Bleujayone Posted May 29, 2005 Posted May 29, 2005 The NFL votes shortly on the overall fate of the NFL Europe (Germany?) aka World League of American Football. It's apparently been bleeding out money from year to year, and many wonder if it just isn't more profitable to develope players in the Arena and Canadian leagues. A curious idea has come up to keep the league but move all teams back to North America. If such a move were to take place, I wonder what cities might be under consideration, and if the people in those places would support anything but and NFL calibre team? Especially since I do not recall the North American based teams to be all that financially successful to begin with. .......................Will NFL Europe survive? It's a developing situation.Monday, May 16, 2005By Ed Bouchette, Pittsburgh Post-GazetteWhat began as the World League of American Football begat NFL Europe and pretty much has become NFL Germany could soon turn into a continent without a league.Although attendance for NFL Europe has risen 8 percent through the first five weeks of this season, the six-team spring football league continues to lose money for NFL owners, and what was supposed to be a developmental league has produced few good prospects in the past several years.While the Euro may be gaining strength, NFL Europe could be on its deathbed.Twenty-four of the 32 NFL owners this year must approve the continuation of an experiment that began in 1991 or this could be the end of commissioner Paul Tagliabue's bold bid to make football a global sport. The league barely earned a two-year extension in 2003 when eight owners voted against it, one short of killing NFL Europe, something that could happen the next vote. It's not on the agenda for the NFL's May meeting, so the vote likely will take place in October."I don't think anybody knows that until we go to a meeting," said Houston Texans general manager Charley Casserly, one of eight members of the league's working group on NFL Europe football operations. "Every year it goes down to a meeting and most of the time it comes down to one vote. Until we go in and hear the whole picture in a meeting, I don't think anybody can predict it."The NFL Europe listed 262 former players on NFL rosters last season, and 27 of its former quarterbacks have started in the NFL. Five NFL Europe veterans made the Pro Bowl this year. Of those five, however, only Kansas City guard Brian Waters played in Europe in this century (Berlin, 2000) and the days of Kurt Warner, Jake Delhomme, Brad Johnson, Jon Kitna and Jay Fiedler coming through NFL Europe to make a splash in the NFL is but a fond memory.Scouts and others in the NFL moan about the lack of good prospects in NFL Europe this season and say the primary benefit of sending their players across the Atlantic seems to be the roster exemptions they gain in training camp for doing so. Each NFL team must send at least three players on their 80-man roster to the spring league, but there is no limit.The Steelers, for example, have 11 on NFL Europe rosters this spring and thus may bring 91 players to training camp as long as those 11 are among them. There's not a recognizable name in the bunch, although center Ben Claxton is playing well.Parts of the problem are NFL teams and their coaches and the evolvement of the game here. Most teams refused to send any of their decent players to Europe because they want them working at home during minicamps, voluntary spring practices and meetings. The Steelers used to send their young quarterbacks to Europe, including Jim Miller, but no more."No question, that's a big part of it," Casserly said. "But there have been some young guys who developed. You're not going to develop starters."The league that began with 10 teams and played in six countries (including the United States in 1991 and '92), has one team in Amsterdam, The Netherlands, and five in Germany. Long gone are the London Monarchs, the Scottish Claymores and the Barcelona Dragons. Putting most of the teams in Germany has boosted attendance because it is more popular there than in any other European country."It started with the Americans over there in the '50s, '60s and '70s," said John Beake, a former longtime Denver Broncos general manager who now works as a consultant for the league in NFL Europe."Back in those days, there was very good [armed] service football and it spilled down to their schools. In Europe, football's not played in schools. They play in clubs. But there's a very good American football league, the German Football League, with two divisions: junior for ages 15-19 and senior for 20 and up."League-wide average attendance after five weeks stands at 17,224; the average attendance in 2004 was 15,925. Frankfurt leads with an average attendance of 27,477. But moving most of the teams to Germany limited one of the business objectives of NFL Europe -- to sell NFL merchandise throughout the continent.There are no figures available on precisely how much the spring league drains from NFL owners' profits, but there are good reasons for it to continue. For one, while they barely made the minimum in their last vote, 24 owners did agree two years ago to keep it going through 2005. It provides the NFL Network and Direct TV with sports programming until Fox takes over for the last three weeks of the season and the World Bowl.The attendance increase is the league's first since 2001, when it averaged 18,568 fans. And Tagliabue strongly believes in the league and the NFL having a presence in Europe.The NFL also uses the league to develop officials and coaches, including a minority coaches' program for former NFL players."People feel very strongly about the positives in that area," Casserly said. "It's hard to break into coaching now. The colleges have so many restrictions. It's a chance to develop officials as a go-between college, Arena Football and the NFL."Rumors have the NFL possibly moving the league to the United States, but that was tried when it began as the World League of American Football in 1991 and it did not work, causing the league to be put on hiatus for 1993 and 1994 before becoming all-Europe in 1995. "Our audience was so sophisticated because we have the NFL and great college football," Beake said. "Spring football to [American fans] is not on their radar screen."Whether the NFL's spring league remains on anyone's screens beyond this year is hard to say, but Beake believes there's a need for it. "I believe in it totally in my heart. I think it's needed now more than ever with youngsters coming out of college younger and finding it difficult to jump into the NFL. It gives them time to play more and mature."....................................................... We all have our little faults. Mine's in California.
NJTank Posted May 29, 2005 Posted May 29, 2005 Hmmm thats too bad. Maybe they will start some sorta minor league football here. Or perhaps look to NFL Japan www.sportsecyclopedia.com For the best in sports history go to the Sports E-Cyclopedia at http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com
Stampman Posted May 30, 2005 Posted May 30, 2005 I say--leave it in Germany--- Comic Sans walks into a bar, and the bartender says, "Sorry, we don't serve your type here."
youcan'tseeme Posted May 30, 2005 Posted May 30, 2005 If this league folds then the CFL is in better condition then it is now. All those players. theycould add 1 maybe 2 new teams! Come on NFl fold NFL Europe
JH42XCC Posted May 30, 2005 Posted May 30, 2005 NFL Latin America, NFL Asia, or NFL Australia anyone?
NJTank Posted May 30, 2005 Posted May 30, 2005 I guess this could be the Final Countdown for NFL Europe. www.sportsecyclopedia.com For the best in sports history go to the Sports E-Cyclopedia at http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com
DEAD! Posted May 30, 2005 Posted May 30, 2005 NFL Latin America, NFL Asia, or NFL Australia anyone? Or how about the NFL Springtime travelling road show? With stops in Mexico City, London, Moscow, Sydney, Tokyo I saw, I came, I left.
Stampman Posted May 31, 2005 Posted May 31, 2005 I guess this could be the Final Countdown for NFL Europe. Hmmm the Final Countdown was a song by a band called Europe...The Final Countdown Comic Sans walks into a bar, and the bartender says, "Sorry, we don't serve your type here."
Mac the Knife Posted May 31, 2005 Posted May 31, 2005 I guess this could be the Final Countdown for NFL Europe. Hmmm the Final Countdown was a song by a band called Europe...The Final Countdown I think that was the point...Personally I think NFLE is a good idea poorly executed. Is it really necessary for these clubs to play in these huge stadia? I haven't seen figures, but I'll bet a buck that there isn't an NFLE team that draws 25,000 a game - so why play in these massive soccer facilities that seat 50, 100,000?Is it really necessary to have almost entirely American talent playing? The league could cut costs and develop more local interest if they required half their rosters to be native sons. The CFL has a limit on imports to preserve itself as a Canadian game, why shouldn't NFLE?
Alphabet Man Posted May 31, 2005 Posted May 31, 2005 NFL Latin America, NFL Asia, or NFL Australia anyone? Or how about the NFL Springtime travelling road show? With stops in Mexico City, London, Moscow, Sydney, Tokyo except it would be autumn ! and where is Melbourne? surely the Sports Capital deserves it more than Sydney, who don't even liek sport as much as us! twitter.com/thebrainofMatt
Stampman Posted June 1, 2005 Posted June 1, 2005 I guess this could be the Final Countdown for NFL Europe. Hmmm the Final Countdown was a song by a band called Europe...The Final Countdown I think that was the point... I thought so too--just helping out... Comic Sans walks into a bar, and the bartender says, "Sorry, we don't serve your type here."
Brian in Boston Posted June 4, 2005 Posted June 4, 2005 I haven't seen figures, but I'll bet a buck that there isn't an NFLE team that draws 25,000 a game... NFL Europe's 2005 attendance figures:The Frankfurt Galaxy played home games before crowds of 31,644... 22,347... 27,439... 25,347... and 40,109. Their total home attendance was 146,886. Their average home attendance was 29,377. The Waldstadion's capacity is 30,000 excluding standing-room sections.(You owe me a dollar. ) The Rhein Fire played home games before crowds of 25,304... 20,399... 18,632... 28,124... and 20,203. Their total home attendance was 112,662. Their average home attendance was 22,532. LTU Arena's capacity is 51,500.The Hamburg Sea Devils played home games before crowds of 19,865... 15,228... 16,415... 16,889... and 21,204. Their total home attendance was 89,601. Their average home attendance was 17,920. AOL Arena's capacity is 55,000.The Cologne Centurions played home games before crowds of 9,468... 10,821... 8,863... 9,485... and 32,521. Their total home attendance was 71,158. Their average home attendance was 14,231. RheinEnergieStadion's capacity is 50,997.The Amsterdam Admirals played home games before crowds of 10,234... 10,131... 13,227... 14,423... and 16,371. Their total home attendance was 64,386. Their average home attendance was 12,887. Amsterdam ArenA's capacity is 51,328.The Berlin Thunder played home games before crowds of 16,199... 14,312... 16,109... 16,695... and 20,927. Their total home attendance was 84,242. Their average home attendance was 16,848. The Olympic Stadium's capacity is 76,000.NFL Europe drew 568,935 spectators to 30 games for a league-wide average attendance of 18,964.... so why play in these massive soccer facilities that seat 50, 100,000?The facilities in which NFL Europe's member-franchises play are the top-flight stadiums in the cities in which they are located. One can presume that the selection of these stadia as host facilities is part and parcel of the National Football League's desire to position itself, vis-a-vis marketing, as the leader in the modern professional sports marketplace... a position it has, in fact, become quite accustomed to, and deservedly so. The league could cut costs and develop more local interest if they required half the rosters to be native sons.However, while one of the league's goals from its inception as the WLAF has been to "break ground in the globalization of American Football", that's not to say that NFL executives and owners regard the unearthing of international players via NFL Europe's Operation Discovery program to be of paramount importance in achieving said goal. In fact, it can be argued that discovering foreign-born American football players and developing their talents has always been seen as a bonus with regard to operating NFLE/WLAF... not the focus.There are many reasons that the WLAF was initially founded, not the least of which was placing an NFL-administered spring-season football league in North American markets so as to dissuade the launch of a rival circuit a la the USFL. Additionally, it allowed the NFL to maintain some semblance of control over a pool of players who might be on the cusp of becoming regular contributors in the league; players who were long on potential but had yet to show the staying power necessary to catch-on long-term in the NFL. Establishing teams in Montreal, London, Frankfurt and Barcelona was seen as a bonus... a way of testing - and growing - the popularity of the NFL's brand internationally. In truth, beyond kickers and punters the initial 40 Project Discovery players culled from the European amateur ranks were little more than a public relations gimmick, pure and simple.Even today, the notion that there are enough international gridiron football players of adequate talent available to stock half the roster slots of the NFL Europe squads is stretching things a bit. Frankly, if it were mandated that half the roster spots on NFL Europe franchises be filled by Operation Discovery players, the quality of play in the league would likely drop - at least for the forseeable future - to a level that would prove inadequate to draw the number of spectators the league enjoys now. Rather than increase local interest, the addition of "native sons" to the roster beyond the level that participate now would likely decrease the size of crowds. There is something to be said for the fact that European fans of American football are drawn to NFL Europe because it gives them an opportunity to see the potential stars of tomorrow's NFL, today. Besides, NFL Europe is far too valuable as a means of providing additional playing time for the aforementioned players-on-the-cusp who are already under contract to NFL franchises.
DEAD! Posted June 4, 2005 Posted June 4, 2005 I haven't seen figures, but I'll bet a buck that there isn't an NFLE team that draws 25,000 a game... With twenty-nine of NFL Europe's thirty 2005 games having been played, the following attendance figures are available:The Frankfurt Galaxy played home games before crowds of 31,644... 22,347... 27,439...25,347... and 40,109. Their total home attendance was 146,886. Their average home attendance was 29,377. The Waldstadion's capacity is 30,000 excluding standing-room sections.(You owe me a dollar. ) So Mad Mac will you paying by cash, credit, or debit? I really think the whole point of having a European league is to attempt to market the game globally and the European market seems to be the most appropriate place to do it. You could have a similar league in the US, but the size of crowds would be the same and also the NFL wouldn't expand it's fan base. With the kind of money the NFL takes in, I'm sure they are willing to spend some of their money on this league. It gives marginal players some playing time and learn a new culture. If I was a player, I would love to play in Amsterdam I saw, I came, I left.
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