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2011-12 NBA Season

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Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs. Wade's also a better defender. You could say the Heat wouldn't have even made it to the playoffs over the past eight years if he wasn't on the team, so telling me the Cavs and Heat wouldn't win without LeBron is rather lame. Let's face it...the Heat wouldn't win without Wade. Wade was inexperienced in

his first Finals too, yet took over and led the team from a 0-2 series deficit and won in 6 against the Mavs. There was a reason he was Finals' MVP. LeBron didn't have a horrible supporting cast...you don't win three playoff series en route to the Finals if the rest of your team is horrible. That's just a lame excuse. Quit making excuses for the guy and come to reality: he disappeared last year in the Finals, when the lights were brightest.

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Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs. Wade's also a better defender. You could say the Heat wouldn't have even made it to the playoffs over the past eight years if he wasn't on the team, so telling me the Cavs and Heat wouldn't win without LeBron is rather lame. Let's face it...the Heat wouldn't win without Wade. Wade was inexperienced in

his first Finals too, yet took over and led the team from a 0-2 series deficit and won in 6 against the Mavs. There was a reason he was Finals' MVP. LeBron didn't have a horrible supporting cast...you don't win three playoff series en route to the Finals if the rest of your team is horrible. That's just a lame excuse. Quit making excuses for the guy and come to reality: he disappeared last year in the Finals, when the lights were brightest.

Really?

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Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs. Wade's also a better defender. You could say the Heat wouldn't have even made it to the playoffs over the past eight years if he wasn't on the team, so telling me the Cavs and Heat wouldn't win without LeBron is rather lame. Let's face it...the Heat wouldn't win without Wade. Wade was inexperienced in

his first Finals too, yet took over and led the team from a 0-2 series deficit and won in 6

against the Mavs. There was a reason he was Finals' MVP. LeBron didn't have a horrible supporting cast...you don't win three playoff series en route to the Finals if the rest of your team is horrible. That's just a lame excuse. Quit making excuses for the guy and come to reality: he disappeared last year in the Finals, when the lights were brightest.

Really?

In this context, yes, really. The Cavs wouldn't win without LeBron = The Heat wouldn't win without Wade. It's not a convincing argument that one is better than the other. The Cavs and Heat obviously need good players to win.

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Wade had Shaq, Alonzo Mourning, Eddie Jones, and a bunch of other veterans with playoff experience his first time in the Finals.... and even then, it took a collapse by the Mavericks and a series of questionable calls to get it done.

When LeBron was in the Finals for the first time, his best second option was Larry Hughes, and their opponent was the dynasty Spurs in their prime. Big difference.

As for last year's Finals loss... both LeBron and Wade deserve a lot of blame. LeBron for his bad performance, and Wade for his trash talk and early celebration that just served as more motivation for the Mavs. I can understand the criticism there, but I just don't get it when people bash LeBron over 2007. With that roster, it took a superhuman effort by LeBron just to get to the Finals.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes. To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes. To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

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Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs. Wade's also a better defender. You could say the Heat wouldn't have even made it to the playoffs over the past eight years if he wasn't on the team, so telling me the Cavs and Heat wouldn't win without LeBron is rather lame. Let's face it...the Heat wouldn't win without Wade. Wade was inexperienced in

his first Finals too, yet took over and led the team from a 0-2 series deficit and won in 6 against the Mavs. There was a reason he was Finals' MVP. LeBron didn't have a horrible supporting cast...you don't win three playoff series en route to the Finals if the rest of your team is horrible. That's just a lame excuse. Quit making excuses for the guy and come to reality: he disappeared last year in the Finals, when the lights were brightest.

Really?

That's what I'm saying. Must've missed the '07 playoffs where LeBron literally dragged the rest of that Cavs team to the NBA Finals. Lights Out already went over the supporting cast. When your second best option is LARRY :censored: ING HUGHES, you are a miracle worker. The absolute only reason why they got past the Pistons that year was due to LeBron.

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The Mavs didn't collapse? I'm pretty sure choking away a 2-0 lead in the Finals is the textbook example of a collapse. The Mavs realistically should have won that series.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes. To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10 in two of them.

The Mavs didn't collapse? I'm pretty sure choking away a 2-0 lead in the Finals is the textbook example of a collapse. The Mavs realistically should have won that series.

Id say they got outplayed and outcoached the final four games. Not a collapse. Nice revisionist history, though.

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The Heat would not have gone to the Finals without Shaq.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes. To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10 in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting the playoffs and the finals?

BTW,while Shaq's scoring was down in the Finals, he still averaged 18PPG and 10RPG in the playoffs

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Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs. Wade's also a better defender. You could say the Heat wouldn't have even made it to the playoffs over the past eight years if he wasn't on the team, so telling me the Cavs and Heat wouldn't win without LeBron is rather lame. Let's face it...the Heat wouldn't win without Wade. Wade was inexperienced in

his first Finals too, yet took over and led the team from a 0-2 series deficit and won in 6 against the Mavs. There was a reason he was Finals' MVP. LeBron didn't have a horrible supporting cast...you don't win three playoff series en route to the Finals if the rest of your team is horrible. That's just a lame excuse. Quit making excuses for the guy and come to reality: he disappeared last year in the Finals, when the lights were brightest.

Really?

That's what I'm saying. Must've missed the '07 playoffs where LeBron literally dragged the rest of that Cavs team to the NBA Finals. Lights Out already went over the supporting cast. When your second best option is LARRY :censored: ING HUGHES, you are a miracle worker. The absolute only reason why they got past the Pistons that year was due to LeBron.

The only reason Miami beat Dallas in the NBA FINALS was because of Wade. Look at the box scores. Wade's supporting cast wasn't really lighting it up. Wade scored over 35 three times in four wins.

Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes.

To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10 in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting

the playoffs and the finals?

That's not what I meant at all. You're smarter than that.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes.

To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10 in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting

the playoffs and the finals?

That's not what I meant at all. You're smarter than that.

Wade's numbers are better than LeBron's in the playoffs. I'm not saying LeBron is awful in the playoffs, rather Wade's a more efficient shooter from the field, 3 point line, and free throw line in the playoffs.
Not in the playoffs, he's not. I'll grant you that Miami played well without Wade, but they also won without both Wade and LeBron in the lineup. Does that mean Bosh is the best player? Nope.

Also, LeBron is better than Durant, as this season LeBron scores more, rebounds more, has more assists, and more steals and better FG% and 3P%. He also has 2 more MVP's

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the

team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes.

To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except

Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10

in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting the playoffs and the finals?

BTW,while Shaq's scoring was down in the Finals, he still

averaged 18PPG and 10RPG in the playoffs

Miami had three players average double-digits in points in entire 2006 playoffs. Cleveland had four guys average double-digit points in 2007 playoffs.

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the

team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes.

To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except

Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10

in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting the playoffs and the finals?

BTW,while Shaq's scoring was down in the Finals, he still

averaged 18PPG and 10RPG in the playoffs

Miami had three players average double-digits in points in entire 2006 playoffs. Cleveland had four guys average double-digit points in 2007 playoffs.

Heat top 4 scorers outside of Wade in 2006 Playoffs: 49.6 PPG, 24.8RPG, 8.8 APG,

Cavs top 4 scorers outside of LeBron in 2007 Playoffs: 44.7 PPG, 22.2 RPG, 5.9 APG,

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Eddie Jones wasn't on the Heat for '06 playoffs. Shaq was on the decline and his free throws were Dallas's best defense. Gary Payton was like 105 years old. Antoine was...'toine. The second best player on the team was Alonzo, but he scored maybe 8 points a game but had crazy blocks on defense. The second best shooter on the

team was probably James Posey. You're right, James Posey is so much better than Larry Hughes.

To say the Mavs collapsed is another :censored:ty argument that tries to downgrade Wade's effort.

Shaq had 20PPG and 9RPG. Alonzo was not the 2nd best player on the team. Nobody else on the 2007 cavs except

Lebron averaged 15PPG, so yes, that roster was awful.

Talking about the Finals. Shaq didn't average 20 PPG in the 2006 Finals, unless you're creating you're own box score. It's tough to average 20 PPG in a series when you don't score 20 points in any game, and score less than 10

in two of them.

So your definition of best player includes tossing out the regular season and just counting the playoffs and the finals?

BTW,while Shaq's scoring was down in the Finals, he still

averaged 18PPG and 10RPG in the playoffs

Miami had three players average double-digits in points in entire 2006 playoffs. Cleveland had four guys average double-digit points in 2007 playoffs.

Heat top 4 scorers outside of Wade in 2006 Playoffs: 49.6 PPG, 24.8RPG, 8.8 APG,

Cavs top 4 scorers outside of LeBron in 2007 Playoffs: 44.7 PPG, 22.2 RPG, 5.9 APG,

DAMN YOU :D

Also, LeBron is better than Durant, as this season LeBron scores more, rebounds more, has more assists, and more steals and better FG% and 3P%. He also has 2 more MVP's

OK. Last season Durant was better than LeBron for most of those categories. Over 82 games. We'll see how it progresses as the season goes on. And the MVP count doesn't really matter unless Durant was drafted in 2003.

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The Heat would not have gone to the Finals without Shaq.

And the Cavs would not have gone to the Finals without Zydrunas Illgauskas...

:D

I kid, I kid...

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WSU, if Wade is a better defender, why has LeBron made 1st team all defense the past 3 seasons, and Wade never has?

Also, LeBron's defense on Derrick Rose was a huge reason the Heat beat the Bulls in last seasons playoffs

Stop arguing for D-Wade, he's not better than LeBron

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WSU, if Wade is a better defender, why has LeBron made 1st team all defense the past 3 seasons, and Wade never has?

Also, LeBron's defense on Derrick Rose was a huge reason the Heat beat the Bulls in last seasons playoffs

Stop arguing for D-Wade, he's not better than LeBron

Yeah, ok. LeBron is awesome, heard it.

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STFU CS85, were having a discussion, if you dont want to be a part of it or don't liek what were talking about, dont post

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