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Ankiel's Back!


pcgd

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(HGH is or isn't legal? I get confused)

It's illegal in the US period unless prescribed by a doctor. There's limited reasons why a doctor can prescribe it, but I don't know whether responsibility for that falls on the doctor or the patient or both.

It's illegal in baseball as of 2005. However, they don't test for it, so it's not all that effective of a ban. The reason they don't test is that the only reliable test for it right now is a blood test, and the Union won't approve a blood test.

That's as much as I know.

Both would be in trouble.

BTW, just because MLB didn't ban it until recently, what makes it okay to use? If something is against federal and state law doesn't that imply that its use is prohibited by a sport because said sport is run in the boundaries of the United States? Are these athletes above the law now? (STL not necessarily directed at you.)

1997 | 2003

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(HGH is or isn't legal? I get confused)

It's illegal in the US period unless prescribed by a doctor. There's limited reasons why a doctor can prescribe it, but I don't know whether responsibility for that falls on the doctor or the patient or both.

It's illegal in baseball as of 2005. However, they don't test for it, so it's not all that effective of a ban. The reason they don't test is that the only reliable test for it right now is a blood test, and the Union won't approve a blood test.

That's as much as I know.

Both would be in trouble.

BTW, just because MLB didn't ban it until recently, what makes it okay to use? If something is against federal and state law doesn't that imply that its use is prohibited by a sport because said sport is run in the boundaries of the United States? Are these athletes above the law now? (STL not necessarily directed at you.)

Another question is if he had it legally which it appears he might of. The story says he had a doctor write him a prescription.

AS for what PCGD brought up about him possible being on the 40 man roster he might get off on that technicality but that mean he wasn't in the wrong or that it wasn't cheated. He was doing something that the guys he was playing against was possible prohibited by the rules from doing (depending on when HGH was banned in the minor).

There is really no way you can justify what Ankiel did. 2004 was when all the BALCO stuff was springing up. He knew HGH was a performance enhancer that was banned in other sports and would probably be banned in Majors soon (if not already in the minor leagues). He took it to get back to the Majors. If you condemn Bonds for doing similar stuff you have to condemn Ankiel as well. Otherwise you are a hypocrite.

To me this shows how deep of a problem baseball and all sports have. You could realistically see something like this happening. On several message boards I've seen people make a joke previously how he must have taken steroids or HGH and guess what it turned out to be true. If you think about it this isn't an incredible shocking story.

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There is really no way you can justify what Ankiel did. 2004 was when all the BALCO stuff was springing up. He knew HGH was a performance enhancer that was banned in other sports and would probably be banned in Majors soon (if not already in the minor leagues). He took it to get back to the Majors. If you condemn Bonds for doing similar stuff you have to condemn Ankiel as well. Otherwise you are a hypocrite.

I'm not sure I really want to try and justify what Ankiel did anyways. But I think there are some things you're overlooking.

(I had to go back and at this. What I'm saying might not be true. And that's true of most things being said right now. We need to wait to see what comes out.)

Ankiel took this substance as a means to recover from Tommy John surgery as a pitcher in 2004. HGH really does very little in terms of performance enhancing. It will not build very much muscle mass. It helps some in the recovery process. It's also not all that clear if HGH is truly bad for your health or not.

I'm of the opinion that doing everything you can within the constraints of the rules to be better is not cheating. So if Ankiel took this while it was legal, I don't consider that cheating. It doesn't really matter whether it was illegal in other sports or soon to be illegal in baseball. Cheating is doing something others are not allowed to do to gain an advantage. That doesn't appear to be the case here.

With Bonds, that certainly was the case. I think it's completely wrong to say you're a hypocrite of you condemn a guy who broke the rules but not a guy who made sure he stayed within the rules.

Now, further, Ankiel took these things three years ago trying to comeback to the major leagues as a pitcher.

He failed (actually, he made it back I believe--my timeline is a little off right now, but then didn't stick), retired from pitching, and decided to try his hand at batting.

Now he's back in the major leagues three years later and kicking butt. Hormones don't last three years. They weren't illegal when he took them anyways. He's not a huge guy, his power is raw. It's power he's had since he was a high school pitcher tearing up the opposing teams lineup every five days, and every four in between ripping away at the opposing teams pitcher. He hit a ball into the SkyDome's upper deck long before he ever made the major leagues as a pitcher.

So while I'm not exactly willing to condone the action of taking HGH, I'm going to wait and see what happens. I'm certainly not going to call him a cheat or equate him to Barry Bonds. And I'm not going to pretend taking some HGH three years ago has anything to do with what he's currently doing.

I think what makes me most sick about this is not that he took HGH, but that the media and some fans reactions to it will be overblown and tarnish what's still a great story.

Here's a great example of the media already jumping to conclusions and making ridiculous ties to what happened three years ago with what's happening now. I mean, taking HGH as a pitcher recovering from TJ surgery in 2004 is equivalent to Barry Bonds "seeking glory through needles"? The fact that he took this stuff as a recovering pitcher three years ago makes what he's doing now no longer amazing, "not in the least"?

I think that's a bit much myself. But I'm worried a lot of people will feel similarly.

Oh well. I'm sorry if I'm keeping up some reputation as a homer here. I will be on Ankiel's side because of that, I can assure you. But I'm not trying to ignore any facts or anything. I just think we need to be weary of jumping to false conclusions. I'm not condoning the one action, but I don't think it's all that terrible, and I don't think it did all that much.

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Scandal rocks the self-appointed Greatest Baseball Town in America once again.

Fixed that for you.

[Croatia National Team Manager Slavan] Bilic then went on to explain how Croatia's success can partially be put down to his progressive man-management techniques. "Sometimes I lie in the bed with my players. I go to the room of Vedran Corluka and Luka Modric when I see they have a problem and I lie in bed with them and we talk for 10 minutes." Maybe Capello could try getting through to his players this way too? Although how far he'd get with Joe Cole jumping up and down on the mattress and Rooney demanding to be read his favourite page from The Very Hungry Caterpillar is open to question. --The Guardian's Fiver, 08 September 2008

Attention: In order to obtain maximum enjoyment from your stay at the CCSLC, the reader is advised that the above post may contain large amounts of sarcasm, dry humour, or statements which should not be taken in any true sort of seriousness. As a result, the above poster absolves himself of any and all blame in the event that a forum user responds to the aforementioned post without taking the previous notice into account. Thank you for your cooperation, and enjoy your stay at the CCSLC.

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Boras and La Russa were on XM Radio today.

Here's what was said:

From XM satellite radio...

---------

Actual quote from Boras:

?Rick?s position is that he?s never had contact with this pharmacy, he?s never received anything from this pharmacy, he?s never been to this pharmacy, he doesn?t know anyone at the pharmacy and frankly these allegations that he received something from them or ordered something from them aren?t true.?

Tony La Russa was on XM earlier in the day and said:

?We just found out about this yesterday, you look at him now and there isn?t anything buffed up about him. This happened in 2004, that was 3 years ago? so he had a prescription for whatever reason and I haven?t talked to Rick about it yet so? If anyone has earned the benefit of the doubt it?s this young man.?

----------

So Rick's going to deny this, but Boras didn't say anything about the actual HGH. And the reports don't ever actually say Ankiel contacted the pharmacy, just that the Dr. got it from the Pharmacy.

So this may be all politics here. Who knows.

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Actual quote from Boras:

?Rick?s position is that he?s never had contact with this pharmacy, he?s never received anything from this pharmacy, he?s never been to this pharmacy, he doesn?t know anyone at the pharmacy and frankly these allegations that he received something from them or ordered something from them aren?t true.?

Not a good sign considering he can no longer claim he was just using HGH to rehab his arm from Tommy John surgery. Now he is basically claiming any rumors of him taking HGH, legally or illegally, whether it was for performance enhancement or medical purposes, is now, by what Boras is quoting from Ankiel, BS. All of those theories about rehabing his arm for medical reasons with the presciption of a doctor, go out the window if he claims he had no contact at any time with the pharmacy that filled the prescription for him according to their records.

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Ankiel apparently just held a press conference that was on ESPNews. I couldn't.

Sounds like he didn't deny anything, he simply said he only took things that were prescribed to him, but that he wouldn't get into what those were as those are priveleged in the doctor/patient agreement.

Interesting take. If I was one for speculating...I'd say he probably took HGH, but is saying it was prescribed, it was legal, now screwoff. But I'm not...

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Scandal rocks the Greatest Baseball Town in America once again.

Really? What happened in Boston?

On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said:
You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now.
On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said:
Today, we are all otaku.

"The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert

POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010

The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy)

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Ankiel apparently just held a press conference that was on ESPNews. I couldn't.

Sounds like he didn't deny anything, he simply said he only took things that were prescribed to him, but that he wouldn't get into what those were as those are priveleged in the doctor/patient agreement.

Interesting take. If I was one for speculating...I'd say he probably took HGH, but is saying it was prescribed, it was legal, now screwoff. But I'm not...

Well, to update, here's a direct quote:

"I'm not going to go into the list of what doctors described for me, but I've been through a lot emotionally and physically,"

"I respect the integrity of the game, and I'm on the same level everyone else is on."

And he also said he'd be willing to fully cooperate with anything MLB wants to talk to him about.

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So what was with the comments Scott Boras made? He claimed his client had never received anything from the pharmaceutical company that distributed the HGH to Ankiel. Did he jump the gun trying to protect his client, assuming that he did do something he wasn't supposed to, and immediately jump to defend him without the proper facts? Ankiel stated in the press conference that he just took the drugs he was prescribed by doctors but what about the matter of where he got these drugs from if Boras claims he never had contact with the company that has had Ankiel on file? I have not seen the press conference, so I have no clue whether Ankiel mentioned anything about Scott Boras' comments or not, so I'm just going by information I have now.

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So what was with the comments Scott Boras made? He claimed his client had never received anything from the pharmaceutical company that distributed the HGH to Ankiel. Did he jump the gun trying to protect his client, assuming that he did do something he wasn't supposed to, and immediately jump to defend him without the proper facts? Ankiel stated in the press conference that he just took the drugs he was prescribed by doctors but what about the matter of where he got these drugs from if Boras claims he never had contact with the company that has had Ankiel on file? I have not seen the press conference, so I have no clue whether Ankiel mentioned anything about Scott Boras' comments or not, so I'm just going by information I have now.

I haven't seen it either...

But from what I've read from others who saw it, he did say he doesn't know how his information was on records at that company.

I know there's a tendancy to not want to believe it, but this really may be a case where he was in contact with the doctor and only the doctor on this, and he took what was prescribed to him by the doctor, but he wasn't aware where the doctor was getting the HGH and other meds from.

Or at least that could be the angle he's playing.

Tough to read.

I'm starting to draw the conclusion that unless something is unearthed saying he took it after it was banned, that I just don't care. The truth is HGH simply doesn't do that much for anybody. It wasn't illegal when he got it. And it's not something that is still effecting him as a hitter three years later.

It's a bummer that his story will be tarnished to many, but I'm gonna turn on the TV in an hour and root and be amazed by him all the same. Wouldn't it be great, at least from a the stand point of a great story, if he rocked three home runs tonight?

Lost in all this, is that if the Cubbies and Brewers continue to get smashed tonight (4-0 and 10-0 respectively last I saw), the Cards will be half a game back with a chance to tie for the lead (and take it on percentage points) with tonights game.

They've overcome* a lot of crap so far this year, might as well tack something else on the list.

(*-Overcome meaning staying in contention of the division. I'll be the first to recognize that their record still isn't great. It's one reason why I think this is a great job of managing by La Russa, but not his best. Staying in contention is amazing, but it's still taken some luck from the other teams in the division.)

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There's a link to the press conference on ESPN.com

Basically, like has been said, Ankiel said everything he took was prescribed by a liscensed physician and to recover from his Tommy John surgery. He wouldn't get into specific medications. And he also said he knows absolutely nothing about the pharmacy, but didn't deny the possibility that that is where his doctor got medication from.

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*Gets on soap box*

I'm really getting tired of the whole steroid witchhunt. If a player TESTS POSITIVE after rules banning the substances were enacted, fine, head to his house with torches and pitchforks. But, if all the sudden word leaks that substances were allegedly shipped to said player's house before they were even banned by the league, then quite frankly, I DON'T CARE! Barry Bonds may be a jackass, but until he tests positive, you can keep your asterisk. In the eyes of the feds, if they want to pursue an investigation for legal reasons, fine, but when a player uses a substance at a time that it wasn't banned, I don't see what the big backlash is all about.

Co-signing for truth. And also, how conveinent that this story pops up just as Ankiel proves to be a success in his return to the bigs? It's amazing how the media has the power to turn any feel-good story into :censored:.

 

 

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Co-signing for truth. And also, how conveinent that this story pops up just as Ankiel proves to be a success in his return to the bigs? It's amazing how the media has the power to turn any feel-good story into :censored:.

Well, I don't want to call conspiracy, but I'm curious about all of these shipment orders that keep trickling out. I thought that Ankiel's name was among the patients listed from the same source as the big WWE blowout a week or so ago. Who else is listed? And why are the names just seeping out, instead of being released all at once?

1 hour ago, ShutUpLutz! said:

and the drunken doodoobags jumping off the tops of SUV's/vans/RV's onto tables because, oh yeah, they are drunken drug abusing doodoobags

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Co-signing for truth. And also, how conveinent that this story pops up just as Ankiel proves to be a success in his return to the bigs? It's amazing how the media has the power to turn any feel-good story into :censored:.

Well, I don't want to call conspiracy, but I'm curious about all of these shipment orders that keep trickling out. I thought that Ankiel's name was among the patients listed from the same source as the big WWE blowout a week or so ago. Who else is listed? And why are the names just seeping out, instead of being released all at once?

Yeah, I'm not one to shoot the messenger. I'm not calling him a liar or anything (though the writers that are jumping to further conclusions based on the first report really bother me, but the Daily News guy is okay with me), he's just doing his job, breaking a story.

But I have wondered about the timing. He released his story immediately following the pinnacle of Ankiel's story with his 2 HR, 7 RBI game.

You just have to wonder how long he had Ankiel's name. Two months, even one month ago Ankiel would have barely made the headlines even though his name might have been recognized. But by releasing it now, he's filling up 25% of the sports news.

So, in turn, you do also have to wonder who else's name they've got.

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*Gets on soap box*

I'm really getting tired of the whole steroid witchhunt. If a player TESTS POSITIVE after rules banning the substances were enacted, fine, head to his house with torches and pitchforks. But, if all the sudden word leaks that substances were allegedly shipped to said player's house before they were even banned by the league, then quite frankly, I DON'T CARE! Barry Bonds may be a jackass, but until he tests positive, you can keep your asterisk. In the eyes of the feds, if they want to pursue an investigation for legal reasons, fine, but when a player uses a substance at a time that it wasn't banned, I don't see what the big backlash is all about.

Co-signing for truth. And also, how conveinent that this story pops up just as Ankiel proves to be a success in his return to the bigs? It's amazing how the media has the power to turn any feel-good story into :censored:.

Well, Ankiel has a history of being an :censored:. So I can't say something like that would disappoint me.

1997 | 2003

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