Gary

2010 NCAA Football Thread

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Didn't Oregon give 'zona a vicious curbstomping this year?

Yes they did. :censored: happens.

Well, because that :censored: happened, I respectly ask you to calm the :censored: down with your schadenfreude.

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Regarding Hoke, I think he can do great things at Michigan, I'm not counting him as an instant failure quite yet. Must I remind the masses of the last Mountain West coach to land a major job on the big stage? Urban Meyer, and he did pretty well. Of course, everyone seems to forget that Meyer came from the MWC (I don't think ESPN even mentioned Utah once when he retired, which really pissed me off) but the MWC is no crapshoot when it cones to coaches. I'm not saying Hoke wouldve been my absolute #1 choice, but I don't think it's a bad hire by any means. Let's give the guy a shot here, who knows what he could do?

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Didn't Oregon give 'zona a vicious curbstomping this year?

Yes they did. :censored: happens.

Well, because that :censored: happened, I respectly ask

you to calm the :censored: down with your schadenfreude.

Oh, and +1. :P

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IIRC wasn't Tressel a coach from Youngstown State for many years? I should think Hoke should be given the chance he could do some good things at Michigan. Just because he comes from a minor program doesn't mean he won't do major things

Tressel won 4 National Championships at YSU.

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IIRC wasn't Tressel a coach from Youngstown State for many years? I should think Hoke should be given the chance he could do some good things at Michigan. Just because he comes from a minor program doesn't mean he won't do major things

Yes he did. He also won 4 Division I-AA National Championships, played for two more, and generally turned Youngstown State into a Division I-AA powerhouse during the Nineties. (He also cheated like a mofo to achieve at least part of that, but that's really par for the course.) Hoke's best season ended with Ball State being the MAC runner up.

Regarding Hoke, I think he can do great things at Michigan, I'm not counting him as an instant failure quite yet. Must I remind the masses of the last Mountain West coach to land a major job on the big stage? Urban Meyer, and he did pretty well. Of course, everyone seems to forget that Meyer came from the MWC (I don't think ESPN even mentioned Utah once when he retired, which really pissed me off) but the MWC is no crapshoot when it cones to coaches. I'm not saying Hoke wouldve been my absolute #1 choice, but I don't think it's a bad hire by any means. Let's give the guy a shot here, who knows what he could do?

He turned San Diego State into the best Mountain West Program that is not bailing out on the Conference after this season (so he turned them into a middle of the road MWC team). Urban Meyer took Utah to an undefeated season and a pimp slapping of an overmatched Pitt squad on National TV. There is a major difference.

Bottom line, you'd normally think that if a coach was good enough to coach at Michigan, other programs would be beating down the door to secure this guy's services. They haven't been. To repeat Minnesota and Indiana, which would normally commit homicides to have Michigan's coach, decided not to hire Hoke in their own coaching searches last month even though he was a candidate for both. That tells you a lot about Hoke's upside right there. He's not a bad hire because of where he coached. He's a bad hire because of how he did as a coach where he coached. (And this also ignores that Hoke's obsession with "good, proper Big Ten caveman football" is going to be very counterproductive to the overall effort of the Conference ceasing to be a national laughing stock and will drive off Michigan's second elite college QB in about 5 years.)

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Hoke will only be as successful as the assistants he brings in with him. Number one, Michigan needs him to bring Al Borges with him from SDSU to be the OC.

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Bottom line, you'd normally think that if a coach was good enough to coach at Michigan, other programs would be beating down the door to secure this guy's services. They haven't been. To repeat Minnesota and Indiana, which would normally commit homicides to have Michigan's coach, decided not to hire Hoke in their own coaching searches last month even though he was a candidate for both. That tells you a lot about Hoke's upside right there. He's not a bad hire because of where he coached. He's a bad hire because of how he did as a coach where he coached. (And this also ignores that Hoke's obsession with "good, proper Big Ten caveman football" is going to be very counterproductive to the overall effort of the Conference ceasing to be a national laughing stock and will drive off Michigan's second elite college QB in about 5 years.)

You mean like taking two bottom of the barrel programs and turning them around? Yes his career win-loss is below .500 but he took over a one-win Ball State team and had a 12-win season with them. Yes it was the MAC, but keep in mind that this was also with a Central Michigan that was also ranked in the top 25 that year.

And I just love the people saying "no one wants the Michigan job, he was their 3rd choice." Harbaugh was never in the running, the fans were the ones that just assumed that he was the guy. Brandon said when he canned RichRod, "I think Jim is going to the NFL." As for Miles, there was no way he was going to leave LSU and I can't blame him. The guy is already making $4 million a year in a conference with less rules on recruiting than the Big Ten.

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I can't directly reply because of my iPod (well I can, it's just a total hassle and takes too long), but I think you missed my point rams80. I'm not saying Hoke will be the next Urban Meyer - I'm not even comparing the two at all - what I'm saying is alot of the knock I hear from others about him coming from a mid-major conference shouldn't matter, and that the MWC has had really great coaches the past few years, Hoke being one of them.

And honestly, a coach shouldn't be judged until you actually see him in action WITH his new team. People forget, Gene Chizik had a losing record at Iowa State before he came to Auburn. Now, he's got a ring. Think those people who first doubted his hire feel dumb now?

I'm not implying Hoke will win a national title within two years, but sometimes, you just can't judge a coach until he starts his job. To me, Hoke did a great job with what he had at SDSU. Growing watching the MWC, I can tell you that SDSU, for years, hasn't been taken seriously. They usually dwell in the basement with the likes of UNLV and Wyoming. Hoke's tenure was different - coming from a Utah fan, SDSU was a serious opponent that you had to worry about this year, much different than the usual "bye-week" label the Aztecs used to get.

Deny it all you want, but Hoke's a good coach. Time will tell how Michigan works out, but as coaches like Gene Chizik have taught us, don't judge a coach 'till he starts his job.

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Bottom line, you'd normally think that if a coach was good enough to coach at Michigan, other programs would be beating down the door to secure this guy's services. They haven't been. To repeat Minnesota and Indiana, which would normally commit homicides to have Michigan's coach, decided not to hire Hoke in their own coaching searches last month even though he was a candidate for both. That tells you a lot about Hoke's upside right there. He's not a bad hire because of where he coached. He's a bad hire because of how he did as a coach where he coached. (And this also ignores that Hoke's obsession with "good, proper Big Ten caveman football" is going to be very counterproductive to the overall effort of the Conference ceasing to be a national laughing stock and will drive off Michigan's second elite college QB in about 5 years.)

You mean like taking two bottom of the barrel programs and turning them around? Yes his career win-loss is below .500 but he took over a one-win Ball State team and had a 12-win season with them. Yes it was the MAC, but keep in mind that this was also with a Central Michigan that was also ranked in the top 25 that year.

And I just love the people saying "no one wants the Michigan job, he was their 3rd choice." Harbaugh was never in the running, the fans were the ones that just assumed that he was the guy. Brandon said when he canned RichRod, "I think Jim is going to the NFL." As for Miles, there was no way he was going to leave LSU and I can't blame him. The guy is already making $4 million a year in a conference with less rules on recruiting than the Big Ten.

So where's Ball State after our wonderful turnaround CEO of a coach bailed on them after a 12 win season? Oh yeah, 2-10 and 4-8 over the last two seasons under Hoke's OC (and one of the more successful branches of the Schembechler-Moeller-Carr coaching tree, make of that what you will.) Stan Parrish (who was subsequently fired). Sounds like more luck than skill to me if the wheels came off THAT quickly after a 12 win season.

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I think Hoke was the perfect choice for Michigan. He's not a "name" coach like RR was or Miles or Harbaugh would have been. As such he's not walking into ridiculously high expectations. Since he isn't expected to go undefeated and beat Ohio State by 35 in his first season, he may actually have some time to rebuild the program. He also has the "luxury" of being a "Michigan man" so the fans and boosters won't be looking for any excuse they can find to hate the guy. He may seem like a "third choice" or whatever you want to call it but under the circumstances I believe he was the right choice. The last thing Michigan needed was to take another big swing at the fences on some "name coach." That program was already fading while Lloyd Carr was there. By hiring Hoke Michigan did exactly what they needed to do (and what they should have done three years ago), they got a guy who, if given the time, should be able to turn their program around. Slow and steady progress with the goal of building a foundation is what Michigan needs and I think this guy is right for that. Hoke did a good job at Ball State and at San Diego State and he did it with a helluva lot less to work with than what he'll have at Michigan.

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I can't directly reply because of my iPod (well I can, it's just a total hassle and takes too long), but I think you missed my point rams80. I'm not saying Hoke will be the next Urban Meyer - I'm not even comparing the two at all - what I'm saying is alot of the knock I hear from others about him coming from a mid-major conference shouldn't matter, and that the MWC has had really great coaches the past few years, Hoke being one of them.

And honestly, a coach shouldn't be judged until you actually see him in action WITH his new team. People forget, Gene Chizik had a losing record at Iowa State before he came to Auburn. Now, he's got a ring. Think those people who first doubted his hire feel dumb now?

I'm not implying Hoke will win a national title within two years, but sometimes, you just can't judge a coach until he starts his job. To me, Hoke did a great job with what he had at SDSU. Growing watching the MWC, I can tell you that SDSU, for years, hasn't been taken seriously. They usually dwell in the basement with the likes of UNLV and Wyoming. Hoke's tenure was different - coming from a Utah fan, SDSU was a serious opponent that you had to worry about this year, much different than the usual "bye-week" label the Aztecs used to get.

Deny it all you want, but Hoke's a good coach. Time will tell how Michigan works out, but as coaches like Gene Chizik have taught us, don't judge a coach 'till he starts his job.

Chizik also hired Gus Malzahn to run his offense/team (and may or may not have been the beneficiary of an illegal financial transaction involving the family of the reigning Heisman trophy winner). When Malzahn eventually leaves, watch Auburn fall back to Earth a little (or more than a little). And that's the crux. You either need to play what Hoke denounces as "basketball on grass," or have such an overwhelmingly decisive talent, size, and strength advantage at the line and in the running back position (a la Wisconsin this year) in order to be successful in modern college football. Hoke doesn't seem to be too keen on the former, Michigan lacks the latter and won't get it back any time soon, and most importantly, Gus Malzahn isn't walking in the front door of Schembechler Hall. Sure you might eventually get to some slightly more mediocre "Tressel Ball stage" where you hover around 8 or 9 wins annually, beat the teams you dominate on paper, and lose to the teams that are even to or superior than you on paper. Something tells me, though, that will not fly at Michigan for long.

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I don't know, I just don't think it's that fair to immediately denounce him. As infrared said, he's not expected to go undefeated and win a title his first year. I think the folks at Michigan are well aware that some rebuilding is needed to be done. I just think the guy should get a chance.

No, Gus Malzahn isn't walking through Michigan's doors. Of course not. But someone else will, and you just never know how the guy, whoever he is, turns out. I respect your opinion, but it's just my humble opinion that when it comes to coaching changes, it's best to reserve judgement until the time is right. Hoke and his staff may do a great job, or they may not. You just don't know, nobody does. So, we'll just have to wait and see.

Also, is it just me, or does Hoke look like Mike Golic? Or even Jeff Garlin?

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I don't know, I just don't think it's that fair to immediately denounce him. As infrared said, he's not expected to go undefeated and win a title his first year. I think the folks at Michigan are well aware that some rebuilding is needed to be done. I just think the guy should get a chance.

No, Gus Malzahn isn't walking through Michigan's doors. Of course not. But someone else will, and you just never know how the guy, whoever he is, turns out. I respect your opinion, but it's just my humble opinion that when it comes to coaching changes, it's best to reserve judgement until the time is right. Hoke and his staff may do a great job, or they may not. You just don't know, nobody does. So, we'll just have to wait and see.

Also, is it just me, or does Hoke look like Mike Golic? Or even Jeff Garlin?

So you're saying he's fat? :P

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^^^ nahh :P haha, really though, it's more the facial expressions and the hair. Maybe its just me, but I've seen it ever since I first saw him when he was hired at SDSU.

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And honestly, a coach shouldn't be judged until you actually see him in action WITH his new team. People forget, Gene Chizik had a losing record at Iowa State before he came to Auburn. Now, he's got a ring. Think those people who first doubted his hire feel dumb now?

Not only a losing record, he lost 10 straight to end the year. How he got Auburn to hire him after losing the last 10 games he had coached is beyond me, but I guess it worked out for both parties.

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And honestly, a coach shouldn't be judged until you actually see him in action WITH his new team. People forget, Gene Chizik had a losing record at Iowa State before he came to Auburn. Now, he's got a ring. Think those people who first doubted his hire feel dumb now?

Not only a losing record, he lost 10 straight to end the year. How he got Auburn to hire him after losing the last 10 games he had coached is beyond me, but I guess it worked out for both parties.

And if memory serves correctly, they didn't even play Oklahoma, Texas, or Texas Tech that year.

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So where's Ball State after our wonderful turnaround CEO of a coach bailed on them after a 12 win season? Oh yeah, 2-10 and 4-8 over the last two seasons under Hoke's OC (and one of the more successful branches of the Schembechler-Moeller-Carr coaching tree, make of that what you will.) Stan Parrish (who was subsequently fired). Sounds like more luck than skill to me if the wheels came off THAT quickly after a 12 win season.

I see this a bit differently.

See if a team tanks that badly after the head coach leaves, then I figure either 1) the old coach brought something to the table that the team couldn't function without, 2) the new coach is attempting to completely change the system and is having problems adjusting (See: the University of Michigan under new head coach, Rich Rodriguez, in 2008, 2009, and 2010), or 3) the new coach just isn't a good coach (which is why he would get fired after just 2 seasons).

I think you're making more out of this than there actually is.

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So where's Ball State after our wonderful turnaround CEO of a coach bailed on them after a 12 win season? Oh yeah, 2-10 and 4-8 over the last two seasons under Hoke's OC (and one of the more successful branches of the Schembechler-Moeller-Carr coaching tree, make of that what you will.) Stan Parrish (who was subsequently fired). Sounds like more luck than skill to me if the wheels came off THAT quickly after a 12 win season.

I see this a bit differently.

See if a team tanks that badly after the head coach leaves, then I figure either 1) the old coach brought something to the table that the team couldn't function without, 2) the new coach is attempting to completely change the system and is having problems adjusting (See: the University of Michigan under new head coach, Rich Rodriguez, in 2008, 2009, and 2010), or 3) the new coach just isn't a good coach (which is why he would get fired after just 2 seasons).

I think you're making more out of this than there actually is.

A ten win drop is more than a coaching change. Especially since the coach was promoted from within the system. A 10 win drop indicates that rather than building a sustainable turnaround, Hoke left the talent cupboard bare in the roster.

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http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6015733&campaign=rss&source=twitter&ex_cid=Twitter_espn_6015733

ANN ARBOR, Mich. -- Michigan athletic director Dave Brandon says quarterback Tate Forcier is no longer with the program.

Brandon made the announcement during a news conference Wednesday after introducing Brady Hoke as the new coach for college football's winningest team.

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Reports are that Norm Chow is out at the OC at UCLA to be replaced by Mike Johnson (most recently 49ers OC). Chow looks to be take a position at Utah.

Football Rumor Mill is generally the "source" which ESPN will run with before attaching an employee's name to their "Breaking News".

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