GriffinM6

Uniform that your team should bring back

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I don't necessarily feel this way. I just think that once you leave something, you should move on and not back. You can "borrow" from the past, but 99% of the time I will never advocate simply "going back", nor do I really ever acknowledge posts that start with "they should go back to..."

What if the team had a perfect look previously which it either erroded or changed drastically? Look at the Mets, who are now a cluster:censored:. Their unis were perfect before black was added. Assuming they were to revamp and remove the black, it would be wrong of them to use the 1997 set just because they wore it previously? I disagree 100%. I think a big recent problem is that teams overdo it when they could have brought back a previous set verbatim or made a few minor tweaks. The Bills, Sabres, and msot of all Chargers had perfectly fine sets in the closet, but they had to get their money's worth from the desginers, so changes were made for the worse. I fully expect the Blue Jays and Padres will come out next year with "retro-inspired" sets, each combining 2-3 different color schemes, trying to please everyone while coming up with crap, where reverting to a past set with only minor changes would have been perfect.

Indeed. I never got the "never look back" sentiment. The goal of sports uniform design isn't to push the limits of graphic design, it's to look good. If a team can improve their look by returning to a previous style if uniform there's no shame in going back.

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None.

The Philly four are on top of their game. I liked the kelly green but todays look is so much better.

i agree, all 4 philly teams look great right now.

I don't necessarily feel this way. I just think that once you leave something, you should move on and not back. You can "borrow" from the past, but 99% of the time I will never advocate simply "going back", nor do I really ever acknowledge posts that start with "they should go back to..."

Whats your user name again? B)

Well... I did say only "99% of the time"...

I don't necessarily feel this way. I just think that once you leave something, you should move on and not back. You can "borrow" from the past, but 99% of the time I will never advocate simply "going back", nor do I really ever acknowledge posts that start with "they should go back to..."

What if the team had a perfect look previously which it either erroded or changed drastically? Look at the Mets, who are now a cluster:censored:. Their unis were perfect before black was added. Assuming they were to revamp and remove the black, it would be wrong of them to use the 1997 set just because they wore it previously? I disagree 100%. I think a big recent problem is that teams overdo it when they could have brought back a previous set verbatim or made a few minor tweaks. The Bills, Sabres, and msot of all Chargers had perfectly fine sets in the closet, but they had to get their money's worth from the desginers, so changes were made for the worse. I fully expect the Blue Jays and Padres will come out next year with "retro-inspired" sets, each combining 2-3 different color schemes, trying to please everyone while coming up with crap, where reverting to a past set with only minor changes would have been perfect.

I wouldn't consider the Mets "going back" if they simply remove black trim. Other than that, with very few exceptions (I'd consider the Jags an exception, and possibly the Blue Jays) once a look is replaced, even if the replacement is garbage, the original just looks "old" IMO. You made a decision that your look either wasn't adequate or wasn't selling enough, so you move on. If you decide that you made a mistake, then fine - but don't just go back verbatim. Every look can be improved on. I wouldn't advocate making an update to something that you've used for 20 years that's working for you just for the sake of making the update, but if you've already broken from it, then by all means you should use the opportunity to enhance it if you're "going back" to it.

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If the Red Sox insist on wearing blue trimmed road jerseys, I think this short-lived design should be brought back.

5954643257_12499d275e_z.jpg5955204664_160a8a0435.jpg

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the red sox roads are disgusting....huge downgrade...their 04 championship roads were so much better.

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For the Marlins, I like these the best.

Penguins: 000470174.jpg

Hawks: Dominique-Wilkins-Sports-Illustrated-1992.jpg

Miami: ken-dorsey.jpg

I love those Hurricane uniforms...those were my favorite set by them ever. I also like the Marlins look, better than the black they have used more recently.

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I'm happy with 3 of my 5 teams' looks(Strikers, Heat, Dolphins). But the Marlins and Panthers definitely need to take a trip back to the 1990s:

The perfect sweater template the Panthers wore until the lockout:

Panthers-199596Team-Large.jpg

And of course the wonderful black sleeve/teal script Marlins look:

1997.marlinsap_display_image.jpg?1288106843

At least the Panthers have done an about-face and are keeping their original colors. The Marlins on the other hand... :cry:

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Kentucky Wildcats Football:

draft_woodson.jpg

Kentucky Wildcats Basketball:

uk1.jpg

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Thank you, the Panthers are another team I was thinking of when I said they had the opportunity to go back to a perfect set and they botched it. I think their original set was perfect for them. I'm not a huge fan of the vests for the Marlins, but that entire set is better than their current one. And I am not optimistic about next year's set.

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I get what you're saying Vet, but it just seems limiting. Like I said before I think a team's only goal when it comes to uniform design should be to look good. If going back to an old design will accomplish that better then a new, updated set then you should return to the old design. Yeah, it sounds nice to say a team should always look forward and not back, but it just seems way to limiting for what should be a very simple goal; for a team to look it's best.

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Except merely going back to an old uniform every time you want to change your look would lead to complacency in the uniform-design industry. What's the point of making anything new if no team wants to progress visually?

In your world, why should computer companies bother updating the old stuff when they achieve the ultimate goal of turning on and functioning properly? Why should bands make more than one album - after all, people might not like the second one better than the first one. I could go on.

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Except merely going back to an old uniform every time you want to change your look would lead to complacency in the uniform-design industry. What's the point of making anything new if no team wants to progress visually?

In your world, why should computer companies bother updating the old stuff when they achieve the ultimate goal of turning on and functioning properly? Why should bands make more than one album - after all, people might not like the second one better than the first one. I could go on.

Yeah, you could go on if you want to continue to completely misrepresent what he said.

Ice Cap is talking about designs that were obviously better before. What does that have to do with your examples?

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How on Earth did I misrepresent what he said? He argued that just bringing back old uniforms verbatim is often a better solution than creating new looks, while I argued that the uniform industry and their clients, like in other industries, should upgrade over time instead of living in the past.

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How on Earth did I misrepresent what he said? He argued that just bringing back old uniforms verbatim is often a better solution than creating new looks, while I argued that the uniform industry and their clients, like in other industries, should upgrade over time instead of living in the past.

Mmm... that's not exactly what he was arguing, but I think I'm gonna let him take it from here, if he chooses to do so.

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Except merely going back to an old uniform every time you want to change your look would lead to complacency in the uniform-design industry. What's the point of making anything new if no team wants to progress visually?

In your world, why should computer companies bother updating the old stuff when they achieve the ultimate goal of turning on and functioning properly? Why should bands make more than one album - after all, people might not like the second one better than the first one. I could go on.

This one word is where your argument failed. New looks aren't "progress" merely because they're new. Piping on football unis isn't progress. Neither is monochrome. Wearing solid colored pants and stripeless socks isn't progress. They are trends, and the monochrome trend will be looked back upon with bellbottoms and zubas. If a sports uniform is great, there is no need to "progress" from it, as what is spun as progress would inevitably mean changing things which don't need to be changed in an attemp to make it look cutting edge, meaning it would look dated in a few years and need to be changed again. And your examples are bad. A better example would be if U2 wanted to progress from making pop-rock music by releasing a death metal album. Bands can't release the same exact album with identical songs every time and expect people to buy it, but sports teams can use classic looks year after year and still have them be as effective as originally.

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chicago-cubs-23-sandberg-blue-jerseys-4784f.jpgNDUCLA1.jpg

That sleeve patch is by far the best secondary logo the Cubs have ever had, and I love the striping.

And I REALLY love the shamrock on Notre Dame's 70s jerseys...and they helped us end UCLA's 88 game streak.

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How on Earth did I misrepresent what he said? He argued that just bringing back old uniforms verbatim is often a better solution than creating new looks, while I argued that the uniform industry and their clients, like in other industries, should upgrade over time instead of living in the past.

Mmm... that's not exactly what he was arguing, but I think I'm gonna let him take it from here, if he chooses to do so.

Thanks oldschool.

I never said "just go back" is the ideal path to follow. I said if an older look is ideal, then you go back. If you can create something better then anything you've worn before, do that. All I'm saying is that if a team has an ideal look in its past then they should just return to that, admit the mistake that was changing it in the first place, and move on. The Blue Jays are a perfect example.

The World Series era set was brilliant. Unique, clean, distinct, it gave the Blue Jays a look that they could claim as their own without going overboard with outlines, extraneous additional colours, and pointless shading, and without going faux retro to an old school look they never had. The philosophy of "never look back, even if what was worn before is better" would mean that these perfect uniforms would never be re-adopted, even if that's all the team would need to do to perfect their look. It would force unnecessary updates on that set that would inevitably make them look worse then they would look if they simply re-adopted the old set. In that case, yes, you do yourself no favours by "pushing the envelope." The wheel doesn't need to be re-invented at every opportunity you know.

Now not every team has a look in its past that is clearly "the" look that would trump anything new they could come up with. You keep saying my philosophy is "always look back." That's not the case at all. The Dolphins 49ers looked forward in the 90s and created sets that trumped anything they had previously worn, in my opinion. All I'm saying is that when it's apparent you need a new look you shouldn't limit your options by discarding every previous set you've worn on the philosophy of "never look back." It's just silly, as it limits your options and thus hampers your ability to fulfill the goal of sports uniform design, which is to look good.

When it comes time to change your set you should most definitely look back to your past. If there's nothing in your past that would work as a modern uniform set, then yes, design a nice, contemporary look. If you have a look from years past that would work better then any new "update," however, you shouldn't be forced to ignore it based on some "to infinity and beyond" style design philosophy.

Except merely going back to an old uniform every time you want to change your look would lead to complacency in the uniform-design industry. What's the point of making anything new if no team wants to progress visually?

TheOldRoman already covered this, but it warrants repeating. "New" does not equal "progress" in the realm of uniform design. It does sometimes, but not always. Diamond plate patterns on football jerseys isn't progressive. Side panels that don't line up with pants strips isn't progressive. Giant logos screened across the front of hockey sweaters with funky striping patterns aren't progressive. Heck, giant logos splashed across football jerseys aren't progressive. Teal and black isn't anymore progressive then red, white, and blue. I could go on. New doesn't automatically mean better.

Which is the problem I have with the position you and BBTV are advocating. You see me as the "old is better" guy, but I'm not. I'm just saying teams should open themselves to all options. If that means that going with an older look is the best choice, then a team should go back to it. If that means a team is better off with a new set, they should design a new set. You're the guys arguing in favour of "only looking one way." I'm just saying that the past has just as much to offer as the present/future. Our positions aren't opposites of one and other, which is where I think you're getting tripped up. You assume I'm advocating the opposite of "never look back," but I'm not.

In your world, why should computer companies bother updating the old stuff when they achieve the ultimate goal of turning on and functioning properly? Why should bands make more than one album - after all, people might not like the second one better than the first one. I could go on.

Uniform design isn't comparable to computer engineering. At all.

If you want to play this game, however, I will. The world would be better off without Twitter, Facebook, MySpace, and iPhones :P

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