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The Reds went without outlines with their double-knit pullovers from 1972-1987, then added them for the last five years 1988-92. They also added a second red sleeve band and racing stripes down the pants legs. It was all unnecessary, in my opinion. The 1972-87 look was much better...

hi-res-2145891_display_image.jpg?13680725421783315_display_image.jpg?1321247026

it's night and day as to how much BETTER that uniform looks WITH the outlines.

Exactly. Why have a white and red hat, white and red stripes, but have the city name only red?

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the non-stroked version looks like a screen printed corporate softball uniform.

the white stroked version looks like a professional sports team.

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What rubs me wrong about the Dodgers' current uniforms is that, when they took away the white keyline, rather than switch to the thicker version of the MLB block font used by other teams with single-color numbers (like the Royals), they went with an unusually thin version. Every time I look at those jerseys, it seems like they stripped off the old two-color numbers, separated the layers, and sewed the blue layer back on.

Everything Roman has said about the White Sox is spot-on. I feel like the gradual downgrading of the uniform nicely parallels the operation of the franchise in recent years. As far as a team that should drop the keylines, the first one that came to my mind is the Angels.

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the non-stroked version looks like a screen printed corporate softball uniform.

the white stroked version looks like a professional sports team.

I have the exact opposite reaction. White keylines try too hard, are an unnecessary gewgaw and read more like corporate softball teams than a professional franchise.

For years, the Yankees refused to sell outfield ads in Yankee stadium. Those ads are bush league, they said. That's how I feel about the white keylines. Bush league, something that pro teams just don't need.

That HDTV has made them superfluous only solidifies my general feelings about them. They were ugly already, now they're ugly and unneeded.

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I think for some two color teams (Yankees, Dodgers, in the above case, reds) the white looks good. In some other cases, I think the team looks cluttered (Tigers). In some final cases, I think some teams should exchange white for their secondary color (Rays swap white for light blue).

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The Tigers are another offender. They have a great script, but it has two outlines on it, the outer which is white. I'm okay with a single colored outline, as long as it's an outline and not a "fill in the gaps" background patch. The white needs to go though. It clashes with the rest of the uniform, since they use the navy and orange caps on the road. Plus it has that "80s" style that they were moving away from when they ditched the racing stripes of their old Indians' style uniform.

What do you mean by this?

If you look at the phillies road jersey, their white outline is more of a background, as it fills in more space than just the area immediately around the letters. It's evident around the stars, especially to the left of the right one. I'll post a pic later but I'm in phone now.

This was actually a Majestic change, as their original russel jerseys had a "true" outline and not a lazily cut backing patch.

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the non-stroked version looks like a screen printed corporate softball uniform.

the white stroked version looks like a professional sports team.

I have the exact opposite reaction. White keylines try too hard, are an unnecessary gewgaw and read more like corporate softball teams than a professional franchise.

For years, the Yankees refused to sell outfield ads in Yankee stadium. Those ads are bush league, they said. That's how I feel about the white keylines. Bush league, something that pro teams just don't need.

I'm with Cole on this one. How does adding an extra layer of twill, an extra expense, become more bush league? Uniforms without the white outline look cheap, easy, and look like they didn't care to finish their uniform. All things I associate with bush leagues.

Another way to look at it is, the Reds colors at the time were strictly red and white. Why is it acceptable for the Pirates or A's to wear a yellow outline (one of their colors), but the Reds can't use one of their colors to outline their wordmark?

The Reds uniforms came full circle in 1988. Everything was tied together, which is why it's my favorite baseball uniform of all time.

But it's become obvious through two pages that this is just one of those topics where you either think it looks great or you don't.

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Its not even a finite rule with me... some look better with an outline, some don't. The reds in this specific example look awful without it. That said, I love the red sox curre t roadies. I think it all has to do with the use of white elsewhere in the uniform. The sox don't use white piping on their greys, so the flat look works. As did their championship era red outlined in navy.

I think that's why I think the yanks look best with the outline. Drop the white from the cuffs and you can drop the outlines.

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I'd say white outlines are appropriate if there's not enough contrast between letters or logo and the background. In no time is it mandatory.

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Agreed.

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Its not even a finite rule with me... some look better with an outline, some don't. The reds in this specific example look awful without it. That said, I love the red sox curre t roadies. I think it all has to do with the use of white elsewhere in the uniform. The sox don't use white piping on their greys, so the flat look works. As did their championship era red outlined in navy.

I think that's why I think the yanks look best with the outline. Drop the white from the cuffs and you can drop the outlines.

I personally think the red sox look is awful and very cheap and drab looking, the set they had before was so much better, with red letters and a blue outline, it was so much better, grey and blue looks so cheap, like they only put on the blue bottom layer and got lazy and didn't want to put the red letters over them to complete the look from before, i also think they darkened the grey which makes it look worse.

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I'd say white outlines are appropriate if there's not enough contrast between letters or logo and the background. In no time is it mandatory.

I think if you have more than one color in your scheme, then use the second color as the outline rather than white. Of course it's not a 100% rule, and I guess there's just sometimes where white subjectively looks better. I'm not sure that there's any team who's main color is light enough to not provide enough contrast against gray to be legible. Even in the case of Houston where their main color is orange (right?), they have navy to use for the outlines.

I guess I think that the road uniform should closely resemble the home (cases like the Yankees and Detroit excepted), and if you use a white outline at home, it's essentially invisible, and therefore shouldn't appear on the road.

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The Tigers are another offender. They have a great script, but it has two outlines on it, the outer which is white. I'm okay with a single colored outline, as long as it's an outline and not a "fill in the gaps" background patch. The white needs to go though. It clashes with the rest of the uniform, since they use the navy and orange caps on the road. Plus it has that "80s" style that they were moving away from when they ditched the racing stripes of their old Indians' style uniform.

What do you mean by this?

If you look at the phillies road jersey, their white outline is more of a background, as it fills in more space than just the area immediately around the letters. It's evident around the stars, especially to the left of the right one. I'll post a pic later but I'm in phone now.

This was actually a Majestic change, as their original russel jerseys had a "true" outline and not a lazily cut backing patch.

Here's what I mean by "patch". Majestic did this. Not sure if they were instructed to, or if it was just easier for them to apply the chainstitching to a patch and then put the patch on the jersey (as opposed to STL, who's chain stitching is actually stitched through the jersey. Majestic also added the elastic cuffs with the thicker striping. Before, it was just a thin band.

philadelphia-phillies-road-grey-mlb-replica-jersey-3158053.jpg

I guess the outline (not full patch version though) keeps in the tradition of the 1950s set that inspired the current set, but I think that the '40s looked much better with the dark blue outline (though I think that no outline is required at all.) I don't think a universe exists in which the current jersey is better than either of these.

MLB%20Philadelphia%20Phillies%201950%201%20Richie%20Ashburn%20Road%20Jersey%20by%20Mitchell%20&%20Ness-2431.jpgMLB%20Philadelphia%20Phillies%201948%2036%20Robin%20Roberts%20Road%20Jersey%20by%20Mitchell%20&%20Ness-2429.jpg

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Sorry the white outlines on the Tigers road jerseys have to go. The orange outline is enough, besides you have two neutral colors (white and gray) touching and it's contrasting. I cant see how the white makes the letters/numbers pop out, to me IMO it's too cluttered.

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I generally agree with you on this. The white outline on the Tigers road uniform makes the script look way too busy. I was glad when the Orioles dropped the white outline on the road uniform and black backgrounds. See below.

alomar_medium.jpg97andersonpx.jpg

My biggest problems with the Phillies uniform script are --

1. The outline on the P covers part of the H as if it is not part of the same script.

2. The outline on the home uniform cuts off the pinstripes before they reach the script (which really makes it look like a patch).

phillies-2010-mlb-tickets.jpg

Don't much care about the Phillies, but the Orioles made a huge mistake when they dropped the white outline on the blacks and roads. If anything, they should have added white trim to the numbers on the roads.

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Same topic, different sport...always thought the Rams' helmet horns needed a thin white outline to be perfect. Buc did a concept a while back where he did that and it looked terrific.

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Anybody remember the song White Lines (Don't Do It)?

Yeah, I've been nodding my head to it while playing it in my mind this whole time I've been reading.

The White Sox have to use white outlines because their colors are black, white, and silver/grey, and since they use black and grey on white, they have to use black and white on grey. It's a good look. Also, please wear white socks.

As for the Tigers, I've been a proponent of dropping their extraneous white, but then when I've mocked it up, it ends up losing a lot of character with just navy and burnt orange on grey. That little bit of contrast still goes a long way with them. Maybe they should keep it. Yeah, it looks dated, but screw it, it's Detroit; everything there is dated.

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From 1967-71, the Reds couldn't seem to make up their minds. Here are the five road jerseys they wore in each of those five seasons, in chronological order...

dgstylematch1.JPG

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See, I think those without white lines look so much better.

More professional - professionals don't need extra fussy details. They know when to stop adding.

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Same topic, different sport...always thought the Rams' helmet horns needed a thin white outline to be perfect. Buc did a concept a while back where he did that and it looked terrific.

that would be the worst idea ever, white outlines on a helmet decal are un-needed, and look cheap, and would look awful on the rams horns.

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