Afc championship

[JQK]

Manning was terrible Sunday but he did play a good defense in bad wetaher on the road.

Next year is the test for Peyton and the Colts, if they dont make it to Super Bowl XXXIX then they will be looked at as failures like the Eagles were this year.

THe Eagles overacheived this year, they played WAY above their heads. THey were failure last year, this year, i dunno what you could call them.. the Buffalo Bills come to mind, but that was Super Bowls, Same with the Broncos and Vikings, all Super Bowls.. this is a new chapter in futility. Losing three straight NC Championship games, the last two in a row at your house... that's just disgusting.

and i'm loving EVERY minute of it!!!

[Le Suisse]

The only thing that will give a SuperBowl Championship to the Colts is... moving back to Baltimore.

In Indy they suck as always. Of course I saw all the good running through the playoffs of the Colts until the fateful game in Foxboro but I was sure the Colts went to choke annually like the Dolphins.

It is like a curse over the Colts. Never winning the ticket to a SuperBowl game and teams with scarse history and tradition like the Buccaneers made history.

[See Red]

The Patriots are hardly the best team.  They're winning games by 7 with absolutely EVERY advantage they can possibly have.  That advantage includes the refs inability to call game changing Pass Interferences.

And defense wins championships?  Why have 10 of the last 13 teams to win the Super Bowl been teams most noted for offense?  

And it can easily be noted:

- The Giants had no business being in the Superbowl vs. the Ravens.  

- The Patriots were far inferior to the Rams and had no business being on the same field as them (2001 Rams would beat the 2001 Pats 98 times out of 100)

- The Bucs knew the Raiders system entirely and were practically calling out what plays the Raiders would do.  That game wasn't offense vs. defense... it was years and years worth of preparation and experience in the other teams system and knowing the teams tendencies completely vs. 2 weeks of preperation.

[JQK]

The Giants were in that game until they called Holding on Armstead, when HE was held. It changed the game. It took away a giants touchdown and it looked liked we never recoverd. When you beat the Vikings, the heavy favorites 41-0, you belong anywhere you go.

The Patriots dominated the rams. The rams had a late surge to tie it up, but the patriots beat them up in that game. No way does stl win 98 out of 100 matchups... maybe 50/50

Defense wins championsips, that's the bottom line. Even the great offensive teams had moderatly good defenses. You can't win if you have no defense. Indy and KC proved that fact this year.

[Saintsfan]

The Patriots are hardly the best team. They're winning games by 7 with absolutely EVERY advantage they can possibly have. That advantage includes the refs inability to call game changing Pass Interferences.

And defense wins championships? Why have 10 of the last 13 teams to win the Super Bowl been teams most noted for offense?

And it can easily be noted:

- The Giants had no business being in the Superbowl vs. the Ravens.

- The Patriots were far inferior to the Rams and had no business being on the same field as them (2001 Rams would beat the 2001 Pats 98 times out of 100)

- The Bucs knew the Raiders system entirely and were practically calling out what plays the Raiders would do. That game wasn't offense vs. defense... it was years and years worth of preparation and experience in the other teams system and knowing the teams tendencies completely vs. 2 weeks of preperation.

WTF are you on about!

Given they maybe about tom win a second superbowl in 3 years, anyone not giving the Pats there credit is a moron (Sorry to get so personal but there you go! its my opinion). Yeah they may not be a showing exciting team, but thee guys know how to win, which is what the game is about.

Defense wins championships, name a superbowl winning team without a serviceable at least defense. Yes its true offense is required as well, but the Ravens proved that you can win the Superbowl without a great offense.

Any team in the Superbowl deserves to be there, its the game. Sure some teams are better than  others, but you cannot say that a team that has won there conference championship has no rbusiness being in a superbowl.

The Patriots against the Rams. Its the game. The big diffenrence was Belichick's game plan, don't give the recievers space.

And finally!! The Bucs won the game, they played the team in front of them. They had beaten plenty of teams who Gruden has never coached.

[See Red]

... you're not giving the Ravens offense enough credit. The Ravens had a running game that was unstoppable in that postseason.  And in the Super Bowl, the Ravens running game majorly opened up the passing game.  It was a shame that Jamal Lewis was passed over as MVP of that game in favor of Ray Lewis.

... And hell, ESPN has the 2001 Patriots ranked as the worst Championship team of any sport all time -- meanwhile the Rams killed at least half their opponents.

... and Minnesota vs. New York was a dome team playing in wet conditions... just like New York Jets vs. Indianapolis last year.

... and that SAME Bucs team, without being able to use age or injury as an excuse, failed to make the playoffs. shows how great they were. They won that game because Gruden new that system, and each player inside out -- hell, he even dressed up at practice, played QB, and mimmicked Gannon.

[Saintsfan]

... And hell, ESPN has the 2001 Patriots ranked as the worst Championship team of any sport all time -- meanwhile the Rams killed at least half their opponents.

I wonder if they will soon! My point about the Pats is that they know how to win. They may not haveing showy players in all the positions, like the Rams, but they have a team mentality, great QB and the best coach in the NFL today, they play great tactics for the opponent. And lets face it 2 superbowls in 3 years in the era of parity is pretty good going!

[See Red]

I meant the 2001 team was the worst Championship team ever, according to ESPN.

WHen everyone talks about this 2 Super Bowls in 3 years thing... they neglect to mention that they also missed the playoffs, in that time.

[JQK]

Many of the great teams missed the playoffs the next season after winning one, in this day in age of the NFL, with parity, it is nearly impossable to win back-ro-back Bowls.

THe Ravens offense didn't make mistakes, they let the Defense win games for them, they didn't turn the ball over, and they ran. They played old-school football, and that's why they won.

Offense sells tickets, Defense wins Championships, that's the bottom line.

[See Red]

Over the past 15 years of football or ANY sport... there has been NOTHING to suggest that defense wins championships, especially considering that most of the past 15 Super Bowl Championship teams have been known to be offensive teams.

And it's not easy to not make the Super Bowl the season after.  The Lats team to do it before the Rams/Patriots was the Denver Broncos and there's was only because they lost a hall of fame QB and I believe that's the year Terrell Davis suffered his first major injury.

And prior to the Broncos... it would be very difficult and even rare to find an example of that.

And yes... the Ravens offense didn't make mistakes, and more importantly... they controlled the tempo of the game with their solid running game.  That's what a good offense does when the run is the basis of their game.

If they were completely unable to move the ball, like people act like they were... there's no way they even make it to the Super Bowl.

Face it... A good defense is NOTHING without a decent (atleast) offense and a good offense is NOTHING without a decent (atleast) defense.  Balance wins Championships, not defense.

[JQK]

A team that is all defense and no offense can win a championship. A team that is all offense and no defense can not.

[See Red]

and what would be an example of a team that's all defense and no offense that HAS won the Super Bowl?

In fact, the Panthers seemed to be all defense and no offense last year, and where'd they get?

[NJTank]

Yeah you need some offense otherwise you will lose games 14-13.

In fact had it not been for the signing of Stephan Davis the Panthers would have never even made the playoffs.

[See Red]

exactly, Tank.  You can't rely on a defense to score TD's all the time.  I'm not saying an offense wins championships... I'm just saying you need more than a good defense.

[paynomind]

uhm... Ravens anyone? That O was bottom third ranked, and won. "NO" offense is, of course, overstating the case, but this super bowl is proof that a nobody QB running a slow, boring, middle of the pack or lower Offense can get throught he playoffs and maybe even win the whole thing.

[NJTank]

Well Trent Dilfer came in and helped them score just enough points to win some weeks.

The key is this if a Defense allows less then 20 points they shoudl win most weeks, but you need to score at least 20 yourself that means, and if you cant get any offense then you cant win no matter how good your defense was.

[Saintsfan]

It is about balance to a degree, but no team can ever win without defense. A mediocre offense can win if its defense is good enough. Put it this way, if your team has a good defense, its relatively easy to score around 20 points a game to win fairlyt often. If your team has a poor defense, your offense will have to score maybe 27-30 points a game to win regularly.

Also as the Pats proved against the Rams, a good defense can play a systme to defeat a good offense. Its tougher the other way around.

[See Red]

The O was bottom ranked because they had Tony Banks playing QB for the most part and went over a month without an offensive TD.  By the end of the season and especially in the playoffs, they had some resemblance of an offense going and a running game that was unstoppable in the postseason.

[JQK]

Tony Banks was the QB most of the way? I believe he was taken out within the first 4 games.. that's not Most of the Way...

You can't win a super bowl without a good defense, that's the bottom line. What are you, some kind of Quarterback Lover?

[See Red]

actually... Banks has only played less than 11 games in a season once in his career.  And that was last season when David Carr went down.

Banks started 11 games in 2000 for the Ravens and started 8 games.  11 games is 'most of the season', to me.

And the Patriots wouldn't have even got past the AFC Championship if Antowain Smith didn't have such a good game.  JUST a good defense can't win, neither can JUST a good offense.  You need both.

Now, give me ONE example of a team that won a championship NO offense.