape of the Black Widow. Probably the most famous spider to everyone of the ones on that list. But, while a good name for a women's team, less so for a male one. But looking through I found myself drawn to the number of "fisher spiders", which seems like a nice tie into Lake Erie. Not a well-known or nice-enough-sounding name to run with. But the fisher spiders have a much more almond-shaped body that looks like an interesting shape to run with. One could probably make a nice, unique (given how many other ones there are) C insignia that could work on a hat and also be the centerpiece of a logo. 1 minute ago, coco1997 said: I thought that was Ted Danson for a second. For a split second I thought it was Stallone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.