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Jim Leyritz Charged...

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In addition, I think dangerously/lethally reckless actions are, in many ways, "cold-blooded". Cold-bloodedness indicates a disregard for "consideration, compunction, or clemency" and when someone does something dangerous and reckless that endangers the lives of themselves and others, they are acting in the same disregard, just not with the same direct intentions.

I'm going to put it right out here and say that in my life I've driven drunk. I was never in an accident as a result of that, but I was certainly a danger to myself and others behind the wheel of that car.

If I'd hurt or killed someone as a result of my actions, would I have deserved jailtime? You better believe it. I made the choice to drive drunk. I would have fully expected to pay the price for my action, because my decision to drive drunk willfully ignored the dangers I was putting myself and others into.

Someone called driving drunk a mistake. No, it's not a mistake. It's a conscious choice you make because it's inconvenient for you to stay where you are until you're sober.

Take a look at this:

http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/features/2..._dwi/index.html

When I saw pictures of that woman online, I vowed to never drive drunk again. I never did, and I never will again. It brought home for me that to kill or permanently disfigure someone else as a result of my stupid judgment would be something I could never live with myself over.

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In addition, I think dangerously/lethally reckless actions are, in many ways, "cold-blooded". Cold-bloodedness indicates a disregard for "consideration, compunction, or clemency" and when someone does something dangerous and reckless that endangers the lives of themselves and others, they are acting in the same disregard, just not with the same direct intentions.

I'm going to put it right out here and say that in my life I've driven drunk. I was never in an accident as a result of that, but I was certainly a danger to myself and others behind the wheel of that car.

If I'd hurt or killed someone as a result of my actions, would I have deserved jailtime? You better believe it. I made the choice to drive drunk. I would have fully expected to pay the price for my action, because my decision to drive drunk willfully ignored the dangers I was putting myself and others into.

Someone called driving drunk a mistake. No, it's not a mistake. It's a conscious choice you make because it's inconvenient for you to stay where you are until you're sober.

Take a look at this:

http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/features/2..._dwi/index.html

When I saw pictures of that woman online, I vowed to never drive drunk again. I never did, and I never will again. It brought home for me that to kill or permanently disfigure someone else as a result of my stupid judgment would be something I could never live with myself over.

We're all playing semantics here.

When you consciously make a bad decision, when your actions are a result of "stupid judgement", those things are mistakes.

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Homocide is the wrong term. Even if it's just semantics, that implies intention to kill. Manslaughter would be the right term, I think.

Hoimcide is the all encompassing term composed of murder and manslaughter.

While Leyritz probably did not have intent to kill, it is possible that he could be charged with murder under the felony murder rule if his BAC was high enough to make it a felony, or if he has priors for DUI that bring the charge to a felony. Final charges will be leveled once the investigation is completed.

As for Leyritz, he brought all this on himself.

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We're all playing semantics here.

When you consciously make a bad decision, when your actions are a result of "stupid judgement", those things are mistakes.

So tell me Pollyanna, has anyone ever done anything wrong that wasn't simply a bad decision or an error in judgement? The reason I ask is this, let's say that tomorrow you wake up and "decide" to kill your parents and 5 random people on the street. Obviously you'd see your actions as just a mistake. My question would be did you make a bad decision, or was it stupid judgement on your part? Just wondering.

No one is playing semantics here Sunshine, you are doing a contortionist routine trying to spin an :censored: driving drunk and killing someone into a simple error in judgement. I'll agree it's not entirely black and white but it's not nowhere near the "innocent mistake" or "bad decision" you're making it out to be.

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We're all playing semantics here.

When you consciously make a bad decision, when your actions are a result of "stupid judgement", those things are mistakes.

So tell me Pollyanna, has anyone ever done anything wrong that wasn't simply a bad decision or an error in judgement? The reason I ask is this, let's say that tomorrow you wake up and "decide" to kill your parents and 5 random people on the street. Obviously you'd see your actions as just a mistake. My question would be did you make a bad decision, or was it stupid judgement on your part? Just wondering.

No one is playing semantics here Sunshine, you are doing a contortionist routine trying to spin an :censored: driving drunk and killing someone into a simple error in judgement. I'll agree it's not entirely black and white but it's not nowhere near the "innocent mistake" or "bad decision" you're making it out to be.

Never called it an innocent mistake. Only a mistake. A mistake that wasn't made with intent to harm. Intent to drive drunk, but not intent to harm. It's not black and white. And that's exactly it. I'm not asking for white. Some people are asking for black.

But I'll save the discussion for those who can do so in a civil manner without namecalling.

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But I'll save the discussion for those who can do so in a civil manner without namecalling.

I wasn't "namecalling." I was making a sarcastic reference to your overly forgiving disposition. I don't see calling you Pollyanna and Sunshine as being particularly derogative. Sarcastic yes, but it was not meant to be mean-spirited.

I apologize if you were offended.

And you still haven't answered the original question in my post. I am really curious about where you would fall in the scenario I described.

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But I'll save the discussion for those who can do so in a civil manner without namecalling.

I wasn't "namecalling." I was making a sarcastic reference to your overly forgiving disposition. I don't see calling you Pollyanna and Sunshine as being particularly derogative. Sarcastic yes, but it was not meant to be mean-spirited.

I apologize if you were offended.

And you still haven't answered the original question in my post. I am really curious about where you would fall in the scenario I described.

Sorry, I didn't specifically intend to ignore the question.

All I've really got is it's not black and white.

I can't describe it.

Both could be called a mistake for sure. But one is cold-blooded murder. The other (I guess could still be cold blooded) is simply ignorance.

In fact. You're right. Mistake shouldn't be the difference word.

But in one case the mistake is choosing to take (as someone put it) the convienent option. In another case it's choosing to take another persons life. In the first case it's pure stupidity for taking the risk, but the people who do so aren't hoping to injure or kill someone, in fact, they're probably hoping not too.

Both are dumb. Both are crimes. But I'm sorry if I see a difference.

But if it means anything, I could forgive an outright murder if he/she changed their ways.

That's my personality. I know it's not the same as a lot of others, but it's authentic.

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But if it means anything, I could forgive an outright murder if he/she changed their ways.

But what if a person doesn't change their ways and gets arrested a second time? Like, for instance, Leonard Little.....

I am a Ram.

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But if it means anything, I could forgive an outright murder if he/she changed their ways.

But what if a person doesn't change their ways and gets arrested a second time? Like, for instance, Leonard Little.....

A forgiving nature doesn't mean you forgive once and then give up on someone. I'll forgive and forgive as many times as it takes (not that my forgiveness is all that important). Which isn't to say the law and punishments should be forgiving over and over, but I can be.

In any case, Leonard Little was found not guilty in the second instance and the arresting officer was found to have mishandled the arrest and the case.

You're something much different and worse than a Ram.

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The New York Post has been all over this story and has reported these nuggets:

When Leyritz smashed into Freida Veitch's car, killing her, he was driving with a suspended licence in New York state (for failing to answer a motor vehicle summons). That could add another year to the 15-year maximum Leyritz could face (but obviously won't get) if prosecutors can prove he knew his license was supspended.

Since 2002, Leyritz had "at least seven motor vehicle violations in Florida," including "two citations for ignoring stops signs and another for driving with a suspended license."

Mrs. Veitch's co-workers said Leyritz was "a known drunk" who was often "escorted out of the bar by the cops because that's how much of a drunk he is."

Wow...

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Another nugget I forgot to include. Seems that Mrs. Veitch wasn't wearing her seat belt, allowing her to be ejected from the car. Of course, there is no way to know if she would have sustained fatal injuries anyway. Many people still die even when buckled up.

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Another nugget I forgot to include. Seems that Mrs. Veitch wasn't wearing her seat belt, allowing her to be ejected from the car. Of course, there is no way to know if she would have sustained fatal injuries anyway. Many people still die even when buckled up.

How does that factor into the charges or at least verdicts? I'm sure they can charge him with whatever manslaughter makes him responsible for her death, but is there any possibility they charge him with a lesser count or he's found not guilty of that count because they find it unlikely she'd have died had she worn a belt?

Any precedent for this?

I ask this completely outside of and unrelated to any other views I've expressed. I'm just curious how the legal system works or has worked with something like that.

It's an interesting caveat (if that word works there).

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Another nugget I forgot to include. Seems that Mrs. Veitch wasn't wearing her seat belt, allowing her to be ejected from the car. Of course, there is no way to know if she would have sustained fatal injuries anyway. Many people still die even when buckled up.

How does that factor into the charges or at least verdicts? I'm sure they can charge him with whatever manslaughter makes him responsible for her death, but is there any possibility they charge him with a lesser count or he's found not guilty of that count because they find it unlikely she'd have died had she worn a belt?

Any precedent for this?

I ask this completely outside of and unrelated to any other views I've expressed. I'm just curious how the legal system works or has worked with something like that.

It's an interesting caveat (if that word works there).

Doesn't do anything for criminal charges. Does have a good deal of meaning in the civil suit that is sure to arise from this. It would be a defense Leyritz would raise (Contributory Negligence/Compatative Fault) depends on what standard for this that Florida uses could limit recovery or bar it completely.

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I just want to give you all this side of the drunk-driver stories. When driving home from a bachelor party, My uncle was involved in a two way collision with a 17 year old kid at about 2am. The 17 year old was killed. The 17 year old was also driving while intoxicated and happened to have a blood alcohol content almost double that of my uncle. The police report gave evidence to support that the teenager's erratic driving was the cause of the accident, rather than my uncle. To add insult to injury, the family of the kid who was killed had ties to one of the county's chief prosecutors. My uncle was convicted of manslaughter and served jail time in state prison for 10 years. My aunt, cousin, and myself grew up without a husband, father, and uncle, respectively. It obviously led to extremely difficult times within my family. I can only speak for myself, but it was extremely difficult trying to grow up without my godfather. I think made it worse that I had no memories of him because all of this happened while I was still a baby. I look at drunk-driving on a different level than most crimes. Most people don't realize how drunk drivers are often normal everyday people who made one terrible mistake, which contrary to popular opinion, is easy to make. I'm sure I would feel differently if one of my family members of friends was innocently injured or killed by in a drunk-driving accident, but it really hurts to hear people make drunk-drivers like my uncle out to be subhuman evil-doing criminals. I just hope reading a story like this could possibly stick in someone's mind and before you drive home from that party or bar realize how driving drunk will impact those you love. It's just another thing people should really think about before sticking the key in the ignition. I can't justify or defend my uncle's actions, but I think that people need to look at drunk-drivers like my uncle with some forgiveness and sympathy.

I also want to give a thanks to STL FANATIC for voicing and standing by his under-appreciated views. You seem like one of the few sensible people out there dealing with this subject and with your views in general.

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I also want to give a thanks to STL FANATIC for voicing and standing by his under-appreciated views. You seem like one of the few sensible people out there dealing with this subject and with your views in general.

You have a sympathetic story, but please don't confuse agreement of views with sensibility.

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Most people don't realize how drunk drivers are often normal everyday people who made one terrible mistake, which contrary to popular opinion, is easy to make.

Yeah, just like these guys

20061130-predator_nbc.jpg

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