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How to reduce meaningless end of season games


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So every year, people get upset that some teams who have clinched decide to rest starters, and that can lead to other teams getting easier paths into the playoffs. I don't really think it's too big of a deal, but I know a lot of people differ.

I also don't think that there is any possible way to prevent it under the current scheduling system. How can you sanction a team who isn't playing their starters? If Caldwell says that Peyton Manning has a headache and can't play, is some guy from the NFL going to say that he has to go out there? I also don't think it's practical to use draft pics as incentives to play hard at the end.

While I do not think that there is any system that can eliminate this issue, I was wondering if there was a way to at least reduce the liklihood of having meaningless games. Here's what I came up with. I thought of something like this a while ago, but not for this purpose. I don't think it's a bad idea, but I'm curious if anyone can come up with something better.

Basically, just adjust the scheduling formula (I didn't even consider any logistical issues or anything like that when coming up with this)

Weeks 1 - 4 = games against teams from the other conference (so basically like early-season non-conference college games)

Weeks 5 - 8 = divisional games (note - one of these weeks could be a bye week, depending on the team.

Weeks 8 - 14 = intra conference games (games vs. other division of conference + extra 2 games against same-place teams) (note - one of these weeks could be the bye week. Basically a team's bye week happens between week 5 and 14. There is overlap in week 8 because week 8 could be a bye week after the first divisional round, or it could be an intraconference game)

Weeks 15 - 17 = divisional games

By fininshing the season with all division games, teams have more of a chance to make up ground, and it may be less likely for a team to wrap up their division before week 15 (they'd have to have a 4-game lead). Also, it's less likely that teams will have tiebreakers clinched (like if a team knows that even if they lose their last three games, they will at worst finish even with another team, but have the conference-record tie-breaker locked up) so finishing with all intra-conference games could be helpful too.

It may not matter if a team starts off 13-0, but oh well. Like I said, there's no perfect solution.

Anyone got a better suggestion?

"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."

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Not a bad solution. It would make the end of the season more interesting playing divisional games at the end. Where rivals could knock the other out of the playoffs. I don't know if it would help much as far as resting guys.

The easiest solution for the resting guys is for the commissioner to have a best interest of football clause like in baseball. A comparison that comes to mind is back when Aaron was chasing 714 and the Braves were going to rest him him for an entire series in Cincy so he could break the record in Atlanta. I believe Kuhn was commish at the time and ordered that Aaron play 2 out of the 3 games. With a best interest clause Goodell could do a similar thing where if a team does like Indy did last week in a game pivotal in the playoff race they could be fined and docked draft picks.

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If we hadn't had two teams with 13-0 records, I don't think resting players would be that big of an issue. I agree with the league that teams have the right to rest players if they've secured their playoff berth. If I have an issue, it isn't that players are rested. The issue is weak bubble teams have a shot at getting into the playoffs when they shouldn't.

I'm not a fan of the idea of bookend scheduling divisional games. My suggestion would be to make better scheduling choices of probable playoff teams for later in the season. Another idea would be to shift the bye week scheduling back to discourage taking too much time off.

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Not a bad solution. It would make the end of the season more interesting playing divisional games at the end. Where rivals could knock the other out of the playoffs. I don't know if it would help much as far as resting guys.

The easiest solution for the resting guys is for the commissioner to have a best interest of football clause like in baseball. A comparison that comes to mind is back when Aaron was chasing 714 and the Braves were going to rest him him for an entire series in Cincy so he could break the record in Atlanta. I believe Kuhn was commish at the time and ordered that Aaron play 2 out of the 3 games. With a best interest clause Goodell could do a similar thing where if a team does like Indy did last week in a game pivotal in the playoff race they could be fined and docked draft picks.

This would absolutely never work. Like I said in my post, who's going to force Peyton Manning to play if they say he has a headache or tummy ache? Is someone from the league going ot say that a certain lineman has to start, even though the team says he's being benched because of performance? The league should have no say in personnel matters.

I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

Of course you're always going to have to deal with meaningless games. My plan is not to eliminate them (that would be impossible), just to lower the chances of a lot of them happening. I really don't think it's much of an issue, but a lot of people seem to be complaining.

If we hadn't had two teams with 13-0 records, I don't think resting players would be that big of an issue. I agree with the league that teams have the right to rest players if they've secured their playoff berth. If I have an issue, it isn't that players are rested. The issue is weak bubble teams have a shot at getting into the playoffs when they shouldn't.

I'm not a fan of the idea of bookend scheduling divisional games. My suggestion would be to make better scheduling choices of probable playoff teams for later in the season. Another idea would be to shift the bye week scheduling back to discourage taking too much time off.

You can't schedule based on preceived power of a team. Teams are so up and down from one year to the next, it would be impossible to schedule based on that. I also don't think that the bye week thing would help much, because in addition to rest, teams bench guys to reduce their risk for injury. Doing the bye shift may reduce the need for rest, but not the chance of injury.

"The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed."

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If we hadn't had two teams with 13-0 records, I don't think resting players would be that big of an issue. I agree with the league that teams have the right to rest players if they've secured their playoff berth. If I have an issue, it isn't that players are rested. The issue is weak bubble teams have a shot at getting into the playoffs when they shouldn't.

I'm not a fan of the idea of bookend scheduling divisional games. My suggestion would be to make better scheduling choices of probable playoff teams for later in the season. Another idea would be to shift the bye week scheduling back to discourage taking too much time off.

You can't schedule based on preceived power of a team. Teams are so up and down from one year to the next, it would be impossible to schedule based on that. I also don't think that the bye week thing would help much, because in addition to rest, teams bench guys to reduce their risk for injury. Doing the bye shift may reduce the need for rest, but not the chance of injury.

Of course teams are up and down. Like you said, nothing is perfect. However, it's a good bet based on this year that Indy, NE and SD are going to be solid contenders, while teams like Oakland, St Louis and Detroit will not do so well. So, there is some consistency of performance. All you can ask is to make better choices. As for shifting the bye week back, it is again about making things better, since there is no perfect fix.

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

Of course you're always going to have to deal with meaningless games. My plan is not to eliminate them (that would be impossible), just to lower the chances of a lot of them happening. I really don't think it's much of an issue, but a lot of people seem to be complaining.

I personally think that a more contrived schedule is more of a problem than meaningless games, personally. And if you end up with 3 divisional games, what happens if those rounds start with, say the Patriots on 10-3 and the rest of the division at 6-7 or worse. The Pats might be playing weakened line ups, making it more likely that at least one team might get to 9-7, and a shot at the playoffs, when in other divisions teams might all be playing competitively, at least for a round or two, and so a 6-7 team in that division might be under a disadvantage. I think the simple truth is that this is a problem that can never really be solved.

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 4 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

 

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 2 1/2 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

FYP. Sunday's game was in Buffalo, and they only pulled the starters in the 3rd quarter of the Jets game.

On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said:
You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now.
On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said:
Today, we are all otaku.

"The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert

POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010

The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy)

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 4 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

But they get the other side of the coin in watching the best team in the league, and get home field advantage, with its ticketing advantages through the playoffs. A couple of meaningless regular season games balanced against home games in the playoffs seems a decent balance.

The balance to me seems to be whether or not its fair on the other teams in the league. And I don't think there is a way of balancing that out. A few teams are going to suffer because other teams are playing against teams with weakened line ups. I don't think that you can really get around that. The only real advantage to BBTV's schedule that I can see is that tie breakers are decided late in the season. So you might have the odd (literally) less meaningless games. But thats it.

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 4 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

But they get the other side of the coin in watching the best team in the league, and get home field advantage, with its ticketing advantages through the playoffs. A couple of meaningless regular season games balanced against home games in the playoffs seems a decent balance.

The balance to me seems to be whether or not its fair on the other teams in the league. And I don't think there is a way of balancing that out. A few teams are going to suffer because other teams are playing against teams with weakened line ups. I don't think that you can really get around that. The only real advantage to BBTV's schedule that I can see is that tie breakers are decided late in the season. So you might have the odd (literally) less meaningless games. But thats it.

Yeah, not when the Colts charge upwards of $75 for top-row seats.

Also, I like BBTV's idea here, as if you rest your starters to end the year you'd be helping your divisional rivals into the playoffs.

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Basically, just adjust the scheduling formula (I didn't even consider any logistical issues or anything like that when coming up with this)

Weeks 1 - 4 = games against teams from the other conference (so basically like early-season non-conference college games)

Weeks 5 - 8 = divisional games (note - one of these weeks could be a bye week, depending on the team.

Weeks 8 - 14 = intra conference games (games vs. other division of conference + extra 2 games against same-place teams) (note - one of these weeks could be the bye week. Basically a team's bye week happens between week 5 and 14. There is overlap in week 8 because week 8 could be a bye week after the first divisional round, or it could be an intraconference game)

Weeks 15 - 17 = divisional games

Let's see if I can do this with The Chargers' opponents for the 2010 season...

1 CARDINALS

2 @ Seahawks

3 49ERS

4 @ Rams

5 CHIEFS

6 @ Broncos

7 @ Raiders

8 BYE

9 JAGUARS

10 @ Texans

11 @ Bengals

12 PATRIOTS

13 @ Colts

14 TITANS

15 RAIDERS

16 @ Chiefs

17 BRONCOS

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 4 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

But they get the other side of the coin in watching the best team in the league, and get home field advantage, with its ticketing advantages through the playoffs. A couple of meaningless regular season games balanced against home games in the playoffs seems a decent balance.

Honest to God, there are times when I wonder why I even bother replying to you. No offense, but it's like trying to explain something unpleasant to Pollyanna.

Good, bad, or indifferent, it's not fair to ask people to pay for something and then deliver much less than the advertised product. The Colts aren't marketing their tickets by saying "hey, there's a good chance you're buying 8 games of NFL football but you might only end up with 5. But that's OK because you'll get the privilege of watching a really good team for those 5 games. We can't promise you we'll be that good but there is always a chance. So please don't be upset when we screw you with a couple more exhibition games in December."

 

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I suspect the NFL is more likely to use this "problem" as an excuse to expand the playoffs all the way to 16 teams, ostensibly to more teams in the playoff hunt through the end of the season and eliminate the first-round bye as an incentive altogether. (Their real motives being, of course, to rake in that much more cash from the added first-round games, and maybe even give NFL Network a couple of playoff games to televise.) Indeed, considering how many recent Super Bowl teams played and won in the first round, one must wonder how much of an incentive a bye really is to begin with.

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I suspect the NFL is more likely to use this "problem" as an excuse to expand the playoffs all the way to 16 teams, ostensibly to more teams in the playoff hunt through the end of the season and eliminate the first-round bye as an incentive altogether. (Their real motives being, of course, to rake in that much more cash from the added first-round games, and maybe even give NFL Network a couple of playoff games to televise.) Indeed, considering how many recent Super Bowl teams played and won in the first round, one must wonder how much of an incentive a bye really is to begin with.

I was thinking 8 teams and eliminate the bye as a solution but then it occurred to me that more playoff teams might actually increase the likelihood of more meaningless games. The truth is that there really is no solution.

 

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The NFL already tried one strategy...the salary cap. That levels the playing field a lot more than anything else the NFL can possibly do.

Ethically, what can the NFL do? Teams have shown in the past that they're willing to rest players in the 15th and 16th games, regardless of the opponent...whether they be a divisional foe or interconference. The NFL can't tell teams who to play or take away draft picks.

Teams will do what they feel is in their best interests for success in the playoffs. Some teams will rest their players, some will play them.

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I suspect the NFL is more likely to use this "problem" as an excuse to expand the playoffs all the way to 16 teams, ostensibly to more teams in the playoff hunt through the end of the season and eliminate the first-round bye as an incentive altogether. (Their real motives being, of course, to rake in that much more cash from the added first-round games, and maybe even give NFL Network a couple of playoff games to televise.) Indeed, considering how many recent Super Bowl teams played and won in the first round, one must wonder how much of an incentive a bye really is to begin with.

I was thinking 8 teams and eliminate the bye as a solution but then it occurred to me that more playoff teams might actually increase the likelihood of more meaningless games. The truth is that there really is no solution.

I didn't say this was a solution to the "problem" (or is that a "solution" in search of a problem?), merely a pretext for ulterior motives.

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The people crying about resting players are the same people who would scream bloody murder if a guy goes down in a meaningless game. If your team is in a position to rest players, be thankful for making the playoffs. Your team obviously put up a great enough performance in previous games to make the playoffs, and they didn't charge you extra.

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"One of my concerns is shysters show up and take advantage of people's good will and generosity".

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I think that you just have to cope with the idea that some games are going to be a bit meaningless at the end of the season, except for hoping that draft order is some kind of thing to play for.

The real issue here is with season ticket holders. Season ticket holders in Indy were basically forced to pay for what amounted to be 4 exhibition games this season. It's bad enough being forced to pay for the actual exhibition games and this season they were forced to pay for two more. From what I've read, Roger Goodell is not happy about this and the league is looking for a solution.

BBTV is definitely on the right track. It could help lower the number of meaningless games but there's no way to eliminate them.

But they get the other side of the coin in watching the best team in the league, and get home field advantage, with its ticketing advantages through the playoffs. A couple of meaningless regular season games balanced against home games in the playoffs seems a decent balance.

Honest to God, there are times when I wonder why I even bother replying to you. No offense, but it's like trying to explain something unpleasant to Pollyanna.

Good, bad, or indifferent, it's not fair to ask people to pay for something and then deliver much less than the advertised product. The Colts aren't marketing their tickets by saying "hey, there's a good chance you're buying 8 games of NFL football but you might only end up with 5. But that's OK because you'll get the privilege of watching a really good team for those 5 games. We can't promise you we'll be that good but there is always a chance. So please don't be upset when we screw you with a couple more exhibition games in December."

I doubt the NFL is going to give any of its member teams 3 consecutive home games to close out the season. Certainly not teams that get their stadiums all to themselves. Colts season ticket holders did not pay out for multiple additional games worth of :censored: football this season. They paid out for one extra half of :censored: football this season. This is not something to get up in arms about. Besides, if you are concerned about watching inferior football, you can always sell your tickets through StubHub.

On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said:
You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now.
On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said:
Today, we are all otaku.

"The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert

POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010

The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy)

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