Augusta National admits first two female members

[bosrs1]

Nobody ever responded to the Curves comment. Why is it ok for a large corporation like Curves to discriminate against men?

Because you got about 20 other gyms you can go to and the reason its female only is to the provide a counter product to regular gyms of which the majority of members are guys.

Whether or not its right is something that can be debated, but its not something I care a great deal about, and I don't think its harming society.

You can golf at other places other than Augusta too. Maybe the fact that Augusta was a "boys club" was one of their "selling points". I use quotes there because obviously if that were the case it'd be very very minor compared to "having an aircraft carrier full of money" the main one.

Yeah but how many of those places can compare to the quality and prestige of Augusta? It could be argued none. They present a unique product of which there is no real substitue for.

People don't care about some local private club because those can be a dime a dozen. Augusta is not. That's why they get treated differently.

Let's see, Pebble Beach, Spyglass, the Olympic Club, Torrey Pines, Saint Andrews, Carnoustie, I can keep listing clubs but you get the point. Augusta is just one club among many that are all equally prestigious (and many I'd argue are even more prestigious than Augusta. And there would have been a simple substitute should women have wanted to create one.

Just like the Boy Scouts, Augusta is a private club that was under no obligation to admit women if they did not want to. (Mind you this is not an endorsement of their position, just their right to have their position). And as for the argument that the PGA should not have associated with a club that was discriminatory, last I checked there are no women on the PGA tour, and for a very long time the PGA did not admit blacks as members either (to say nothing of every other major sports league out there). Sports leagues are divided by sex and inherently discriminatory as well and no one seems to have a problem with it.

[njmeadowlanders]

Just FYI, Pebble Beach, Spyglass, Torrey Pines, and Carnoustie are public courses, whereas Augusta and the Olympic Club are.

[bosrs1]

Just FYI, Pebble Beach, Spyglass, Torrey Pines, and Carnoustie are public courses, whereas Augusta and the Olympic Club are.

True, point is there are plenty of courses and clubs just as nice as Augusta that females can become members of. Public and private.

[Gothamite]

With the power and prestige of Augusta National? Those are very few and far between.

[pmoehrin]

With the power and prestige of Augusta National? Those are very few and far between.

There are golf courses that could be argued as being as good as Augusta if your looking at it strictly from an architecture and scenery point of view.

In terms of prestige though? Maybe Pine Valley and St. Andrew's with the key word being maybe. I don't you can get any higher then Augusta.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

The issue is two-fold:

1. Should a major club discriminate against women? In my view, I don't care.

2. Should the PGA endorse this discrimination by holding a major event at said club? No, absolutely not.

Augusta National's exclusion of women (until recently) was only ever relevant in relation to it being the site of a major golf event. If you're going to host an event of that magnitude, there's a social responsibility -- like it or not -- that comes with it.

[waltere]

Minor point, but the PGA don't actually run the Masters, Augusta National itself does.

[dfwabel]

Minor point, but the PGA don't actually run the Masters, Augusta National itself does.

Since there is little golf talk here, please remember the following:

There is the PGA of America, who ran the PGA Championship two weeks ago and the is the PGA Tour, a separate organization.

The PGA Tour keeps The Masters as an event for their money list and five year, PGA Tour exemption for the winner, even though they put in place a non-discriminatory policy for their events as far back as 1990.

Also remember that Augusta National ran a year without commercials and that they make so much revenue off tickets and merchandise, which is vastly under-priced, that they pay for the tournament itself before the third round.

Out of the mews from yesterday, I only came to the conclusion that their dues really are not that high since Condi Rice does not have the wealth the other woman has.

[Saintsfan]

Minor point, but the PGA don't actually run the Masters, Augusta National itself does.

Since there is little golf talk here, please remember the following:

There is the PGA of America, who ran the PGA Championship two weeks ago and the is the PGA Tour, a separate organization.

The PGA Tour keeps The Masters as an event for their money list and five year, PGA Tour exemption for the winner, even though they put in place a non-discriminatory policy for their events as far back as 1990.

Also remember that Augusta National ran a year without commercials and that they make so much revenue off tickets and merchandise, which is vastly under-priced, that they pay for the tournament itself before the third round.

Out of the mews from yesterday, I only came to the conclusion that their dues really are not that high since Condi Rice does not have the wealth the other woman has.

And the USGA which runs the US Open.

The state of 'major' as far as golf is concerned is a relatively unofficial one, am even removing the PGA Tour exemption would not make the Masters any less of a major, as tha status has as much to do with history and prestige as anything else.

[Cola]

I am appalled at some of the comments here...and shows how weak some people can be and why this world is getting worse by the year.

Augusta National had no reason to fold into the pressure they have received over these years. No reason at all. It is a private club and should be ran however it deems necessary- what anyone outside of it thinks is irrelevant. I'm sick of public organizations getting together and trying to push their agenda on everyone else. They ram it down your throat constantly until the person has to swallow.

Seeing a private organization cave in to public pressure on such a large issue kills me a bit inside. Shows me that before long, no one can really have what THEY want...it will always be molded by what they SHOULD want according to everyone else.

Do I get pissed that Shapes Fitness won't allow male members to join their gym? No, because there are other places to work out.

If Augusta National was some podunk 9 hole course in Augusta (and believe me, they exist) that had this rule...no one would care. However, Augusta National is something great, something huge, and something special. There are people in this world who will always want to tear something like that down or bring it back down so it is "fair". If I learned anything from my parents, it was one thing; LIFE IS NOT FAIR.

Sorry for the rant, but I'm from the area, this pisses me off and is coming to someone that appreciates and respects 1 of the women who was admitted to extreme levels. Darla Moore is one of the largest contributors to the University of South Carolina and my diploma has her name on it. However, if she wishes to play golf...I would have encouraged her to join one of the other many fine courses South Carolina has to offer. Hell, some people won't even agree that Augusta National is the nicest golf course in the area- some experts, analysts, and writers would say Mount Vintage takes that!

[Gothamite]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

[Cola]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

[RedSox44]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

Holy hell this viewpoint is horrific. Are you calling every person who stands up for equality "weak"?

[OnWis97]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

Holy hell this viewpoint is horrific. Are you calling every person who stands up for equality "weak"?

First off, do we even know that they "caved"? The height of the Burk controversy was several years ago. Maybe it's just what they wanted to do.

Also, I am curious, which "caving" was worse? This or letting in blacks in 1990? Weak mindedness, take 2.

[Cola]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

Holy hell this viewpoint is horrific. Are you calling every person who stands up for equality "weak"?

Augusta National was not protesting against equality. Augusta National never wanted to be in the spotlight over their own personal guidelines for membership admittance. They were brought into it by these people who go overboard and yes, with one of them being "equality." You do know there is a point where pushing for "equality" goes past the right thing to do...and becomes more of that organization just taking all they can and showing their power.

You twisted my words (good job, by the way), but an average ability in reading comprehension will still show that the "weak" I am referring to are those that don't have a backbone to stand up for what they believe in WHEN ATTACKED. Of course, you might say "well, there are many people who believed in the idea of equality and women's rights." Well, Augusta National was never preventing them from voting, showing their faces in public, driving a vehicle, or even playing golf. Augusta National never went after women or any special interest group. They came after Augusta National and that is where the difference remains. Augusta National fought the battle as long as they could and while this announcement comes at an odd time- I would guarantee it would never have occurred had it not been started.

[RedSox44]

Equality is always the right thing to do, in every aspect of society. Sorry, bud.

[Cola]

Equality is always the right thing to do, in every aspect of society. Sorry, bud.

We will just have to agree to disagree, which I prefer anyhow...because I know Rice and Moore won't be teeing off from the white boxes. Equality and all, ya know.

[rams80]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

Holy hell this viewpoint is horrific. Are you calling every person who stands up for equality "weak"?

Augusta National was not protesting against equality. Augusta National never wanted to be in the spotlight over their own personal guidelines for membership admittance. They were brought into it by these people who go overboard and yes, with one of them being "equality." You do know there is a point where pushing for "equality" goes past the right thing to do...and becomes more of that organization just taking all they can and showing their power.

Then they probably shouldn't have started hosting a major golf tournament.

[Gothamite]

Exactly. Augusta National asked for the attention. They begged for it.

The notion that people are "weak" for asking that a powerful, high-profile institution treat black people and women as equal human beings is an interesting point of view.

[OnWis97]

I really hope you're not suggesting that the people who disagree with you are the "weak" ones.

I don't think anyone's denying that Augusta National has the legal right to discriminate. But that legal right does not insulate them in any way from very legitimate criticism when they choose to exercise it.

Yes, I am. I am suggesting that anyone who feels like this decision is "long overdue" is weak and a problem in this country. Instead of standing up for what they believe in and knowing it is the right thing, they cave in to whatever pressure comes from XYZ organization pushing their agenda because "it is fair".

People who criticize them for making decisions as a private organization are part of the problem and have no business in theirs.

Holy hell this viewpoint is horrific. Are you calling every person who stands up for equality "weak"?

Augusta National was not protesting against equality. Augusta National never wanted to be in the spotlight over their own personal guidelines for membership admittance. They were brought into it by these people who go overboard and yes, with one of them being "equality." You do know there is a point where pushing for "equality" goes past the right thing to do...and becomes more of that organization just taking all they can and showing their power.

You twisted my words (good job, by the way), but an average ability in reading comprehension will still show that the "weak" I am referring to are those that don't have a backbone to stand up for what they believe in WHEN ATTACKED. Of course, you might say "well, there are many people who believed in the idea of equality and women's rights." Well, Augusta National was never preventing them from voting, showing their faces in public, driving a vehicle, or even playing golf. Augusta National never went after women or any special interest group. They came after Augusta National and that is where the difference remains. Augusta National fought the battle as long as they could and while this announcement comes at an odd time- I would guarantee it would never have occurred had it not been started.

Well if you guarantee, 'nuff said. I am still curious whether you were as upset in 1990 when they caved to the pressure from the weak-minded and let in blacks.