Nashville Predators Being Sold?

[PeytonManningRocks]

I think I should chime in on the "traditional vs. non-traditional" market nonsense.

Looking at the current 30-team landscape, I can break the teams and markets into 4 categories:

The Great Markets:

Toronto

Ottawa

Montreal

Boston

Buffalo

Detroit

NY Rangers

Minnesota

Colorado

Edmonton

Vancouver

Calgary

The Good Markets:

Chicago

Pittsburgh

Philadelphia

New Jersey

San Jose

The Okay Markets

Los Angeles

Anaheim

St. Louis

Washington

Tampa Bay

Dallas

NY Islanders

Columbus

Atlanta (borderline)

The We-Should-Think-of-Relocating Markets

Phoenix

Florida

Carolina

Nashville (obviously)

Now, let's look at each case individually:

Phoenix: There are at least some northern transplants in Phoenix that appreciate hockey, but not that much, and the owner says he's losing money, so he should move.

Florida: the state of Florida is full of retirees from the north, so as a hockey market Florida's not that bad at all, but I think the state of Florida only needs 1 team, and that's Tampa Bay (fan support and a little history)

Carolina: Yes this team does have a cup, but this season when the team wasn't that good (which was most of the season), there weren't a whole lot of fans there, and most of the people in Raleigh, NC don't care as much about hockey as other places, including Florida. Therefore they should probably move eventually.

Nashville: Obvious choice for relocation, no need to explain this one.

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

[HedleyLamarr]

Tampa Bay is also the 12th largest media market in the country. To say it took the Lightning 12 seasons to get to where they are is a bit much. The team had a tremendous run of success in the Thunderdome, and they had fan support early.

Tampa Bay had, at best, average attendance, until the 2002-03 season, and got their huge boost after winning the Cup.

They weren't anywhere close to drawing 20,000 per game until their Cup season.

If Tampa Bay had average attendance with one of the worst collection of teams in modern NHL history, what does that say about Nashville's attendance in a new arena with a playoff team? The Lightning routinely drew well in the Thunderdome, they set NHL single game regular season and playoff attendance records while playing there.

The new-ness of Nashville's arena wore off before they became playoff contenders, since there are other events that were held there.

That's great that Tampa has the single-game records of attendance, but it's not an honest statement, since they weren't playing in a typical hockey venue. How was Tampa faring in attendance in, say, the 2001-02 season?

[Webhamster]

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

I'm not sold on Hamilton. I think the Leafs and Sabres (and probably Red Wings) would put up a mighty fight against that. Halifax, however, is intriguing. That's a whole untapped market, the idea is interesting. Does Halifax have the population/corporate interests to support a pro team? In the end, though, I can't see Hamilton or Halifax being considered "big league" enough to convince the other owners that they'd be a good draw at the gate.

Winnipeg and Houston are prime markets. I think the NHL is also looking at Kansas City and Portland too. Seattle is too close to Vancouver so it's out. Portland fits rather nicely into that spot. Cleveland and Hartford are probably other markets that could get a second look. And right out of left field, what about Salt Lake City?

[jkrdevil]

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

I'm not sold on Hamilton. I think the Leafs and Sabres (and probably Red Wings) would put up a mighty fight against that. Halifax, however, is intriguing. That's a whole untapped market, the idea is interesting. Does Halifax have the population/corporate interests to support a pro team? In the end, though, I can't see Hamilton or Halifax being considered "big league" enough to convince the other owners that they'd be a good draw at the gate.

Winnipeg and Houston are prime markets. I think the NHL is also looking at Kansas City and Portland too. Seattle is too close to Vancouver so it's out. Portland fits rather nicely into that spot. Cleveland and Hartford are probably other markets that could get a second look. And right out of left field, what about Salt Lake City?

Seattle is out because there is no NHL capable facility. Key Arena is an NBA only facility where a hockey rink takes the capacity down to around 10,000 I believe and the sightliness are worse than America West was. I believe Paul Allen is back in control of the Rose Gardens and he does not want an NHL team in there so Portland is out. With a team in Columbus I think Cleveland is out of the question. While not in Columbus' territory I would think the league would feel that Cleveland is too close to Columbus and with Columbus they already have the Ohio presence they need. Hartford is too small and too close to NY and Boston.

[Patrick L. Kennedy]

Tampa Bay is also the 12th largest media market in the country. To say it took the Lightning 12 seasons to get to where they are is a bit much. The team had a tremendous run of success in the Thunderdome, and they had fan support early.

Tampa Bay had, at best, average attendance, until the 2002-03 season, and got their huge boost after winning the Cup.

They weren't anywhere close to drawing 20,000 per game until their Cup season.

If Tampa Bay had average attendance with one of the worst collection of teams in modern NHL history, what does that say about Nashville's attendance in a new arena with a playoff team? The Lightning routinely drew well in the Thunderdome, they set NHL single game regular season and playoff attendance records while playing there.

The new-ness of Nashville's arena wore off before they became playoff contenders, since there are other events that were held there.

That's great that Tampa has the single-game records of attendance, but it's not an honest statement, since they weren't playing in a typical hockey venue. How was Tampa faring in attendance in, say, the 2001-02 season?

I grant you that it doesn't paint the whole picture, because it is only single game attendance, but it still shouldn't be held against them. They had a large dome, and they filled it to capacity. They were a new team coming off of a strike year, that is a potential death knell to any franchise. But Tampa Bay got behind their team and showed tremendous support.

And for 2001-02, the Lightning were at the back end of the middle 1/3 of the league, finishing 20th with an average of 15,722. That was ahead of Calgary, Pittsburgh, Boston, and the Islanders.

To put that in perspective, the Lightning with all the 69 points they had finished higher in attendance than.....

1) The East's No. 1 seed and an Original Six franchise (Boston)

2) The 95 point Phoenix Coyotes

3) The East's No. 5 seed (New York)

4) Nashville

5) The Eastern conference champions (Carolina)

6) The West's No. 5 seed and an Original Six franchise (Chicago)

7) Mario Lemieux's Pittsburgh Penguins

8) A Canadian team (Calgary)

[PeytonManningRocks]

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

I'm not sold on Hamilton. I think the Leafs and Sabres (and probably Red Wings) would put up a mighty fight against that. Halifax, however, is intriguing. That's a whole untapped market, the idea is interesting. Does Halifax have the population/corporate interests to support a pro team? In the end, though, I can't see Hamilton or Halifax being considered "big league" enough to convince the other owners that they'd be a good draw at the gate.

Winnipeg and Houston are prime markets. I think the NHL is also looking at Kansas City and Portland too. Seattle is too close to Vancouver so it's out. Portland fits rather nicely into that spot. Cleveland and Hartford are probably other markets that could get a second look. And right out of left field, what about Salt Lake City?

That's actually not a bad idea to go to Utah, where the only major-league team there is the Jazz (unless you want to count Real Salt Lake)

As for Halifax, the metro area in 2006 had about 382,000 people. Not very big, only the 13th largest metro area in Canada, but the largest in Atlantic Canada, and I would imagine that a lot of people in Halifax would go to see the team play (assuming ticket prices weren't as insanely priced as those in Toronto)

[zer0dotcom]

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

I'm not sold on Hamilton. I think the Leafs and Sabres (and probably Red Wings) would put up a mighty fight against that. Halifax, however, is intriguing. That's a whole untapped market, the idea is interesting. Does Halifax have the population/corporate interests to support a pro team? In the end, though, I can't see Hamilton or Halifax being considered "big league" enough to convince the other owners that they'd be a good draw at the gate.

Winnipeg and Houston are prime markets. I think the NHL is also looking at Kansas City and Portland too. Seattle is too close to Vancouver so it's out. Portland fits rather nicely into that spot. Cleveland and Hartford are probably other markets that could get a second look. And right out of left field, what about Salt Lake City?

That's actually not a bad idea to go to Utah, where the only major-league team there is the Jazz (unless you want to count Real Salt Lake)

As for Halifax, the metro area in 2006 had about 382,000 people. Not very big, only the 13th largest metro area in Canada, but the largest in Atlantic Canada, and I would imagine that a lot of people in Halifax would go to see the team play (assuming ticket prices weren't as insanely priced as those in Toronto)

The key to a team in Atlantic Canada is drawing in people from the perihery cities around Halifax to support the team. I'd be very interested to see if a team would consistantly draw in the Maritimes. Personally, it wouldn't be the first city/region I'd consider for a team, it's more out there with creating a brand new market IMO.

Utah is an interesting idea. It'd be right beside the Avs and Coyotes so the regional rivalries could be there, as well as a possible fanbase from the other teams (depending how many communters bother to travel to Pheonix and Denver to see games)

[DarkJourney]

With all this talk about the Predators moving to Hamilton I have this gut feeling they will end up moving to Kansas City instead.

[rams80]

Now, for four new markets that SHOULD be in the NHL:

Hamilton: They'll have their team soon enough

Winnipeg: Bring Back the Jets! Enough said.

Houston: If Bettman was so intent on southern expansion, why did he NOT go to Houston? 4th largest city in the U.S., instant rivalry with the Dallas Stars, and an NHL-ready arena in the Toyota Center. It makes perfect sense.

Halifax: Atlantic Canada should have a team.

I'm not sold on Hamilton. I think the Leafs and Sabres (and probably Red Wings) would put up a mighty fight against that. Halifax, however, is intriguing. That's a whole untapped market, the idea is interesting. Does Halifax have the population/corporate interests to support a pro team? In the end, though, I can't see Hamilton or Halifax being considered "big league" enough to convince the other owners that they'd be a good draw at the gate.

Winnipeg and Houston are prime markets. I think the NHL is also looking at Kansas City and Portland too. Seattle is too close to Vancouver so it's out. Portland fits rather nicely into that spot. Cleveland and Hartford are probably other markets that could get a second look. And right out of left field, what about Salt Lake City?

That's actually not a bad idea to go to Utah, where the only major-league team there is the Jazz (unless you want to count Real Salt Lake)

As for Halifax, the metro area in 2006 had about 382,000 people. Not very big, only the 13th largest metro area in Canada, but the largest in Atlantic Canada, and I would imagine that a lot of people in Halifax would go to see the team play (assuming ticket prices weren't as insanely priced as those in Toronto)

The key to a team in Atlantic Canada is drawing in people from the perihery cities around Halifax to support the team. I'd be very interested to see if a team would consistantly draw in the Maritimes. Personally, it wouldn't be the first city/region I'd consider for a team, it's more out there with creating a brand new market IMO.

Utah is an interesting idea. It'd be right beside the Avs and Coyotes so the regional rivalries could be there, as well as a possible fanbase from the other teams (depending how many communters bother to travel to Pheonix and Denver to see games)

Lets see Halifax get a CFL team (and how they fare with that) first before giving them a NHL team.

Utah does sound intriguing, but I just can't the NHL going into a market that small and into a situation where they won't have the primary lease at the arena.

[DarkJourney]

Energy Solutions Arena in Salt Lake only seats around 14,000 for hockey and The E Center is West Valley only seats 10,000.

[MadmanLA]

Energy Solutions Arena in Salt Lake only seats around 14,000 for hockey and The E Center is West Valley only seats 10,000.

Here's the hockey seating map at Energy Solutions Arena

http://www.energysolutionsarena.com/images...rena_hockey.gif

With this setup, you might have a similar seating configuration problem just like with US Airways Center and KeyArena. Plus, you have an almost 6,000 seat gap between the hockey and basketball setups (capacity 19,911 for Jazz games), and most of these dual-purpose arenas don't have this much of a descrepancy (sp?) between the seating capacities of hockey and basketball games.

[Webhamster]

Energy Solutions Arena in Salt Lake only seats around 14,000 for hockey and The E Center is West Valley only seats 10,000.

I think it's pretty obvious that new arenas would need to be constructed in Salt Lake and Portland for them to ever have a real shot to get a team.

I'm just saying they are markets the NHL should/could be looking at for the future (in the next 10-20 years). Salt Lake really put itself on the map with the Olympics.

That, and "winter" sports would probably be a better sell in those markets than in Phoenix, Miami, and Nashville.

[DarkJourney]

Energy Solutions Arena in Salt Lake only seats around 14,000 for hockey and The E Center is West Valley only seats 10,000.

I think it's pretty obvious that new arenas would need to be constructed in Salt Lake and Portland for them to ever have a real shot to get a team.

I'm just saying they are markets the NHL should/could be looking at for the future (in the next 10-20 years). Salt Lake really put itself on the map with the Olympics.

That, and "winter" sports would probably be a better sell in those markets than in Phoenix, Miami, and Nashville.

Probably just Salt Lake would need a hockey specific arena but Portland's Rose Garden was built to accommodate NHL hockey. Seats around 17,500 for hockey and the Junior team Winter Hawks play there.

I agree with you that Portland and Salt Lake would be great cities for NHL hockey. Hopefully if someone could convince Paul Allen of that.

[marlinfan]

Florida: the state of Florida is full of retirees from the north, so as a hockey market Florida's not that bad at all, but I think the state of Florida only needs 1 team, and that's Tampa Bay (fan support and a little history)

Nice stereotyping. Especially when it comes to the Miami-Ft. Lauderdale area.

The Panthers packed the house when they were good and they'll do the same when they put a decent product on the ice. They outdrew a few northern markets and they are only in the relocation conversation so much because they play in the South.

Plus, they have excellent support from the corporate community in the South Fla area.

[JQK]

As a life-long Devils fan, who's team was in danger of moving to Nashville in 1995...

(remember Terreri with the "Nashville? No Way!" sign at the victory parade)

...all i can say is: How does it feel?

[OMMF]

I think it's pretty obvious that new arenas would need to be constructed in Salt Lake and Portland for them to ever have a real shot to get a team.

Umm, Rose Garden? Apart from some dressing room renovations and a new press box, the arena is ready to go for the NHL.

[OMMF]

As a life-long Devils fan, who's team was in danger of moving to Nashville in 1995...

(remember Terreri with the "Nashville? No Way!" sign at the victory parade)

...all i can say is: How does it feel?

It feels terrible. Oh, the grammar!

[Braden]

When Winnipeg was in danger of moving, the city rallied to get as many season ticket buyers as possible.

Now Nashville is in danger of moving, and the existing season ticket buyers are threatening to boycott.

Say what you want about Balsillie, but no wonder he wants to move it to Hamilton...

[Broken Record]

Now Nashville is in danger of moving, and the existing season ticket buyers are threatening to boycott.

Huh?

[leedsunited]

Now Nashville is in danger of moving, and the existing season ticket buyers are threatening to boycott.

Huh?

The big problem is that none of that Nashville money has really shown a propensity towards sports sponsorship. Esp. not with the "old money" that still rules the city.

Let's be frank, ownership was practically BEGGING for local investment (from both corporate and individual partners) for two years now. With players already off in what looks like a mass exodus, you're telling me the Nashville market is going to rally around a nonplayoff team when they couldn't even really support a team that finished in the top echelon of NHL standings? Call me the jaded cynic, but i've seen this in other cities that lost their teams, and nothing tells me that Nashville is gonna buck that trend.