2013 Hockey World Juniors

[The_Admiral]

But what makes new hockey players from Florida (and California and Texas, for that matter) inherently superior to new hockey players from, let's say Washington State, or Wisconsin, or Utah? Expanding anywhere naturally would've led to increased development, and since it's not like training is any more or less year-round from location to location (the way they get a jump in baseball or football), you're basically left arguing that Florida is growing some sort of athletic ubermenschen from which hockey is only now able to profit. I mean, I'm sure we could have increased the footprint of American participation without airlifting pro teams into places where they don't make any money and keep death-spiraling the entire league into lockouts.

[twi]

Don Cherry is a sad, sad individual. Predictable too.

Can't blame Canada's loss on the best players being in the NHL this season? Well then they obviously lost because they trained all the other guys anyway!

I love hockey, but I hate how birthplace and nationality means so much in the game still.

[The_Admiral]

Yeah, well, we have a saying around here: Get used to it, Hitler.

But no seriously, I am an American (Canadian ancestors, though!) and I am fully comfortable in the fact that hockey is Canada's game on loan to the world, and our stewardship in particular has been shoddy at best. I mean, yeah, it does get kind of annoying and pro-wrestling-y when birthplaces and nationalities are pigeonholed into favorites like The Moody Russian, The Flopping Swede, and my personal favorite, The Good Western Canadian Kid Who Plays The Game The Right Way, but the best you can do is have fun with it and hope that there will be more trope-subverters (Datsyuk) than trope-subscribers (the Sedins).

USA/Canada is the most b.s. rivalry because the two talent pools are so miscegenated between Canadian developmental leagues and American professional leagues, plus the fact that if you're growing up in the hockey part of the US, there's more cultural commonality with Canada than there is with the old Confederacy or Arizona or what have you. I mean, kids from Mississauga against kids from Auburn Hills, we're not exactly talking about the Hutu and the Tutsi here.

[sportstar1212]

Congrats USA. You were right, Funky.

[Island_Style]

All three goals by Florida prospects. That makes me a little happy.

[NEW.ERA]

In this tournament I actually rarely cheer for Canada, I cheer for Flames prospects. But as a fan of the actual game, every other Country who gives Canada a run, meaning down the line we'll see a great German player or more Swiss talent.

I mean Hockey will probably always be dominated by 6 or 7 nations, but if those third tier counties start to show up, makes the game stronger.

Congrats to Americans. Earned this!

[Funky Bunky]

Congrats USA. You were right, Funky.

You just can't deny John Gibson. Dude set the WJC Save % record, I believe. As a Ducks fan, the only goalie prospects I might even think about taking over Gibson would be Lehner and Markstrom, and that's a big maybe. I love this guy.

[The_Admiral]

Yeah, the OHL All-Star Team really showed Canada who's boss.

[FGM13]

Well

:censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: Not even bronze.

And the Americans won. They deserved it though. Seth Jones is still a cocky little though.

[sportstar1212]

Congrats USA. You were right, Funky.

You just can't deny John Gibson. Dude set the WJC Save % record, I believe. As a Ducks fan, the only goalie prospects I might even think about taking over Gibson would be Lehner and Markstrom, and that's a big maybe. I love this guy.

I saw Gibson in the OHL earlier this year and I agree, he is one hell of a goalie. He's got a bright future, that's for sure.

[IceCap]

Congrats America. You really were the best team this tournament.

Don Cherry is a sad, sad individual. Predictable too.

What did he say? Honestly. My following of the WJC the last few years has been limited to actually watching the games. Not all the (kind of hard to understand) hype that goes along with them.

With Cherry, I'm sure he said something incredibly moronic and offensive. That's half of his shtick. And I won't argue about that half being tired and played out. The other half of his shtick (which is really like two quarters of it) aren't offensive at all actually. He seems to genuinely care about youth hockey and strengthening it (which as fans we should all be able to get behind) and he gives a lot (time and money) to the Canadian military. Which I see as, all in all, a good thing.

The man's an obnoxious, behind the times blowhard, but I don't think he's entirely worthy of condemnation.

I love hockey, but I hate how birthplace and nationality means so much in the game still.

To who? In terms of national teams, well of course most people will cheer for their country's team. Not sure what's so wrong with that. You're an American, I bet you cheer for team USA. No more wrong then me cheering for Canada.

If you're talking about scouting, ranking prospects, and judging players, I don't buy that birthplace is a big deal. Sure people whined about the Toronto Maple Leafs being overly Americanized the past two seasons, but people also whine about the Cleveland Browns not being "local" enough. So yeah, every fanbase, every community, every country has their brain-dead idiots. Trust me, most Canadian Leafs fans wouldn't care about the national makeup of the team's roster if they managed to win the Stanley Cup. I'd even say that attitude extends to Canadian fans of the other Canadian teams (save Montreal, but that's a whole other can of historical and cultural worms we probably shouldn't open in this thread).

The attitude I see as baffling when it comes to national origin is the one that some American fans (you, Elwood, as far as the CCSLC goes) have with this seeming annoyance at all things Canadian in hockey. I don't hate it, but I do find it odd. I could never be a die-hard baseball fan (I am) and yet be annoyed by America's presence in baseball. I mean I kind of agree with admiral on "USA vs Canada." We're not talking about two dynamically opposed cultures at odds on the ice here. I disagree with him because I still find it a fun rivalry. It's like a sibling rivalry. It's fun, and there are bragging rights up for grabs, but should anyone take it as an excuse to view the other side with distrust and loathing? F*** no.

But what makes new hockey players from Florida (and California and Texas, for that matter) inherently superior to new hockey players from, let's say Washington State, or Wisconsin, or Utah? Expanding anywhere naturally would've led to increased development, and since it's not like training is any more or less year-round from location to location (the way they get a jump in baseball or football), you're basically left arguing that Florida is growing some sort of athletic ubermenschen from which hockey is only now able to profit. I mean, I'm sure we could have increased the footprint of American participation without airlifting pro teams into places where they don't make any money and keep death-spiraling the entire league into lockouts.

It all comes down to the fact that Elwood's pretty much been a cheerleader for the NHL's actions for years now. He supported the idea behind southern expansion. Well Atlanta lost its second team to a smaller western Canadian town and the Coyotes' continued existence is literally killing a city. He talked down to people who generally criticized Bettman's performance as Commissioner. And yet most criticisms people had of Bettman have proven to be well-founded (great recommendation on the Bettman book btw, thanks) over the course of the Coyotes saga, the Thrashers' move north, and the current lockout. He claimed the Jets 2.0 would end up in Vegas even though they've basically become a licence to print money in Winnipeg.

Long story short he's a nob who in terms of hockey fandom is only a level above the guys on HF Boards who cheerlead for Bettman because they're Panthers fans.

[BigBubba]

Also I hope Don Cherry lives to see the day that Canada is as irrelevant to hockey as England is to soccer.

Bad news.

That's never going to happen

Also, it's worth noting that there will be a change in format next year. The top 4 teams in each group will advance, which will do away with byes.

[crashcarson15]

Then they should increase the number of teams going to the finals to 12. You could have a team that had just one shootout win in the group stage conceptually win the whole damn thing.