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NBA Expansion Looming: Seattle and Las Vegas or Vancouver


colortv
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3 minutes ago, colortv said:

I think it would be hard to justify putting a team in Louisville with Indianapolis so close.


They're still further away than Phily is from NYC.  Or Milwaukee from Chicago.  They're also different television markets with a state border inbetween.  If you ask me, these are all arguments for a team in Louisville.  They'd also have another natural rival in Memphis.

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I am obviously no business expert, but this does seem like a really weird time to be expanding.

 

That said I would be over the moon if Vancouver got a team. I think the market would actually really work this time around. As far as an identity goes, I know they won't be bringing back the Grizzlies name, but they need to use those awesome teal, black and red colours again.

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52 minutes ago, NicDB said:


They're still further away than Phily is from NYC.  Or Milwaukee from Chicago.  They're also different television markets with a state border inbetween.  If you ask me, these are all arguments for a team in Louisville.  They'd also have another natural rival in Memphis.

 

You're comparing apples and oranges. Chicago and Milwaukee have combined metros of 11 million.  Combined state population of 18 million.

 

Sits in the middle of this region: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Lakes_Megalopolis

 

NYC and Philly have combined metro populations of over 25 million. 

 

Sits in the middle of this region: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_megalopolis

 

It's simpe numbers.

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2 hours ago, colortv said:

Also the NBA's talent pool is growing exponentially as the game grows both nationally and globally.

 

There's so many guys who just need minutes and opportunities who are exploding right now(Christian Wood).

 

Even the worst teams in the league have talent and are being competitive on the floor, couldn't say that 15 or 20 years ago.

Yet somehow the only teams to win a championship in the modern era could only do so by collecting at least two of the league’s top 10 players to do so. 

 

All you’re saying is that the middle is getting better. But it’s still the middle. Adding two more teams to the mix waters it down even more.

 

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3 hours ago, DNAsports said:

Does anybody else remember that half-assed attempt the Kings made about moving to Norfolk/Virginia Beach a few years ago?
 

 

(For the record, Norfolk should never be considered for an NBA)

Honestly, wouldnt be the worst idea. Hampton Roads has a sizeable population( 2 mil, I believe) and has Virginia's largest population by city in Virginia Beach. Can also pull in people from NC as well. Large military population would allow it to have opposing fans and be a draw. Now, the Scope isnt up to snuff but could rebuild.

 

 

There are, of course, places that are much, much better suited but it's not a bad idea. 

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20 minutes ago, gosioux76 said:

Yet somehow the only teams to win a championship in the modern era could only do so by collecting at least two of the league’s top 10 players to do so. 

 

All you’re saying is that the middle is getting better. But it’s still the middle. Adding two more teams to the mix waters it down even more.

 

 

Hence the need for The Process.

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4 hours ago, DG_ThenNowForever said:

 

That's me! Except I was never a Sonics fan. I just wanted a team in the city I live in.

 

I don't see Vancouver happening, because I still think it carries the same stigma it did the last go-round. Vancouver is a wonderful cosmopolitan city and one of the most beautiful I've ever been to, but it's tucked in a corner way down there and, unlike Toronto, not close to other American metropolises besides Seattle, which itself is pretty removed.

 

As a Vancouverite who lived through the mismanagement (by the team and the league) and players pouting about not wanting to play for the Grizzlies, I'm torn on the idea of the NBA coming back to Vancouver.  On one hand, it would be nice.  On the other hand, while the business side should be better, I'm pessimistic about the basketball side of things and think it will be much of the same as before.  I definitely don't see it as a destination for star players, nor even really good players, as I don't think the team will ever truly be good enough to attract them.  Even if they draft a star player, there is no guarantee they won't walk at the first chance they get. 

 

I also worry about how it might affect the other teams in the city.  The Canucks are bulletproof, but the Lions especially could take a hit and they are already in a bit of trouble.

 

I honestly see Vancouver as third or fourth on the expansion list with Seattle being number one, of course.

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4 hours ago, DNAsports said:

Does anybody else remember that half-assed attempt the Kings made about moving to Norfolk/Virginia Beach a few years ago?

 

I sure do! Summer of 2012, season was about to start and they threw out that they were looking at Virginia Beach with Comcast Spectacor putting up a building by the convention center. I think that took about two weeks to putter out.

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25 minutes ago, M4One said:

 

As a Vancouverite who lived through the mismanagement (by the team and the league) and players pouting about not wanting to play for the Grizzlies, I'm torn on the idea of the NBA coming back to Vancouver.  On one hand, it would be nice.  On the other hand, while the business side should be better, I'm pessimistic about the basketball side of things and think it will be much of the same as before.  I definitely don't see it as a destination for star players, nor even really good players, as I don't think the team will ever truly be good enough to attract them.  Even if they draft a star player, there is no guarantee they won't walk at the first chance they get. 

 

I also worry about how it might affect the other teams in the city.  The Canucks are bulletproof, but the Lions especially could take a hit and they are already in a bit of trouble.

 

I honestly see Vancouver as third or fourth on the expansion list with Seattle being number one, of course.

 

A lot of film and television production takes place in Vancouver, I think it would have more things going for it than a lot of mid-market teams in terms of attracting talent.

 

 

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1 hour ago, gosioux76 said:

Yet somehow the only teams to win a championship in the modern era could only do so by collecting at least two of the league’s top 10 players to do so. 

 

All you’re saying is that the middle is getting better. But it’s still the middle. Adding two more teams to the mix waters it down even more.

 

 

No, I'm saying the bottom half of the league is getting better.

 

Star players bunching up on teams is a problem, but that would be a problem if you had 15 teams instead of 30 too.

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3 minutes ago, colortv said:

 

A lot of film and television production takes place in Vancouver, I think it would have more things going for it than a lot of mid-market teams in terms of attracting talent.

 

 

 

What does that have anything to do with attracting players?  Sign here and maybe you can get a movie deal out of it?

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Just now, M4One said:

 

What does that have anything to do with attracting players?  

I guess the thought process is some players want to become actors after a playing career, and with lots of filming taking place in Vancouver it could help them. Not sure why'd they go for Vancouver over LA for that (plus Atlanta is like that as well) but it's another point for business.

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2 minutes ago, M4One said:

 

What does that have anything to do with attracting players?  Sign here and maybe you can get a movie deal out of it?

 

A lot of NBA players are involved in pop culture, hanging out with celebrities, dating them etc.

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39 minutes ago, the admiral said:

 

I sure do! Summer of 2012, season was about to start and they threw out that they were looking at Virginia Beach with Comcast Spectacor putting up a building by the convention center. I think that took about two weeks to putter out.

 

Norfolk lasted way longer in MLB relocation talks (from about 2003-04) than one would expect. Granted, they were the backup plan should DC not get its act together in building a stadium, but still!

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If Seattle isn’t one team, I’ll swear off the NBA altogether. It’s been far too long and we will finally have the arena shortly.

 

I love Vancouver and it’s an interesting possibility... the infrastructure is better than it was in the 90s. Plus they could very quickly supplant the Rockets as China’s team of choice given the proximity, large Chinese-Canadian population and the fact you will always have an NBA-ready arena by virtue of the Canucks being in town. I would never ever recommend NFL or MLB there because it would be a traffic nightmare but the city is already equipped for an arena size crowd.

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31 minutes ago, colortv said:

 

No, I'm saying the bottom half of the league is getting better.

 

Star players bunching up on teams is a problem, but that would be a problem if you had 15 teams instead of 30 too.

I get that. But what’s the point of having a stronger bottom half of the league if they still don’t stand even a remote chance of winning it all? 
 

A successful season for most NBA franchises would be getting into the second round of the playoffs. Like, that’s the pinnacle — the most that can be hoped for. I can’t imagine why, as a fan, that’s appealing.

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58 minutes ago, gosioux76 said:

I get that. But what’s the point of having a stronger bottom half of the league if they still don’t stand even a remote chance of winning it all? 
 

A successful season for most NBA franchises would be getting into the second round of the playoffs. Like, that’s the pinnacle — the most that can be hoped for. I can’t imagine why, as a fan, that’s appealing.

 

This isn't MLB. The NBA has a cap and free agent structure that makes it possible for any team to succeed given competent management. Look at the Knicks and Bulls the last 20 years compared to say the Spurs.

 

Even the Lakers didn't win a title or make the Finals for 10 years.

 

Golden State was one of the worst franchises in the NBA for 35 years, they turned it around with management and good ownership to become a premier franchise and it had nothing to do with the market.

 

Yes it can also require some luck in drafting a star player or acquiring them in a trade, it's difficult but it's not even close to impossible. The fact is a lot of teams are just poorly run or they themselves settle for mediocrity, ie as you said just fielding a playoff contender in a mid market and selling tickets.

 

 

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23 hours ago, GDAWG said:

If the NBA goes to Las Vegas, the city will have gone from 0 major league teams to 3 in under a decade.  I don't recall any city getting three major league teams in less than a decade.  I know in DFW, it took 20 years for the area to get three major league teams: Cowboys in 1960, Rangers in 1972 and Mavericks in 1980.

Minneapolis/St. Paul had the Twins move there in '61, Vikings join the NFL in '61, and the North Stars join the NHL in '68.

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