A complaint about the Coyotes

[capn89]

I think the one thing that ruins hockey for me, at times, are people who are bigots when it comes to where a particular sports team is located. Why is hockey the only of the fours major (baseball, basketball, football) where "fans" complain about where a team is located? Do you know how much a league with only 6 teams would suck, today? Maybe it worked back in the stone age when talent was weak, less people played and less people gave a damn than they do today, but it's great to have teams from all over. There are certain things about the league I hate, particularly revenue sharing. In my opinion, if you can financially support a team, I could care less if it was in Montreal or Mexico. And I'm sure there are teams from the "non traditional hockey markets" that could easily out perform, financially, certain teams from "hockey country."

[powersurge]

How come nobody on Sportcenter knows how to pronounce the word "Coyotes"?

I think it's worse that most of the people cannot pronounce Jaguars... as they always seem to call them "Jag-wires." WTF is a Jag wire?

I know what you mean... I absolutely hate people pronouncing it that way.

And I'm sure there are teams from the "non traditional hockey markets" that could easily out perform, financially, certain teams from "hockey country."

I think you summed it up right there. My definition of hockey country is Canada and Northern US. We've already seen what happen to most Canadien teams. The North Stars left, the Pens almost left, the Whale left, etc. There is no such thing as "hockey country" anymore.

Just to put it in perspective... Imagine US football teams like Pittsburgh or Green Bay moving to Winnepeg or Quebec. That sounds ludicrous, but this is kind of what happened with the NHL. Sad... very sad.

[ashbob]

Their "Decade in the Desert" patch isn't on the left shoulder. Oh no, there's still nothing over there. Instead, they decided to slap it onto the right chest, a couple inches away from the "PHX" shoulder patch. Man, that looks unbalanced and bad.

I already have issues with the 'Yotes for just cloning the 1967 road Leafs jersey, coloring it red, and being done with it. I have issues with the plain white lettering and numbering. Both the striping and cresting could benefit from touches of sand and black. Also, their classy, simplistic crescent moon alternate logo has been relegated to a small spot on the pants. Now this misplaced patch. A lot of people like the simplicity of the Coyotes' uniforms. For me, everytime I look at them, I see unfulfilled potential. Either fix this or bring back the original unis (ah, what a guilty pleasure.)

Damn, 3 pages of this thread and still no picture...you guys suck...

[powersurge]

I love those unis. Nice classic look. I don't really see the Redwings connection, but then again its subjective.

[zer0dotcom]

I love those unis. Nice classic look. I don't really see the Redwings connection, but then again its subjective.

I can from them only using the two colours in their actual uniform. That has bothered me for so long, the primary and other logos all feature three colours (For arguement sake, Black counts as a colour) Brick, sand and black.

Yet only the brick and sand are on the uniform. I don't mean for there to be oodles of black, but a highlight stripe or an outline for the numbers would make it a much rounder look. I especially don't like the single layered numbers. That only works if you have a colour scheme using white and (blank). When there are obviously three different colours on your logos, and only two on your uniform, it looks bush league. Even if they just made their numbers triple layered they could leave the name single and it would be acceptable.

[ColeJ]

I love those unis. Nice classic look. I don't really see the Redwings connection, but then again its subjective.

I can from them only using the two colours in their actual uniform. That has bothered me for so long, the primary and other logos all feature three colours (For arguement sake, Black counts as a colour) Brick, sand and black.

Yet only the brick and sand are on the uniform. I don't mean for there to be oodles of black, but a highlight stripe or an outline for the numbers would make it a much rounder look. I especially don't like the single layered numbers. That only works if you have a colour scheme using white and (blank). When there are obviously three different colours on your logos, and only two on your uniform, it looks bush league. Even if they just made their numbers triple layered they could leave the name single and it would be acceptable.

so you'd like to see the blackhawks simplify their logo to only red, black, and white? or would you prefer they wear rainbow colored striping?

the coyotes uniforms look fine... but the patches are lopsided this season.

[zer0dotcom]

so you'd like to see the blackhawks simplify their logo to only red, black, and white? or would you prefer they wear rainbow colored striping?

No, I'd like to see the Coyotes add a little touch to their uniform, I think it would complete it alittle more. Where did you find anything relating to the Chicago Blackhawks in my post?

[The_Admiral]

I think he's crossing his wires with the other guy's Hawk talk in the thread. You are right about the Coyotes though. Also, those Impact numbers don't match the nameplates.

[ColeJ]

no... that's not it.

i read your post as complaining about how the coyotes have 2-color (red, white) uniforms, but 4-colors (black, white, red, tan) on the logo.

and i'm just citing the blackhawks as a team that uses way more colors in their logo than their uniforms.

why would it be ok for the blackhawks to use a logo with extra colors, but not for the coyotes?

maybe i misunderstood.

[zer0dotcom]

no... that's not it.

i read your post as complaining about how the coyotes have 2-color (red, white) uniforms, but 4-colors (black, white, red, tan) on the logo.

and i'm just citing the blackhawks as a team that uses way more colors in their logo than their uniforms.

why would it be ok for the blackhawks to use a logo with extra colors, but not for the coyotes?

maybe i misunderstood.

OK, I can see were you're coming from

For myself, the fundamental difference is that the Hawks use so many colours it would be impossible to include all of them without making a total mess out of the uniform. The 'Hawks have 'gotten away' with it I think because of their place as an origonal six team. It can work on Red and Black unifroms since it stands out on them, and links to both colours at the same time.

In addition, the Black Hawks use a triple scheme of Black, red and white in their uniform design instead of a dual (white + other)

With the Coyotes, it's working with fewer colours, and the black is a very visibile colour on their logo, yet is not visible elsewhere. The other two teams to have gone with a dual scheme have been the leafs and the Red Wings. The Leafs updated and added silver to their scheme, it only appears though as the tird layer of their numbers. Not a huge addition, but enough that it ties into the scheme. Thats really all I would look for for the Coyotes. They have the 'dual' colour uniforms, but have a logo that is not two colours, and one of those colours is very noticable.

Even if they were just to have a single layer around the numbers in black it would tie the logo to the uniforms a bit more. If the black in the logo were not so promient, then it wouldn't be such an issue for me, but to have it that noticable in their logo, yet only use the brick and sand in the design doesn't gel well with me.

Thats the PoV I'm coming from

[ColeJ]

i think of logos less as a part of the uniform, and more as a patch.... like you'd see on a soldier or policeman (maybe cause i work at the police station)... the cops have navy uniforms, but red, white, blue, yellow, on their patches...

i feel like having black outlines on the numbers would then require black outlines on the stripes of the jersey.

but the logo can have as many colors as they want, since it's just a patch on the front of the uniform.

i see where you're coming from, definately, though.

[Puck]

1) San Francisco/Oakland/San Jose is a huge metropolitan area and should logically have a team for the good of the league. Their fans have supported the Sharks very very well, and they didn't steal the team, unless you count half of the North Stars. Having a team in Phoenix is not really crucial to the health of the league the way Los Angeles and greater S.F. are.

I would refute that given the fact that Phoenix was one of the first places chosen to get NHL off-site games. And all the games that were played in Phoenix pre-Coyotes were sellouts that left the fans craving more. One game in particular, Canadiens and Nordiques, that was standing room only in said worst hockey venue in the league at the time. Two teams that have ZERO connection to Phoenix. And in the hockey world, Phoenix being the polar opposite of Quebec.

I would also refute your idea that Phoenix isn't crucial given that it was a market that is still one of the largest growing metropolises in the country, has been since the hockey expansion that gave the Sharks, Ducks, Lightning, Panthers, and Senators of the 90s. A city that, prior to the boom in the 90s, was in the 30-40s region TV market wise to now the 15th and still climbing.

And as far as history goes, it's not like the Coyotes have been this city's only fore into hockey. It was there on the front lines of the WHA with the beloved Hartford, Edmonton, Quebec and Winnipeg. It was there fighting the pre-NHL markets of Los Angeles and San Francisco in lesser known leagues. It was there during the rise and fall of the IHL and it's also there in the bi-coastal expansion that the ECHL has become.

And while the team did suffer being in a badly designed hockey arena, one that is the first owner's fault for not DOING anything to fix the problem, to hate a team because of that while the Penguins have NEVER KNOWN another building, does make you the hypocrite the other guy painted you as. Also, moving into newer buildings when it's done solely for money, should bring up questions about your dedication when it comes to the arenas in Boston, Chicago, Toronto and Montreal...all done within the Betman years. The ghosts still haven't come over to the new building in Montreal, have they?

And yes, I'll admit, that I too would love to see the Jets play and the Coyotes an expansion team. I still miss a line that had Tomas Steen and Teemu Selanne and Keith Tkachuck on it. I miss the days of a defensive pairing of Teppo Numminen and Fredrik Olausson. I miss the days of when Bob Essensa was the man and Nikolai Khabibulin was a rookie. But before you spout off about how those days no longer matter because they're the Coyotes, I do point out as a purist you should probably hate the Sharks since they effectively killed the Minnesota North Stars.

But to the topic at hand, now that someone came around and posted pictures of the patches, I agree, it does sort of make the jersey unbalanced and really does belong on the shoulder.

[tommytimp]

I still prefer the Hopi-inspired uniforms. The "new" ones are not interesting enough.

[hecticbro]

Man, what's your problem with the Phoenix Coyotes? Shouldn't you blame the city of Winnipeg for not doing enough for keeping the franchise? This really ticks me off as a Coyotes fan. We've even retire Hull and Steen's numbers, IN RED, WHITE, and BLUE! Isn't there something the Coyotes can do, other than move or fold, that would get you off their backs?

The campaign to save the Jets was probably the hardest-fought losing battle with regard to team relocations, so it's not like they just sat idly by. That said, this is a board full of Canadians and hockey purists who maintain that the NHL belongs in hockey country, so any argument for the Coyotes is gonna be a hard sell.

That's the problem. The idea that the Coyotes is all wrong is just that, wrong. If the Canadians were so supportive of the Jets, why didn't they build the arena in the 1st place? And what's wrong for a team to move if they can't get the best facility? Is there any argument that I can use so that these guys will finally get off the Phoenix Coyotes' back?

Can one of you admins delete this thread? I'm getting sick and tired of these people blasting the Coyotes for just existing.

Come on, you can't tell me you really think Arizona deserves that team more than Winnipeg. The unbalanced economics of the NHL made it harder for the Jets and the Nordiques to survive, and now we've got too many teams in too many crappy markets. The play is watered down, and adding teams in the South and California hasn't seemed to do anything for the league's credibility. They still don't go to games down there unless the team is a Cup contender (and sometimes even that's not good enough, just look at Carolina's poor attendence despite making the '02 Cup) and they still don't produce players. Hockey was better off when it had about ten fewer teams and stuck to markets where people cared about the sport.

[Gary]

btw to support Zer0s argument, I read a couple years ago in the AZ Republic that the Coyotes simplistic uniforms inspiration were the Redwings and the Maple Leafs.

[ColeJ]

btw to support Zer0s argument, I read a couple years ago in the AZ Republic that the Coyotes simplistic uniforms inspiration were the Redwings and the Maple Leafs.

i assumed they wanted to look soviet...

because they do...

and that's why they look nice.

[-Helix-]

My complaint is that the Coyotes were a decent and fun team to watch back in the late 90's and now they are boring.

I blame Wayne.

Their old uniforms were much better IMO. I don't see why creativity like that is so hard to come by nowadays. But I guess you can't go wrong with 100 year old stale boring ripoffs.

[letterform]

I think the one thing that ruins hockey for me, at times, are people who are bigots when it comes to where a particular sports team is located. Why is hockey the only of the fours major (baseball, basketball, football) where "fans" complain about where a team is located? Do you know how much a league with only 6 teams would suck, today? Maybe it worked back in the stone age when talent was weak, less people played and less people gave a damn than they do today, but it's great to have teams from all over. There are certain things about the league I hate, particularly revenue sharing. In my opinion, if you can financially support a team, I could care less if it was in Montreal or Mexico. And I'm sure there are teams from the "non traditional hockey markets" that could easily out perform, financially, certain teams from "hockey country."

This seems to be the main thing that Winnipeg NHL supporters seem to forget. Winnipeg is simply too small to support an NHL team and the population isn't equiped to pay NHL ticket prices. More importantly the city's corporate support is almost non existant.

They had the lowest ticket prices in the league by far when they had a team, but they couldn't sell out their building. How could they possibly support a team when a smaller arena and far less luxury suites would demand that ticket prices be up near the top of the NHL average? It just doesn't make sense economically.

[Gothamite]

btw to support Zer0s argument, I read a couple years ago in the AZ Republic that the Coyotes simplistic uniforms inspiration were the Redwings and the Maple Leafs.

i assumed they wanted to look soviet...

because they do...

and that's why they look nice.

Hey, you gotta give the Soviets that - they knew uniforms.

As for the Coyotes, I liked the old look, but the new one is pretty sharp. I don't mind the simplified color palette.

[powersurge]

Hey, you gotta give the Soviets that - they knew uniforms.

I've gotta say that when you think of the uniforms that would best describe "the enemy" or "the bad guys" theirs are it. Bright blood red and white with big block letter font "CCCP" It doesn't get more bad ass then that.