Canucks Jersey Talk

[letterform]

Perhaps you should read better...

I know I did mention First Nations representations of Orcas (First Nations are Canadian, that is unless you have proof otherwise)

I know the exchange rate between the Canadian and US dollar is waffling and everything, but I guess nonexistent victories are going for real cheap up there...

Perhaps you should remember what you posted before you contradict yourself.

First you argue that brendan17's is splitting hairs, but now that it suits you, you turn 180 degrees and use his arguement about first nation's art differing from the Canucks Orca.

ya but the current canuck logo isn't suppose to represent the first nations or vancouver it is suppose to represtent the company that owns them.

and the canucks logo is not a native style whale

this is a native style whale

It's a stylized version of First Nations artwork of an orca like you show. Nice try trying to be picky, but it didn't work.

Are you just bored and looking to start a flame war or do you like to argue for no reason?

[westcoastoiler]

I don't have a problem with the Orca "C". Apart from the obvious corporate tie in, I think it works. The stylized first nations design is nice looking for a logo, but there are about a billion different ways a first nations artist can represent an orca anyways.

I find the real problem with the jerseys is the striping at the bottom. It's just too big and takes up too much of the jersey. Thin it down and they'd look sweet.

[IceCap]

And you said this isn't the first time a NHL team has done this. Please, give examples.

Who do you think were the first owners of the Toronto franchise? (Look it up) and the nonsense continues to this day, as the current ownership group is MLSE. I, for one, demand they change the franchise's name right now, as it it nothing but a brazen example of unchecked commercialism in sports today!

And folks, you can wring your hands all you want, but the definition from the Oxford Dictionary of the English Language (The closest thing to an official dictionary that English has) says a Canuck is not only a Canadian person, but anything Canadian. Connotations and localised explanations are nice and all, but that's the definition. Got a problem with it? Contact Oxford University.

So one of your arguments for the Orca logo is that for two years the Toronto Maple Leafs were known as the Toronto Arenas, and owned by the owners of the Toronto Arena? That was for two years, during the NHL's first two seasons? The fact that a team had a "corporate" name for two seasons almost a hundred years ago doesn't really help your argument. As for MLSE, they were formed and named that long after the team had adopted the Maple Leafs name. Nice try, but like the Arenas argument, you fall short.

Oh, and FYI, I didn't need to look the "Toronto Arenas" stuff up. I'm all set when it comes to the history of hockey, especially my favorite team. So cut the patronizing "the knowledge I have of the Canadian psyche" crap out, ok?

And you can wring your hands all you want, I'm looking at Webster's English Dictionary, which defines "Canuck" as:

Canuck, n: a Canadian

So, no, a canuck is not just some abstract Canadian idea. It is a Canadian person. An orca is not a Canadian person. A lumberjack can represent a team named the "Canucks" in a much better way then an orca could.

Orca = Canadian

Flying Skate = Canadian

A hockey stick on a rounded rectangle = Canadian

The Canucks have NEVER had a logo that makes sense, but the Orca logo is the nicest they've ever had. It's even nicer than any Johnny Canuck logo I've ever seen (and even then, the Vancouver Giants use a better representation than the other Johnny Canuck logos).

Also, an Orca can be a Canadian if it is born in Canadian waters.

I think in the Vancouver Canucks case, a wordmark logo may be in order. I seriously do think that would work best with this team.

--Roger "Time?" Clemente.

You are correct. The team has never had a logo that represents the team's name, and thus, IMO, has never had a good logo. At most the stick/rink should be used as a shoulder logo.

Just because a corporate logo happens to look the nicest out of all the logos they've had is no reason to settle. The fact remains that the team does not have a logo that, as you put it, "makes sense."

So why not start now? Why not use Johnny Canuck (which besides actually representing the name, also looks pretty good as well)? The fans seem to love the stick/rink logo, so keep that as the alt/shoulder logo.

And no, an Orca born in Canadian waters is not a Canadian. Show me an Orca with a passport, SIN card, and a birth certificate issued by the province of British Columbia and we'll talk.

Again, to drive the point home:

1) Canuck=Canadian person

2) Johnny Canuck logo=lumberjack=one of the many professions associated with Canadians

3) Orcas are not Canadians, and therefore can not be canucks

4) Orca logo=Orca Bay's attempt to turn the Vancouver Canucks into skating billboards

Are you just bored and looking to start a flame war or do you like to argue for no reason?

Yes, he does. He sees what the general board consensus is, then he argues against it.

[Gothamite]

Again, to drive the point home:

1) Canuck=Canadian person

2) Johnny Canuck logo=lumberjack=one of the many professions associated with Canadians

3) Orcas are not Canadians, and therefore can not be canucks

4) Orca logo=Orca Bay's attempt to turn the Vancouver Canucks into skating billboards

Yep, that's the point I was trying to make.

I actually like the Orca logo, but the contention that it somehow represents a "Canuck" because of the multiple interpretations of Johnny Canuck is silly on its face.

[IceCap]

Again, to drive the point home:

1) Canuck=Canadian person

2) Johnny Canuck logo=lumberjack=one of the many professions associated with Canadians

3) Orcas are not Canadians, and therefore can not be canucks

4) Orca logo=Orca Bay's attempt to turn the Vancouver Canucks into skating billboards

Yep, that's the point I was trying to make.

I actually like the Orca logo, but the contention that it somehow represents a "Canuck" because of the multiple interpretations of Johnny Canuck is silly on its face.

I agree, it looks nice. It would work for a team called the California Orcas/Killer Whales (or any other location that began with a C), but not for the Vancouver Canucks.

[Roger Clemente]

Nobody ever said Johnny Canuck couldn't be a whale.

--Roger "Time?" Clemente.

[navywhitestripes]

dont get me wrong but the orca came out the same year the carolina hurricanes did. the nhl needed a whale

[Gothamite]

Nobody ever said Johnny Canuck couldn't be a whale.

--Roger "Time?" Clemente.

Well, nobody said that our Uncle Sam couldn't be a badger, Marianne couldn't be an apple or John Bull couldn't be a rock.

They don't need to. Johnny Canuck is a human personification of Canada. He has held many jobs, but he's never been anything but.

[Brian in Boston]

There's a simple reason that ownership/management of the Vancouver Canucks isn't likely to adopt a new logo featuring "Johnny Canuck" anytime soon: the presence of the Vancouver Giants - and their logo - on the Greater Vancouver sports scene.

Successful modern sports branding and merchandising is all about establishing a unique presence in the marketplace. For a major professional sports franchise to adopt a logo that would seem to be infringing on the brand of a minor professional - or, in this case, junior - sports franchise would seem to be concession on the part of the major pro team that they'd failed where the lower-level team had succeeded. As true as that may be, it would do little to make the major-league club stand-out in the marketplace.

Sure, it would have been terrific if the Vancouver Canucks' rebranding in 1997 had included a logo akin to what the Giants have used since 2001. Such a logo would have drawn upon the traditions of the original Canucks of the Pacific Coast Hockey League and Western Hockey League. Then again, it would have been terrific for the Vancouver Canucks to adopt such a logo upon entry into the NHL back in 1970. However, team ownership chose not to in 1970... and new owners repeated the decision in 1997. That left the door open for the Vancouver Giants to unveil a modern logo that undoubtedly pays homage to the "Johnny Canuck" logo of the PCHL and WHL versions of the Vancouver Canucks.

Bottom line? I have to believe that the "Johnny Canuck" ship has sailed in terms of logo designs for the NHL's Vancouver franchise. Unless the Vancouver Giants are going to inexplicably abandon their very attractive and well-designed logo, why would the Canucks attempt to rebrand with a logo featuring a similar lumberjack character?

Oh, by the way... pending final approval from the NHL, Orca Bay is no longer a part-owner of the Vancouver Canucks. The Aqulini Investment Group has purchased John McCaw's 50% stake in the franchise. The deal gives Aquilini control of General Motors Place, as well. So, technically speaking, the killer whale on the Vancouver Canucks jersey no longer represents the team's owner.

[yh]

I think in the Vancouver Canucks case, a wordmark logo may be in order. I seriously do think that would work best with this team.

Since the Toronto MLSE Leafs have the other big stereotype nailed down, I think a beaver or even an RCMP on horseback would be great also. Maybe combine them both...

Nice beaver!

[leedsunited]

WE WANT THE BEAVER!

[OMMF]

I think in the Vancouver Canucks case, a wordmark logo may be in order. I seriously do think that would work best with this team.

Since the Toronto MLSE Leafs have the other big stereotype nailed down, I think a beaver or even an RCMP on horseback would be great also. Maybe combine them both...

Nice beaver!

Thanks, I just had it stuffed yesterday.

(/naked gun quote)

[IceCap]

Oh, by the way... pending final approval from the NHL, Orca Bay is no longer a part-owner of the Vancouver Canucks....So, technically speaking, the killer whale on the Vancouver Canucks jersey no longer represents the team's owner.

Which makes the Orca's presence on the uniforms just stupid and pointless (before it was stupid, but it served a point, however stupid said point may have been).

[powersurge]

Geez, has anyone ever noticed how much energy is wasted on picking apart each other's opinions? My god its like you can't express a damn opinion anymore without having some "wanna be" philosopher challenging your "logic" "argument" or "reasoning". For god's sake people its a uniform and sports logo board, not a political issues forum. Just because someone is particularly adept at picking apart someone else's opinions it doesn't make their own opinions more valid than others. I love discussions, its the "arguments" that drive me nuts. Save that stuff for issues that really matter in the real world.

I personally think the Orca logo is a poor representation for Vancouver. Where's my logic? In my head. I just don't like it. If you want me to go into a long over blown detail by detail dissertation about why I don't like it then don't hold your breath.

Put simply, when I think of the Vancouver Canucks and ice hockey an Orca doesn't come to mind.

I find it gimmickie like a minor league baseball team using a cat or cutesie animal as part of its logo scheme. I also don't even think the colors work either. I loved the originality of the "Germany" color scheme much better.

I don't mean to insult people with my previous comments. I just cringe when I see people going at eachother. Can't we all just discuss and not "argue" our points?