my Brewers concept

[Gothamite]

Yeah, we really need an "ignore" feature. The funny thing is that I like a lot of Shark's designs, and used to champion him on the other boards, but I grow weary of his personal insults because I don't agree with him on an issue or two.

Mil, by your logic there isn't a single scheme that wouldn't have a visual connection to the city. You could write it backwords and in cyrillic, but so long as it says "Brewers" it will be perfect for Milwaukee. The thing I liked about the Germanic lettering is that it linked visually with so many old buildings downtown, but we can agree to disagree on that.

What I really hate about the current wordmark (besides banishing the city to a tiny sleeve patch) is the fact that it's unbalanced. It's overly weighted to the left, and that hole in the "B" looks awkward. Ironically, the Helena Brewers use this typeface better - they fill the hole with the barley sprig, and it works much, much better.

I say it's unbalanced because they can't put it on the logo without tilting it. That's not a sign of a good design, in my opinion, if you have to rotate the team name to make it fit on your primary logo.

[eqtmgr]

Speaking as someone who used to work in the Brewers' organization, I must say that the current identity is very good. I know the guys that do all of their uni repair and sewing in the MKE and since I've seen them up close and personal, I must say that I really like them. Although I, like most Brewer fans, yearn for the old glove logo, the current look is great. I really like all of the concepts that ya'll did.

BTW, when they changed from the glove after the '93 season to that hidious "MB" gimmic with the forest green, I WAS PISSED!!! Suffice it to say that the players did not like it either. The unis that they were wearing in the early 90's were good for it's time.

Oh and just to quell your thoughts, I was the clubbie for their AAA affiliate here in New Orleans, the Zephyrs, in 1993 and 1994.

[MilTownMVP]

Mil, by your logic there isn't a single scheme that wouldn't have a visual connection to the city. You could write it backwords and in cyrillic, but so long as it says "Brewers" it will be perfect for Milwaukee. The thing I liked about the Germanic lettering is that it linked visually with so many old buildings downtown, but we can agree to disagree on that.

What I really hate about the current wordmark (besides banishing the city to a tiny sleeve patch) is the fact that it's unbalanced. It's overly weighted to the left, and that hole in the "B" looks awkward. Ironically, the Helena Brewers use this typeface better - they fill the hole with the barley sprig, and it works much, much better.

I say it's unbalanced because they can't put it on the logo without tilting it. That's not a sign of a good design, in my opinion, if you have to rotate the team name to make it fit on your primary logo.

Well I'd thought you'd have seen that I took care of the city-on-road problem with my concept. I agree, that should be changed for real, but why throw away a prefectly good design just because of that?

[Gothamite]

If it was a perfectly good design, I'd agree.

What do you think about my analysis of the unbalanced wordmark and the bulls-eye space?

[Discrim]

eh...what the hell, everybody else's chimed in with their renderings.

i add red cus i decided to do something different. i keep lettering blue cus i've seen numerous uniforms that have blue hat/red lettering, but never a red hat/blue lettering combo.

wendel young must die

[Moser316]

It's supposed to be weighted to one side, in order to incorporate the number into the left front panel of the jersey.

And one thing I've noticed that's been lost in this whole debate is the connection of the Brewers' design scheme from 1978-93 to the city of Milwaukee. You've discussed at great length how the 1994-99 scheme incorporates itself with Milwaukee (Germanic typeface, brewing industry) and have asked us how the current scheme incorporates itself with the city (which has already been answered by several people as well). But what's been lost here is: Does the 1978-93 logo/color scheme really integrate itself better with the city than what they already have? Forget about the association with what the Brewers did on the baseball field during those years, do they have any correlation with Milwaukee from a pure design standpoint? My answer is "No", because

1) The ball-in-glove logo is clearly a product of the era in which it was designed and would look dated by today's standards. Did you see the original prototype for the logo on OnMilwaukee.com? The ball-in-glove originally had a red heart surrounding it. Thankfully it never made it on to the field, but would you feel the same way about the logo if it ever did?

2) Blue and Gold are not the true Brewers colors by your definition, Navy and Red are. The color scheme used by the team from 1970-93 was a holdover from the old Seattle Pilots. Although most people wouldn't see the reference without some historical context and it is hardly ever acknowledged, it does exist.

3) The home "BREWERS" wordmark and the away script "Milwaukee" wordmark would definitely be considered generic by today's standards. The "Brewers" and "Milwaukee" script wordmarks (the latter of which really SHOULD be on the away jerseys) that they currently use are a helluva lot more visually unique than the stock typefaces used by the Brewers back in the day.

4) Cartoon logos are hardly EVER a good idea unless you can update them to the point where they'd be clean enough to use with a team's visual identity (like the Reds and Padres have done) and then use them as minimally as possible (i.e. the Swinging Friar appears only on the Padres alternate jerseys).

I await your rebuttal, sir

[Gothamite]

You raise some good points.

I never said that the logo had to have a connection with the city (only that my personal favorite does), but people defending the current scheme have been doing with the odd justification that it does reflect the City of Milwaukee. As I mentioned, the scheme I preferred was visually suggested by the city, but none of the others before or since have.

1) I haven't seen the prototype, but that's really not relevant. I don't want the paw back, but the vast majority of Brewers fans do. That's why I used it my concept.

2) Again, I would prefer the Brewers adopt my #2 concept, which is a 1940s throwback and incorporates the traditional Brewers colors of navy and red. But since the whole point behind this was to reintroduce the paw logo, I think we're stuck with the color scheme. I've tried playing with the colors, but the rounded logo really needs bright, optimistic colors.

3) Okay, you've got me on the home typeface. It's boring. I should come up with a new one. The road script may be generic, but the road script wasn't. I don't think the road script is any less unique than the current one. Besides, the Orioles, Dodgers, Indians, Yankees, Royals and A's are all very successful with team or city name marks that are clean and classic.

4) I would use the Beer Barrel Man exactly as the Reds have used the Running Man. I don't think the Padres use the Swinging Friar enough, as he only appears on the alternate. Still, he gets better treatment than Mr. Met. I also think Cleveland has had some success with a cartoon logo.

Discrim, I think your ideas are intriguing but as much as I'd like to see them add red I don't ever expect to see the True Blue Brew Crew use quite so much of it....

While I'm on it, what do you have against Koo-Aid? You from Jonestown? [/badjoke]

[Moser316]

While I'm on it, what do you have against Koo-Aid? You from Jonestown? [/badjoke]

It's sort of an inside joke around here, mostly having to do with the knee-jerk reaction by a lot of people that throwbacks (as a whole, not specifically) are better than any of the current uniforms...

[MilTownMVP]

If it was a perfectly good design, I'd agree.

What do you think about my analysis of the unbalanced wordmark and the bulls-eye space?

I may tweak my concept just a bit to see how it would look without the drop shadow once I get back home to see how it looks. I see your beef, but like someone else mentioned, it's unbalanced for a reason.

But as for the navy/red debate (I know I'm switchin' gears here), I understand the historical significance, but there's too many navy & red teams in baseball already (pro sports in general, really). Going back to the old blue & yellow would not only make them unique (they'd literally be the only team in sports with those colors), but those are the main colors on MIL's city flag. So even if they got those colors just because Bud Selig was too cheap (surprise surprise) to buy new unis, they do work if you're lookin' for a tie in to the city.

I'd like to see the glove back, but if they just changed what they have now to blue & yellow, I'd shut up...

[jonkj]

Shark, I like your design a lot. If the newer look is to be kept, they should definitely institute your revisions to them. Besides putting "Milwaukee" on the roads (which is a no-brainer, no matter what cap logo is used), I especially like the more traditional numbers and the new stirrups. Despite creativity points for the gold away design, I prefer your grays instead.

Thanks for the work.

[robbman21]

Just my two cents....but I wouldnt mind seeing the 'MB' logo brought back either as a BP cap or as a home alternate cap.I would prefer they updated it with a sharper font and with the newer colors,and also kept the current script and everything else about the unis the same.Like I said...just my two cents.

[Toodles1980]

Alright, my first post here. I would like to say that I like the design. I have heard a lot of people complain that the current design is clean and relates to the city. I would like to disagree with that, the current uniforms could be the Miller softball team, and they would have to change very little. The current design is, in my opinion, extremely generic. I really want to like the new design, I go to about 50 games a year, and love the Brewers, but I just can't get myself to like the uniforms. They are too bland, and I guess look like something more suitable for a beer league. The ball and glove, loved by some and reviled by others, is a unique design. You will never mistake it for a Miller ad, it is what it is. I think that is part of why people like it.

The only thing I would say about the design, Gothamite, is shrink the beer-barrel man, he may be a little large. Other than that I think they are good. Keep in mind I am not huge on the retro thing, but the Brewers are one of the few teams that I think could benefit from it. I will agree with Gothamite and say the best uni's were probably the gothic style ('96-'99), but those never caught on, probably because they immediately followed a long standing tradition (I know the MB Notre Dame thing came first, but I like to pretend that didn't happen).

Just my opinion.

[letterform]

I'm not a baseball fan and dont really know much about the brewers uniform history, but the glove is definately one of the most recognizable and well liked logo's in baseball. The fans love it and being that baseball is sooo traditional they should really reincorporate it. The new MB logo is a little generic. If it's not selling and has no tradition then what good reason is there for keeping it around?

As for the barrel, I'm generally not too wild about cartoony logo's but for some odd reason they work extremely well in baseball. The padres, orioles, and the barrel are some of the best in sports, true classics.

[sacker12]

For once, me and Shark actually agree on something. The Brewers looks better with that standard block number style.

[winters in buffalo]

I like beer.

[Moser316]

Alright, my first post here. I would like to say that I like the design. I have heard a lot of people complain that the current design is clean and relates to the city. I would like to disagree with that, the current uniforms could be the Miller softball team, and they would have to change very little. The current design is, in my opinion, extremely generic. I really want to like the new design, I go to about 50 games a year, and love the Brewers, but I just can't get myself to like the uniforms. They are too bland, and I guess look like something more suitable for a beer league. The ball and glove, loved by some and reviled by others, is a unique design. You will never mistake it for a Miller ad, it is what it is. I think that is part of why people like it.

The only thing I would say about the design, Gothamite, is shrink the beer-barrel man, he may be a little large. Other than that I think they are good. Keep in mind I am not huge on the retro thing, but the Brewers are one of the few teams that I think could benefit from it. I will agree with Gothamite and say the best uni's were probably the gothic style ('96-'99), but those never caught on, probably because they immediately followed a long standing tradition (I know the MB Notre Dame thing came first, but I like to pretend that didn't happen).

Just my opinion.

I think the current identity is something that has clearly struck a chord more with the younger fans (25-and-under) than the older ones who remember when the Brewers were a perennial contender. To be honest, I like the ball-in-glove logo and the current visual identity, but I like the ball-in-glove logo within the context of its time and I don't think it should be brought back in the future (at least with the current crop of players)...

[Gothamite]

I don't know about that. In Milwaukee I still see a lot of younger people in ball-and-glove Brewers caps. It doesn't hurt that they're also stylish outside of the baseball context, but still.

I don't know that anyone could be as devoted to the current scheme as so many fans are to the ball-and-glove. I suspect that modern fans like it just because it's what they've got. For some reason, fans of the glove are passionate about it (much more than fans of either of my preferred schemes).

I think the ball-and-glove is like the San Diego Chargers' collegiate blue uniforms. The fans want them back, by any measure, they sell well, all the polls reflect a desire to return to them, but management insists on keeping their current scheme with a frankly odd stubborn streak.

[Braden]

how about trying to make the old MB glove in the new colours and make it an alt logo to use on the sleeves, then bust out the retro for the alt. uniform?

A bit of comprimise maybe?

[gosioux76]

how about trying to make the old MB glove in the new colours and make it an alt logo to use on the sleeves, then bust out the retro for the alt. uniform?

A bit of comprimise maybe?

I like this idea

[Gothamite]

There has been some talk of this, although I don't know how likely it is they will do it.

I'm not a big fan of the glove in the new colors:

I think the rounded contours really need the bright, optimistic royal and gold.