Phillies fans rejoice!

[Titanium Eagle]

http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/sports/12866913.htm

Holy god!

News conference at 4 PM!

[BBTV]

Yeah, I actually got a little 'inside info.' about this one last week.

But why did they hire back Uncle Charlie and the coaches? Wouldn't any competent GM want to hire his own people? Why would any of the top names that have been mentioned (Cashman, Hunsicker, etc) come here if they can't run the show the way they want to?

My guess (with no inside info on this one) is that it will just be handed to Ruben Amaro Jr., which is the equivelant of polishing a terd. It's still a terd.

Edit: Monty just stated that the new GM will have the final say on the manager / coaches. Unfortunately, he also said that Mike Arbuckle and Ruben Jr. will interview, and he isn't sure about outside candidates.

[VitaminD]

[Hall & Oates] He?s gone oh i, oh i?d

Better learn how to face it

He?s gone oh i, oh i?d

Pay the devil to replace her

He?s gone - what went wrong... [\Hall & Oates]

It wouldn't be a surprise (or a good thing) if it wound up being Ruben Amaro Jr. He's a Wade flack, which means by the Transitive Property, he is a Monty flack. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for Hunsicker making his way to the job, but I am not optimistic.

As for Uncle Cholly, he seems to set a tone for these guys that makes them happier. I don't know that he is as bad as people think. Yeah, he made questionable moves, but the team played for him through the final game, which is more than can be said about Larry Bowa. If they can get out from under some of their bad contracts (Lieby, Bell, Thome) and actually develop some of their minor league talent, they might be good enough where you don't need Tony LaRussa running the team.

[BBTV]

[Hall & Oates] He?s gone oh i, oh i?d

Better learn how to face it

He?s gone oh i, oh i?d

Pay the devil to replace her

He?s gone - what went wrong... [\Hall & Oates]

It wouldn't be a surprise (or a good thing) if it wound up being Ruben Amaro Jr. He's a Wade flack, which means by the Transitive Property, he is a Monty flack. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for Hunsicker making his way to the job, but I am not optimistic.

As for Uncle Cholly, he seems to set a tone for these guys that makes them happier. I don't know that he is as bad as people think. Yeah, he made questionable moves, but the team played for him through the final game, which is more than can be said about Larry Bowa. If they can get out from under some of their bad contracts (Lieby, Bell, Thome) and actually develop some of their minor league talent, they might be good enough where you don't need Tony LaRussa running the team.

Pinch running for Pat Burrell while he was on THIRD BASE? Forgetting there wasn't a DH in the National League? Pulling pitchers after the 5th or 6th inning when nobody could hit them? Putting Cormier in any game? I don't think he is quite as bad as WIP makes him out to be, but he's pretty dad-gum bad, and is overmatched as a manager.

[VitaminD]

I'm not saying he's not overmatched; I think that's beyond crystal-clear. But the team seems to respond to this down-home corn-fed mularkey.

What the Phils would be wise to do, would be to hire someone to sit next to Cholly on the bench. And when Manuel gets up to do something questionable, zap him with a cattle prod and explain why he shouldn't do what he is about to. Allow Manuel to set the tone and be the "Aw, shucks and dad-gummit" face of the operation, and put someone with brains in the shadows, pulling the strings.

[tp49]

Heh, there's always an opening in Tampa Bay for Ed Wade. I just hope for the Phillies sale that Chuck LaMar isn't on the short list of GM candidates.

[VandyDelphia Mike]

About the only thing that would be better than getting rid of Ed Wade would be to get rid of Dave Montgomery and have the group that owns the team sell to a whole different owner.

Isn't that about due to happen now? The stadium's been built, the return on initial investment should be fairly lucrative by now, and a new, Lurie-esque type could come on the scene and change the culture in the Phillies organization?

[WJMorris3]

The Phillies have fired Ed Wade

Though the move has been too long delayed

Now Phils fans rejoice

For the team heard our voice

That he wasn't worth what he was paid.

Charlie Fife is the next one to go

As we all think his talent is low

He pulled pitchers too fast

Leaving Phils fans aghast

And we saw how much he doesn't know.

[NJTank]

Why would they fire Manuel, he got them within 1 game of teh playoffs despite the loss of Jim Thome.

[WJMorris3]

Remember, Tank, the Phils did not finish a game out of the wildcard because of Charlie Manuel.

Rather, they finished a game out in spite of Manuel. With a competent manager (like Jim Leyland, maybe?), this team would have won the division.

[BBTV]

Why would they fire Manuel, he got them within 1 game of teh playoffs despite the loss of Jim Thome.

For the aformentioned reasons. The guy admitted that he forgot there's no DH !!!. He makes poor decisions nearly every game, and probably cost the team 9 games just in his bafoonary. His handling of pitchers is horrid, his decision to keep J.Rol as the leadoff hitter all season was absurd, his refusal to shift Abreu in the order was bad, his tinkering of Chase Utley may have cost the kid a potential MVP award (yes that's a stretch, but if the kid was allowed to start all season and led the team to the division title, it could have happened.) He also stuck with Thome wayyyy too long when he was killing the team (for what it is worth: it is a documented fact that Thome got him hired in the first place.) He also stuck to David Bell, who is the league leader in GIDP.

Can he tell a great story? Sure. Can he manage in the big leagues? Hell no.

Why would he not have any other offers once Cleveland got rid of him? Why would they get rid of him after two 90+ win seasons if he had any ability?

[BB61]

The fact is that the team has been just "good" for too long, when we're being assured by the GM that everything is okay. He had too much faith in the wrong people, and frankly it's hurting their fan base. I mean, I gave up on them in mid September when they lost 5 in a row to Washington and Houston.

The truth is that he just doesn't have to balls to go out and get a player, and when he gets someone that is sub par (David Bell, for example), he doesn't have the balls to let them go.

Now what I'd like to see them do is get either Theo Epstein or Brian Cashman and have them rattle the entire baseball world with a few big trades. That would be wonderful.

[BBTV]

Not only that, but an entire fan base has rebelled against the organization. Never in my life have I seen fans root against their team like I did this year. The thought being that if they didn't make the playoffs, Wade would go. Philadelphia was at one time among the top baseball cities in the country, but that is all gone now, and people like Monty and Wade are a major part of that. We can't get rid of Monty, but maybe he is finally ready to turn control over to an actual baseball guy for the first time since Lee Thomas, who they got rid of for Wade in the first place.

This organization has stolen the joy of baseball from generations of young fans, and I will never forgive them for it. It is a shame when parents tell their kids that they can't go to games because they don't want to give their hard earned money to such a dispicable franchise. This is one small step in the right direction. Getting rid of those gutless, heartless, overpaid, underacheiving, players who day-in and day-out criticized us and said we weren't real fans, we don't understand the game, we only go to boo, we don't deserve a winner, etc.

Players who criticized the fanbase (that I personally heard / witnessed)

F Jimmy Rollins (yes, he did it.)

F Kenny Lofton (possibly the worst of the bunch)

F Pat Burrell (I personally witnessed him 'lecture' Phillies fans while in Chicago)

F Billy Wagner (go back to virginia to your farm. your alpacas won't boo when you blow a save to the Astros and cost us the playoffs.)

F Uncle Charlie (telling us we need to do our homework. Newsflash: there's no DH.)

F Ed Wade (telling us we need to learn patience. 1 world series in 122 years and we need to learn patience? Guess what? You'll need to learn patience while looking for a new job, because you ain't getting one any time soon.)

Bobby Abreu would have said something, but he was too lazy.

Jason Michaels probably would have said something, but he's hitting cops instead of curve balls.

Brett Myers is too busy bitching about the stadium to say anything.

I hate these players, and this ownership. I'm hoping that strong leadership from a real GM will help to bridge the gap between players and fans, because this ownership group (the silent partners) couldn't care less. I (along with 6 million other fans in Phila.) want to love this team soooooo bad, but they've made it impossible. Here's hoping that changes.

[EagleFan344]

Not only that, but an entire fan base has rebelled against the organization. Never in my life have I seen fans root against their team like I did this year. The thought being that if they didn't make the playoffs, Wade would go. Philadelphia was at one time among the top baseball cities in the country, but that is all gone now, and people like Monty and Wade are a major part of that. We can't get rid of Monty, but maybe he is finally ready to turn control over to an actual baseball guy for the first time since Lee Thomas, who they got rid of for Wade in the first place.

This organization has stolen the joy of baseball from generations of young fans, and I will never forgive them for it. It is a shame when parents tell their kids that they can't go to games because they don't want to give their hard earned money to such a dispicable franchise. This is one small step in the right direction. Getting rid of those gutless, heartless, overpaid, underacheiving, players who day-in and day-out criticized us and said we weren't real fans, we don't understand the game, we only go to boo, we don't deserve a winner, etc.

Players who criticized the fanbase (that I personally heard / witnessed)

F Jimmy Rollins (yes, he did it.)

F Kenny Lofton (possibly the worst of the bunch)

F Pat Burrell (I personally witnessed him 'lecture' Phillies fans while in Chicago)

F Billy Wagner (go back to virginia to your farm. your alpacas won't boo when you blow a save to the Astros and cost us the playoffs.)

F Uncle Charlie (telling us we need to do our homework. Newsflash: there's no DH.)

F Ed Wade (telling us we need to learn patience. 1 world series in 122 years and we need to learn patience? Guess what? You'll need to learn patience while looking for a new job, because you ain't getting one any time soon.)

Bobby Abreu would have said something, but he was too lazy.

Jason Michaels probably would have said something, but he's hitting cops instead of curve balls.

Brett Myers is too busy bitching about the stadium to say anything.

I hate these players, and this ownership. I'm hoping that strong leadership from a real GM will help to bridge the gap between players and fans, because this ownership group (the silent partners) couldn't care less. I (along with 6 million other fans in Phila.) want to love this team soooooo bad, but they've made it impossible. Here's hoping that changes.

Best post I have read all year.

[RyanB06]

The fact is that the team has been just "good" for too long, when we're being assured by the GM that everything is okay. He had too much faith in the wrong people, and frankly it's hurting their fan base. I mean, I gave up on them in mid September when they lost 5 in a row to Washington and Houston.

The truth is that he just doesn't have to balls to go out and get a player, and when he gets someone that is sub par (David Bell, for example), he doesn't have the balls to let them go.

Now what I'd like to see them do is get either Theo Epstein or Brian Cashman and have them rattle the entire baseball world with a few big trades. That would be wonderful.

Forget Theo. Boston will have him re-signed in short order (if he isn't already).

Cashman's an intriguing pick, though - if he doesn't take the Nats' job, that is.

And you guys moaning about Charlie Manuel, look at it this way: you could've hired Grady Little.

[BBTV]

The fact is that the team has been just "good" for too long, when we're being assured by the GM that everything is okay.  He had too much faith in the wrong people, and frankly it's hurting their fan base.  I mean, I gave up on them in mid September when they lost 5 in a row to Washington and Houston.

The truth is that he just doesn't have to balls to go out and get a player, and when he gets someone that is sub par (David Bell, for example), he doesn't have the balls to let them go.

Now what I'd like to see them do is get either Theo Epstein or Brian Cashman and have them rattle the entire baseball world with a few big trades.  That would be wonderful.

Forget Theo. Boston will have him re-signed in short order (if he isn't already).

Cashman's an intriguing pick, though - if he doesn't take the Nats' job, that is.

And you guys moaning about Charlie Manuel, look at it this way: you could've hired Grady Little.

If you can win with Tito Francona, we could win with Grady Little.

Nah, probably not.

Paging Lou Pinella... Paging Lou Pinella...

[PhilaLogos]

The "Hey, Its all Wade's fault" mentallity is a bunch of unfair propaganda engineered by second-guessing sports writers like Howard Eskin, who I might add, would've traded Abreu for Jay Gibbons and was mad at Ed Wade for not getting Al Lieter, yeah, he was fire this season.

Overall, Ed hasn't made many bad moves, but rather is critisized for what he DIDN'T do, which is unfair. They wanted an ace pitcher, like the great Carl Pavano, who turned out to be a bust. Had Ed Wade spent 9 mil a year to get Pavano like the Yankees did, Ed Wade would've been great for a few months, and then called an idiot by every Eskin-like writer in town, which is why it is much easier to write about a guy than it is to be him.

So who do we want know, the brilliant Brian Cashman?? If we're mad that we can't get to the playoffs with 95 million, how mad would we be if we can't get out of the first round with 210?? Cashman has an unlimited budget, and gives like 12 mill+ a year to over-the-hill pitchers like Kevin Brown and Randy Johnson. As I mentioned before, he spent 9 mill a year to get an unproven bust in Pavano, also falling under that category is the great Jaret Wright. We're upset about the contract Wade gave Thome?? Ever heard of Bernie Williams, not to mention Jason Giambi has had 80 good games for all those millions.

The problem with this team was not Wade, nor our manager, but the short-comings of guys like Abreu, Burrell, Wagner, and Urbina down the stretch. Wade put more than enough talent on the field to win, he cannot make them come through in the clutch.

[VitaminD]

The problem with this team was not Wade, nor our manager, but the short-comings of guys like Abreu, Burrell, Wagner, and Urbina down the stretch. Wade put more than enough talent on the field to win, he cannot make them come through in the clutch.

But who overestimated the value of players like Abreu and Burrell - and Lieberthal - by signing them to contracts which make them untradeable? Who acquired players like Urbina (...and Mike Williams... and Dennis Cook... and Turk Wendell...) who added next to nothing when we needed them the most? Who hired a manager who overused his bullpen all season so that Wagner was wearing down by the time September rolled around? Who thinks so much of these guys who can't produce in the clutch, then sets the tone that good is good enough in Philadelphia?

As for the "not many bad moves" comment: how about the ones he did make? Schilling for... garbage, and an inconsistent Vicente Padilla. Scott Rolen for... nothing now, since we turned the onw true asset in that trade (Polanco) into Ugie Urbina and Tomas Martinez. A GM with some creativity could've kept Polanco at 3rd, kept Utley at 2nd, and gotten something serviceable for David Bell.

I'm not saying it's all Ed's fault. And like most, I cheered the signings of Thome and Bell, not knowing then that they'd break down soon after. I was thrilled at the Millwood/Estrada trade, not knowing then how we got screwed. But 8 years is 8 years; do you realize the company the Phils are keeping, as one of the teams that has failed ot make the playoffs since the Wild Card Era started? Ugh!

For $95 mil, they should not tolerate "good is good enough". Not when I'm forking over $25 to get seats that would've run me $14 at the Vet a couple years ago, and $6.50 for a beer.

[BBTV]

PhilaLogos, your insinuation that those of us who called for Wade's head are a bunch of sheep who get our knowlege from sports-talk radio is just not fair. In addition to what VD pointed out about the contract values making these players untradable, what about the no-trade clauses he has handed out like candy? What about hiring Charlie Manual over Jim Leyland, when Leyland was openly campaigning for the job? Ed Wade had a condescending approach towards the fans, and a mentality that it was good enough just to be 'in the mix' for a playoff spot, and that mentality spread all the way down to the players, as witnessed by their statements towards the fans, and their tendancy to just quit whenever the pressure is on. How many years, and for how many managers will they come up short in September?

Now, I will agree with the notion that it wasn't ALL Wade's fault. Obviously, he works within the constraints of a terrible ownership group that has winning listed as number 11 on their list of 10 things to accomplish every year. However, the bottom line is 95mill is 95mill, 500k lost fans is 500k lost fans, etc. He is a terrible GM who is unable / unwilling to make any gutsy moves to put this team over the top, and for that he should be fired.

Ed Wade in a nutshell: "If these guys just play up to their potential..."

[VandyDelphia Mike]

The hope here is that someone from outside of the organization is brought in to replace Wade.

The current ownership group? They have been afraid to take a risk ever since those free agent signings of Lance Parrish and Ken Howell didn't work out as planned ... you'd think they would be over that by now.