CCSLC Badges

[Fox]

My take on the quality of concept debate is that while everyone is quick to say that new members making paint concepts have ruined the concept forum, I would argue that it could not function without them. One thing that many people don't realize here is that those who are interested in graphic design of sports logos and uniforms is a pretty select group of people. While many call for anyone new, or whose talent doesn't extend beyond paint to get off of the forums, the site would be nothing about them.

Some experienced members are too quick to say, "You only have 53 posts, your opinion of the striping on the helmet doesn't matter" or, "This is a recolorization concept in paint- automatically terrible."

All I'm saying is give everyone a chance. While there are some obvious trolls just here to annoy people, most people here, even if their concepts are dull and low quality, has only the best intentions of sharing their ideas of what they want sports teams to look like.

Honestly, right now I'm working on an MLB series. While all of my concepts are done in paint and few extend beyond recolorizations / tweaks with existing graphics, I don't see any problem with me posting on these boards. The reality is, instead of trying to shoot down other people's work, we should all be greatful that we can come together on a forum where we share the same interests of sports logos and uniforms.

Back to the badge idea- I love it, and definetly think we should do it. I would make a badge thread where people can post concepts that they want to be considered for badges. I can't wait until the thread is up and running!

[9erssteve]

Ok, this is all my opinion, and what i have learned from all other type of sites on the net, they are all the same, mostly with the graphics, and design sites. all of your so called PROFESSIONALS were newbies at one time or another, we all are. The difference is they have honed there skills and are probably very good and now everyone thinks they are the TOP TALENT. Now that the TOP TALENT thinks they are better than everyone else, they dont care to help anyone else. All the 5 minute concepts you talk about may have taken that person 30 min or longer, just because you pose the skills to do it in 5 min, they dont. So all your TOP TALENT is who killed the site because they did not want to take the time to help the newbies.

The uniform concepts that i have made, other members may think that "oh i can do that in 5 min" yes, because you have been doing it probably for years, in actuality, each one of my concepts have taken no less than 2 hours each, some even longer, because i have a idea in my head, once drawn out, i dont like it, i change it, still dont like it, and continue to change it till its something i like. so your 5 min concept takes me hours, and the people who dog out the less experienced member because of there 5 min concepts are the one in the wrong.

I like all of your work GatorHunter, I enjoy seeing everyones work. I am in college for Broadcasting but my love for logos and uniforms has been a passion of mine since i was about 6 or 7, and now 11 years later I find this site and it's honestly a dream come true to find other people who share my passion. Even though its a hobby for me unlike a profession for others. I apreciate it when someone takes the time out of there day to look at my work and give me feedback, even though I will never be as good as the people on here but I do pride myself on improving. It hurts me to see all these people fighting on here because they think there better than other people and now you guys may have lost a really talented designer in GatorHunter. I plan to continue posting my concepts and I hope all these other people can get over the stupid egos and everyone get along. In the end were all here sharing the same love.

Who's fighting with who cos they think they're better? I certainly never claimed I was better than anyone and wouldn't do so this is just a hobby for me too. Yeah I've worked in graphic design but I've never done a sports team before so I do this for fun like the majority of others here.

What I took offense at was being told by GatorHunter that the Pro's we used to have here who were all happy to help people were the problem with this board when he never even knew them. He then flew off the handle and launched into a personal attack. To the best of my knowledge I've never commented on any of his concepts and if I had I certainly wouldn't have said what he claimed I did as I NEVER HAVE and NEVER WILL just rip someone, it's a pointless excercise it makes the person doing the ripping look like a fool and doesn't help the OP so what's the point. I've always tried to be balanced and give reasons and possible solutions for any areas that I feel need improving. I try to give the kind of feedback I'd like to recieve and if more people took that approach we'd have less problems here I feel.

As to everyone taking the hump with my dislike of uni concepts, it's not that I have a problem with uni's as such, like I said as part of a total redesign package they are great. All I was trying to do was come up with a possible idea to push peoples creativity and give other people more to comment on. I think the reason the feedback is getting poorer is the fact that there are only so many ways you can tweak a striping pattern, or so many panels to recolour on a template, and no matter how much thought is put into it, or how well it's presented there's a pretty strong chance it's been done before and the older posters here will have seen it. Whereas you have far more freedom with a logo to produce something that's never been seen before and could really get people talking. At the end of the day I'm not a mod or an admin I have no power here to stop people posting uni threads, I've stopped viewing most of them and haven't commented on a uni only thread for weeks now so if they keep cropping up I'll just keep by-passing them all I did was try to make a suggestion that might push people to do more than play with templates.

Sorry if my ambitions to improve the board, return the feedback to the helpful kind it used to be and help other posters get better faster offended anyone.

9erssteve

[vicfurth]

I usually don't argue, but I have to speak up on this. As a disclaimer, this has nothing to do with me not having tried a logoset in years.

As one who is closer to being here TEN years rather than two, I could turn this around on you, 9ersteve. Who are you to say anything about the good designers or bad designers on this board? You've "only" been here a couple years. The CCSLC hasn't seen an authentic hey-day since '04-'05, long before you likely even lurked. Some of the members I had the pleasure of being around wiped the floor with anyone here currently. The "good ol' days" of people actually designing for legitimate professional teams that you speak of... I actually was around when they were here. It says something about a board when the people that were ban-worthy then would be the "widely respected" members today.

Granted, there are good designers here that have really improved, despite everyone's snubbing and refusal to even attempt to help out. Hell, the only reason I really post anything is to try to break through everyone's "holier than thou" bull, which you graciously showed in the past couple of pages. To say that you have any clue how things used to be around here is completely asinine.

Raysox, I applaud that you're trying to fix the commenting here, I really do. However, it's a bit like trying to fix the Titanic with super-glue.

[9erssteve]

I usually don't argue, but I have to speak up on this. As a disclaimer, this has nothing to do with me not having tried a logoset in years.

As one who is closer to being here TEN years rather than two, I could turn this around on you, 9ersteve. Who are you to say anything about the good designers or bad designers on this board? You've "only" been here a couple years. The CCSLC hasn't seen an authentic hey-day since '04-'05, long before you likely even lurked. Some of the members I had the pleasure of being around wiped the floor with anyone here currently. The "good ol' days" of people actually designing for legitimate professional teams that you speak of... I actually was around when they were here. It says something about a board when the people that were ban-worthy then would be the "widely respected" members today.

Granted, there are good designers here that have really improved, despite everyone's snubbing and refusal to even attempt to help out. Hell, the only reason I really post anything is to try to break through everyone's "holier than thou" bull, which you graciously showed in the past couple of pages. To say that you have any clue how things used to be around here is completely asinine.

Raysox, I applaud that you're trying to fix the commenting here, I really do. However, it's a bit like trying to fix the Titanic with super-glue.

To make claims I knew what the board was like 10 years ago would be assanine yes, but I NEVER made those claims. All I claimed was that things have gone downhill in the last year. Last I checked the guys at Plan B were pro's they were posting when I first joined as were others, but they dont post here anymore. So my claims are legit! You knew more of them than me, that stands to reason you've been a member longer, so surely seeing all of those people leave would upset you as much if not more than it does me, as you've seen more of them leave! No? I never claimed to have been here "during a heyday" all I commented on and COULD comment on was the time I've been a member here, unlike certain people in this thread who claimed that the members who'd come before them were the issue despite having no frame of reference or evidence to back it up.

So I guess what I'm asking is, why take a dig at me? Your point seems to be the same as mine! The board has/is deteriorating, and what can be done about it? You've kinda shot yourself in the foot. We're coming from the same place, granted we're a few years apart with regards membership time but we both want to see the same thing: The boards improve. I'd like it to be as good as it was when I joined if not better, and I would expect you'd feel the same way as from what you've said the board has deteriorated further than I realised.

As to the hollier than thou comment where did that come from? All I did was make a SUGGESTION I felt might help push people to try something more creative than playing with templates. I knew it wouldn't be a terribly popular suggestion but funnily enough it's more than you've done! Rather than having a go at me how about you throw you're 5 cents in? You say you applaud Roysox for his efforts but that you think it'll be about as successful as trying to fix the Titanic with superglue, how about instead of the playful metaphors you pitch in with a possible remedy to the issue?

I NEVER HAVE and NEVER WOULD claim to be better than anyone, the amount of time I or anyone else has been here is of no concern to me. What is of concern is the amount of EFFORT people put in, be that in their concepts or their feedback. I give feedback regularly to newbies and respected posters alike and when I do I go out of my way to be as detailed as I can and as considerate as possible. I leave the kind of feedback I hope others would give me. If you have an example of anything to the contrary share it, otherwise stop making out you're the only one who cares to give feedback so people can improve.

I've never disputed there are better designers than me here, I've certainly never claimed to be the longest serving member here, I've always been respectful of longer serving members and right now I'm concerned that the vast majority of them seem to be leaving. So with that in mind and as one of the longest serving members I know I'll respectfully ask you this, In your opinion why are all the long serving members leaving? What's changed to make them pack up and leave and what can be done to stop more leaving?

I've given my suggestion based on the small window of reference I have with regards my time as a member, what's your suggestion?

9erssteve

[vicfurth]

I will say that it was less of a dig at you than at the situation as a whole.

This board used to be a little corner of the internet where civilized people could show designs and critique. Amazing stuff came from it.

It started with people having work stolen as we gained more exposure, so members watermarked their images. Then we had people learn to remove the marks, or I'm ore them, and steal the work anyway. This caused the members to stop posting their own work bit still critique others.

Then the exposure with Paul Lukas started up, which caused every dipwad from here to Tuesday show up and parrot what Lukas said. These were the people that took offense to anything that wasn't ego-stroking or pointed, regardless of the quality of comments. In doing so, the veteran members said "f it" and left.

All this happened over the better part of the last eight years. My main beef with what you've been saying is that it implies you thinking that uniform concepts are inferior to logo concepts. I may be off base, though. As one whose designs have centered on uniforms--and I do realize that it is more difficult to create a full logo--I take a lot of care to ensure that my designs are unique. Unique is becoming increasingly hard with uniforms.

As for suggestions to improve the place, I'll use the phrase "can't unsee what you've seen". We can't unexpose CCSLC, and the idiots will still come and go. However, we respectable members have to band together and unify.

[BigBubba]

Just my opinion:

It really, really pisses me off how every veteran member speaks of this forum like it used to be inhabited by Van Gohs and Picassos, and that now every other concept is either a troll posting a ridiculous concept, or a newbie posting a minor tweak. As elijas mentioned before, despite us being very inexperienced here, we've both seen our fair share of good, solid, original concepts, with few troll posts or 5-minute fill-tool jobs. I understand that they're upset that the site is not what it was (after all, they would know), but they act like this is a kindergarten finger-painting class where every concept is either stolen, done in 45 seconds, or the most horrible thing from hell.

Plus, this is a good thread that could've used a bump.

[Geoff]

I'm not trying to say everything here now sucks but it's a fact that the concepts forum used to be way better than its current state.

[johnrafael]

Just my opinion:

It really, really pisses me off how every veteran member speaks of this forum like it used to be inhabited by Van Gohs and Picassos, and that now every other concept is either a troll posting a ridiculous concept, or a newbie posting a minor tweak. As elijas mentioned before, despite us being very inexperienced here, we've both seen our fair share of good, solid, original concepts, with few troll posts or 5-minute fill-tool jobs. I understand that they're upset that the site is not what it was (after all, they would know), but they act like this is a kindergarten finger-painting class where every concept is either stolen, done in 45 seconds, or the most horrible thing from hell.

Plus, this is a good thread that could've used a bump.

Yes. Yes. They say it, but not really help less-experienced users as Elijas, or HACOBCEM. It was the same with me when I started. I delayed my Soccer FontPack because all I see here is that Van Goghs an Picassos thinking: "I'm better. I don't have to help anyone."

[vicfurth]

You guys are missing the point. I have no problem with people posting concepts; quite the opposite, actually. What I do have a HUGE problem with is when one gives a couple of pointers on how to improve something only to be greeted with "well, it's my idea so f you!!!".

[BigBubba]

You guys are missing the point. I have no problem with people posting concepts; quite the opposite, actually. What I do have a HUGE problem with is when one gives a couple of pointers on how to improve something only to be greeted with "well, it's my idea so f you!!!".

I wasn't directing that at you; more so I was stating it because the whole "CCSLC is not what it used to be" topic came up, and I decided this was the right time to bring it up.

[vicfurth]

The argument could be made that nothing is the same as 7-10 years ago. Heck, ten years ago we still had the twin towers.

I think we are all mature to realize things change, for better or worse. We did have a real treat in some of the people that posted then; I'd be lying if I said otherwise. For instance, the one Arizona Cardinals logo that surfaces now and again was created here. A former poster here did work with the 49ers; another with major universities.

Am I saying that everyone now sucks? Of course not. What we do have, though, is a serious case of "one bad apple spoils the bunch." That's where the exposure on ESPN.com really hurt the site.

[BigBubba]

Any update on this? I hate to bump an old thread, but this was a really good idea. I notice that you still have the images up (on photobucket). This really could've gone/can go somewhere and would really improve the Concepts Forum.

[piratesfan16]

Any update on this? I hate to bump an old thread, but this was a really good idea. I notice that you still have the images up (on photobucket). This really could've gone/can go somewhere and would really improve the Concepts Forum.

+1

[Fox]

Any update on this? I hate to bump an old thread, but this was a really good idea. I notice that you still have the images up (on photobucket). This really could've gone/can go somewhere and would really improve the Concepts Forum.

+1

agreed 100%