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2012-13 MLB Off-Season Thread


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I just dug up a 2012/2013 Miami Marlins Calendar that my friend gave me this summer from his trip to Miami. I just thought I'd summarize the stars that they had featured on each month.

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Mr. April 2012, Logan Morrisson - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. May 2012, Anibal Sanchez

Mr. June 2012, Ricky Nolasco - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. July 2012, Gaby Sanchez

Mr. August 2012, Emilio Bonifacio

Mr. September 2012, John Buck

Mr. October 2012, Omar Infante

Mr. November 2012, Heath Bell

Mr. December 2012, Hanley Ramirez

Mr. January 2013, Mark Buehrle

Mr. February 2013, Giancarlo Stanton - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. March 2013, Jose Reyes

Mr. April 2013, Josh Johnson

Out of THIRTEEN stars that they had on their calendar, only THREE are still on the team and the Calendar is just 2/3 completed. Oh those MarLOLins...

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It's weird knowing that we're a handful of months from spring training and I am secure in the knowledge that the Cubs are going to have the exact...same...season they had last year. A middling, young squad that is trying to figure out who's actually good and selling bad contracts for cheap and eating salaries.

And yet I'm somewhat comfortable with it, if this is the price for building something tangible and competitive in 2014. That being said, another year of basically not watching baseball while listening to idiot fans cry about not winning the world series is going to be mind-numbing and unpleasant.

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Mets beat writer Eddie Coleman just reported on WFAN radio (at 2 a.m) that the Mets and David Wright have agreed to a long-term contract extension. No numbers yet, but is said to be the largest contract in Mets history. There was reports of a $140 million offer yesterday.

Between this and the Willie Randolph firing a couple of years ago, it pays to be an insomniac Mets fan.

The Daily News says it's a 7-year, $122 million extension. If you count the $16 million he was due in 2013 (the AP says that number hasn't changed in the new contract), it's an 8-year, $138 million deal.

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Dogs are dogs, if you teach a Pit Bull to be vicious he will be if you teach him to be a pet he will be a pet. It is terrible how they take bad owners and blame the dog breed.

I just dug up a 2012/2013 Miami Marlins Calendar that my friend gave me this summer from his trip to Miami. I just thought I'd summarize the stars that they had featured on each month.

Photoon2012-11-30at02142.jpg

Mr. April 2012, Logan Morrisson - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. May 2012, Anibal Sanchez

Mr. June 2012, Ricky Nolasco - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. July 2012, Gaby Sanchez

Mr. August 2012, Emilio Bonifacio

Mr. September 2012, John Buck

Mr. October 2012, Omar Infante

Mr. November 2012, Heath Bell

Mr. December 2012, Hanley Ramirez

Mr. January 2013, Mark Buehrle

Mr. February 2013, Giancarlo Stanton - STILL ON THE MARLINS

Mr. March 2013, Jose Reyes

Mr. April 2013, Josh Johnson

Out of THIRTEEN stars that they had on their calendar, only THREE are still on the team and the Calendar is just 2/3 completed. Oh those MarLOLins...

Loria is sucha con man

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It's weird knowing that we're a handful of months from spring training and I am secure in the knowledge that the Cubs are going to have the exact...same...season they had last year. A middling, young squad that is trying to figure out who's actually good and selling bad contracts for cheap and eating salaries.

And yet I'm somewhat comfortable with it, if this is the price for building something tangible and competitive in 2014. That being said, another year of basically not watching baseball while listening to idiot fans cry about not winning the world series is going to be mind-numbing and unpleasant.

At least you are reasonable about it. I don't follow the Cubs at all, but I did hear the media crying about their horrible season and questioning Theo. First off, I don't think he is any genius and wouldn't say definitively that he will turn the Cubs into a regular contender. That aside, it was his first friggin year! The team sucked the year before, and he had to do the necessary blood-letting rather than just signing a couple of big free agents and trying to slap-dash a wildcard run. At least from what they did last year, I would have no problem with that if I were a Cubs fan. However, predictably lots of the media complained about the moves, and idiot fans complained it was one more year without a championship, as if any move (or any half dozen moves) could have been made the last offseason to bring them a title.

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It's weird knowing that we're a handful of months from spring training and I am secure in the knowledge that the Cubs are going to have the exact...same...season they had last year. A middling, young squad that is trying to figure out who's actually good and selling bad contracts for cheap and eating salaries.

And yet I'm somewhat comfortable with it, if this is the price for building something tangible and competitive in 2014. That being said, another year of basically not watching baseball while listening to idiot fans cry about not winning the world series is going to be mind-numbing and unpleasant.

At least you are reasonable about it. I don't follow the Cubs at all, but I did hear the media crying about their horrible season and questioning Theo. First off, I don't think he is any genius and wouldn't say definitively that he will turn the Cubs into a regular contender. That aside, it was his first friggin year! The team sucked the year before, and he had to do the necessary blood-letting rather than just signing a couple of big free agents and trying to slap-dash a wildcard run. At least from what they did last year, I would have no problem with that if I were a Cubs fan. However, predictably lots of the media complained about the moves, and idiot fans complained it was one more year without a championship, as if any move (or any half dozen moves) could have been made the last offseason to bring them a title.

I don't buy into Theo being a baseball genius, but I don't think he's half bad. He realizes what a mess of :censored: he inherited and in so many words explained to the city that in order to rebuild this team it's going to take more than just one signing, or one trade. This was a franchise reckoning that will necessitate at LEAST 2 seasons of abhorrent and unwatchable baseball, and the lack of perspective and scope by a lot of Chicago fans makes me embarrassed to be one. The amount of calls to local talk radio, various forum posts from around the web, etc, where Cubs fans shout, "FIRE THEO" because he didn't win a world series with Darwin Barney and the ghost of Alfonso Soriano makes me want to set my hair on fire.

Fellow Cubs fans: Shut up. If you can't see the forest through the trees, then you either don't know how baseball works or you have the impatience of a two year old. Making our whole fanbase look stupid with this crap.

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Its probably many of the same people that are still blaming Steve Bartman for the Cubs not making it to the '03 World Series, but giving a free pass to Alex Gonzalez, because obviously Barmtan interfering on that foul ball caused Gonzalez to botch that routine double play.

The most surprising thing most Cub fans could say at this point is say if the team isn't good next year I'm not showing up. If fans are just going to come out in droves to see a team as bad as the Cubs were last year, in my opinion they get what they deserve. Don't blame the team because you have no standards as to what you'll put up with. And that's exactly what I think alot of Cub fans are doing.

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It's weird knowing that we're a handful of months from spring training and I am secure in the knowledge that the Cubs are going to have the exact...same...season they had last year. A middling, young squad that is trying to figure out who's actually good and selling bad contracts for cheap and eating salaries.

And yet I'm somewhat comfortable with it, if this is the price for building something tangible and competitive in 2014. That being said, another year of basically not watching baseball while listening to idiot fans cry about not winning the world series is going to be mind-numbing and unpleasant.

At least you are reasonable about it. I don't follow the Cubs at all, but I did hear the media crying about their horrible season and questioning Theo. First off, I don't think he is any genius and wouldn't say definitively that he will turn the Cubs into a regular contender. That aside, it was his first friggin year! The team sucked the year before, and he had to do the necessary blood-letting rather than just signing a couple of big free agents and trying to slap-dash a wildcard run. At least from what they did last year, I would have no problem with that if I were a Cubs fan. However, predictably lots of the media complained about the moves, and idiot fans complained it was one more year without a championship, as if any move (or any half dozen moves) could have been made the last offseason to bring them a title.

I think everyone can agree that the most annoying people are the ones that expect change to happen overnight. No matter the sport, it's impossible to rebuild something overnight. I've been hearing the same thing here from the people that wanted to fire Tim Beckman after only this season. A lot of people (and they're usually the most vocal ones) can't grasp that it usually gets worse before it gets better. Like both of you, I don't think Epstein is a baseball genius, but I do think he's smart enough to turn the Cubs into a contender given enough time. I know they'll be bad next year and I'm just happy that Epstein hasn't given in and made any big moves too early yet. We'll see how he does when the time comes to actually make those moves.

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If fans are just going to come out in droves to see a team as bad as the Cubs were last year, in my opinion they get what they deserve.

Oh, no, this is so goddamn stupid. Show me how drastically reducing revenue makes a team better. And "oh noes, we need to inspire them to come back" is not an answer.

The problem is that Cubs fans are going to get crapped on either way. If they stop going, they're bad fans because they gave up on their team at its nadir. If they keep going, they're bad fans because they don't demand a winner. Much like the guys on the field, we can't win either!

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If fans are just going to come out in droves to see a team as bad as the Cubs were last year, in my opinion they get what they deserve.

Oh, no, this is so goddamn stupid. Show me how drastically reducing revenue makes a team better. And "oh noes, we need to inspire them to come back" is not an answer.

The problem is that Cubs fans are going to get crapped on either way. If they stop going, they're bad fans because they gave up on their team at its nadir. If they keep going, they're bad fans because they don't demand a winner. Much like the guys on the field, we can't win either!

I don't look at it as a revenue issue, its a just a logic issue. If you go to a restaurant and they serve you bad food, you don't go back. You don't keep returning hoping that your added dollars will eventually improve the quality of the restaurant. No amount of money will overcome bad management. As for the revenue issue the Cubs have plenty of resources at their disposal to be a winning team year in and year out as does virtually every other MLB team at this point. The luxury tax and smarter spending has done alot to change that. And if they aren't its because of their own stupidity and going to games or not going to games isn't going to change that. It would be nice if fan loyalty had that much effect on wins and losses but it doesn't.

As people knocking fans I myself would never knock a teams fanbase for not showing up to games when they are bad. I didn't knock Blackhawk fans when they stopped showing up after it became apparent they weren't going to win as long as Dollar Bill owned the franchise and didn't call them fair weather when they came back after he died. Everyone has different opinions on how fans go to games, but that's mine and its not going to change.

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Tommy Hanson has just been traded to the Angels for Jordan Walden.

In a way its a my problem for your problem type of deal. Both guys came out as highly touted prospects but have since been derailed by injuries, so it could be classified as my injury plagued pitcher for your injury plagued pitcher. I should say its more a depth issue trade though. Braves have enough starting pitching and the Angels are pretty well set in terms of short relief. Hopefully both guys can get their careers back on track.

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I don't look at it as a revenue issue, its a just a logic issue. If you go to a restaurant and they serve you bad food, you don't go back. You don't keep returning hoping that your added dollars will eventually improve the quality of the restaurant.

Okay, but this analogy supposes that the Cubs have provided a poor gameday experience. At least in the short term, it's not like a Cubs game has been a miserable, categorically unpleasant experience. It's baseball on a summer day in a cool neighborhood, and they've been on-and-off decent on the field (four playoff berths, I think like six or seven winning seasons?) over the last 15 years. To hear it from some people, they're the Pirates playing in the Metrodome or something. People want to believe they can "send a message" so they can have some positive sense of agency over their team, when really, no good ultimately comes of staying home.

As for the revenue issue the Cubs have plenty of resources at their disposal to be a winning team year in and year out as does virtually every other MLB team at this point.

False, the owners are broke.

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I don't look at it as a revenue issue, its a just a logic issue. If you go to a restaurant and they serve you bad food, you don't go back. You don't keep returning hoping that your added dollars will eventually improve the quality of the restaurant.

Okay, but this analogy supposes that the Cubs have provided a poor gameday experience. At least in the short term, it's not like a Cubs game has been a miserable, categorically unpleasant experience. It's baseball on a summer day in a cool neighborhood, and they've been on-and-off decent on the field (four playoff berths, I think like six or seven winning seasons?) over the last 15 years. To hear it from some people, they're the Pirates playing in the Metrodome or something. People want to believe they can "send a message" so they can have some positive sense of agency over their team, when really, no good ultimately comes of staying home.

As for the revenue issue the Cubs have plenty of resources at their disposal to be a winning team year in and year out as does virtually every other MLB team at this point.

False, the owners are broke.

If people want to go to a ball game just to spend a night or a day out and don't really care about the quality of the team on the field, just so long as its a major league team, or if you just want to see Wrigley Field that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. But that laid back attitude is not the mentality most fans are coming to the ballpark with. If they did, sports talk radio would be what it is today.

The main idea behind it people like that are the number one reason I would why baseball is able to drive up prices the way they are. If your going to have the attitude of I'm going to the game no matter what, teams are going to take advantage of that and they have. If we were a less sports obsessed culture guarantee you we would not be seeing as many publicly financed stadiums.

In terms of not showing up making the team better. I don't think it makes much of a difference either way. You have good management in charge you will win and you don't you will lose. Revenue streams do matter, but I think the whole big market/small market era of baseball by in large is over. I don't think the size of your market matters nearly as much as it did 10 years ago. Teams like the Pirates, Orioles, Rays and Brewers are able to field competitive teams year in and year out and hold on to their star guys. And I do think your getting back to that how well your team is run being the number one determining factor in your place in the standings, as opposed to how good are you at throwing money at whatever problems come up.

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I don't look at it as a revenue issue, its a just a logic issue. If you go to a restaurant and they serve you bad food, you don't go back. You don't keep returning hoping that your added dollars will eventually improve the quality of the restaurant.

Okay, but this analogy supposes that the Cubs have provided a poor gameday experience. At least in the short term, it's not like a Cubs game has been a miserable, categorically unpleasant experience. It's baseball on a summer day in a cool neighborhood, and they've been on-and-off decent on the field (four playoff berths, I think like six or seven winning seasons?) over the last 15 years. To hear it from some people, they're the Pirates playing in the Metrodome or something. People want to believe they can "send a message" so they can have some positive sense of agency over their team, when really, no good ultimately comes of staying home.

As for the revenue issue the Cubs have plenty of resources at their disposal to be a winning team year in and year out as does virtually every other MLB team at this point.

False, the owners are broke.

If people want to go to a ball game just to spend a night or a day out and don't really care about the quality of the team on the field, just so long as its a major league team, or if you just want to see Wrigley Field that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. But that laid back attitude is not the mentality most fans are coming to the ballpark with.

Really? I would postulate that the red-hot-poker-up-the-ass "I DEMAND RESULTS OR I AM GOING TO LOSE MY CRAP OVER BASEBALL" is actually the minority, and most people just go to ballgames--on the north side and elsewhere--because they like baseball and like their team. People don't put as much thought into this crap as we go. No one really cares about organizational health; most people in the big picture probably can't even tell you where their team's AAA team is.

Also, to elaborate on revenue streams, the Cubs are suffering in the broadcast department because they inherited contracts with WGN that were just about nominally shuffling money between Tribune divisions, leaving the team with TV/radio rights fathoms below fair market value. So while the Cubs as a division of Tribune Broadcasting were a license to print money, as an independent entity under these old terms, they're screwed.

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As for the revenue issue the Cubs have plenty of resources at their disposal to be a winning team year in and year out as does virtually every other MLB team at this point.

False, the owners are broke.

Ask Big Daddy Ricketts for another loan. Or did he piss away ALL of his fortune on Karl Rove et. al.?

On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said:
You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now.
On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said:
Today, we are all otaku.

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POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010

The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy)

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yes, but starting pitcher is more valuable than a relief pitcher.

True. It is worth pointing out, however, that Tommy Hanson's delivery is just begging for his arm to explode. I wonder if this also signals belief within the Angels organization that they won't be able to retain Greinke.

Could be but I think its more of an insurance option then anything else.

I can't imagine Hanson's trade value being that high. I think alot of teams looked at what happened with the Ubaldo Jimenez trade and have really gotten cold feet to the idea of trading for pitchers with injury problems, even with young arms.

I don't think many people out there are evaluating Tommy Hanson as much more then your average major league starter at this point, which is shame considering how good he looked coming out of the gate. I thought he was going to be an all-star pitcher for years to come. Now I'm doubt he will ever even make a team. Even if he manages to stay healthy, I don't think you will see him go back to being the Tommy Hanson that we saw when he first broke into the league.

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