"League of Denial" documentary

[pcgd]

...soccer isn't exactly concussion-free either.

Removing headers from soccer isn't the same leap removing helmets from football would be. Soccer it'd be drastic but wouldn't change the game at a glance. Football would be completely changed and nearly be a different sport.

Basically saying the concussion issue in soccer is much easier to handle if it comes to it.

[Cosmic]

The only hopes for football are America's ignorance and stubbornness. Fortunately for the NFL...

[Alex Houston]

Even if you get rid of the helmet and other big, bulky equipment, the shear size and strength of these guys nowadays is ridiculous. I don't think rugby has quite the same concussion rate the NFL does, but you can only absorb the force of a huge moving object so many times before you eventually break down. It's part of the reason I would forbid my son from ever playing football on a team with helmets and all that stuff. There's plenty of non-critical sport alternatives that can satisfy the need to compete.

[dfwabel]

So after 48 hours, how many of you have actually watched the doc?

It seems that only that first five or six posters actually have.

[ADW77]

I watched it, and now when I go back and watch any highlights or rewatch a game, I'm paying much more attention to those little hits constantly.

[Needschat]

...soccer isn't exactly concussion-free either.

Removing headers from soccer isn't the same leap removing helmets from football would be. Soccer it'd be drastic but wouldn't change the game at a glance. Football would be completely changed and nearly be a different sport.

Basically saying the concussion issue in soccer is much easier to handle if it comes to it.

Most concussions in soccer are not caused by headers, not by the repetition in practice of them. Elbows, clashing of heads, feet to the head, etc, cause most of them. I played years of soccer and had ONE concussion, and that was due to a goalkeeper's attempted punch at the ball hit me side of the head instead.

[Gothamite]

It's not about concussions, but the accumulation of small hits.

Soccer doesn't have those hits as a regular part of the game. Football players take 1,500 or so in a season. There's the difference.

That having been said, I hope they do study soccer players' brains. More information is good.

So after 48 hours, how many of you have actually watched the doc?

It seems that only that first five or six posters actually have.

I've watched it again - damning stuff.

[dfwabel]

It's not about concussions, but the accumulation of small hits.

Soccer doesn't have those hits as a regular part of the game. Football players take 1,500 or so in a season. There's the difference.

That having been said, I hope they do study soccer players' brains. More information is good.

So after 48 hours, how many of you have actually watched the doc?

It seems that only that first five or six posters actually have.

I've watched it again - damning stuff.

Sadly, this thread has most posters unaware of the story which the program told. Specifically how the ME who did the study of Mike Websters brain was ruined by the NFL and wishes he never looked at his brain, how the woman who works at BU got the same treatment and how Congress was correct in comparing the NFL to "big tobacco" in terms of what they knew. The Colts team doc and they former chief advisors come off as pricks.

Goodell doesn't fare much better either, especially when he didn't allow the wife of an incapacitated former player from a meeting of former players regarding dementia complete with photos.

[Gothamite]

What that one anecdote doesn't make clear is exactly what meeting that was. She says it was about taking care of older players, but when she tries to go in he tells her it is for the players themselves only.

You're right - he doesn't come off well. Not nearly so bad as Tagliabue, who actively stonewalled and sabotaged the studies, but still not good.

This ought to be required viewing for all hall of fame voters. That alone ought to keep Tagliabue out, and if Goodell doesn't turn things around him as well.

[dfwabel]

Also Goodell failed to answer Congress, only to refer to the NFL medical advisors with answers yet the league report was leaked to the NYTIMES.

The Times reporter is just as critical to the timeline as the Farunia brothers.

[Sport]

This is horrible to admit, but when I was a kid I loved when they'd take a guy off on a stretcher. Something about that was cool to me. These guys were real life gladiators risking their health and well-being. I hate when any injuries happen at all. Earlier this season in the Bengals-Packers game Jermichael Finley got a shoulder pad to the head and wobbled off the field. I felt sick watching that.

I finally got around to watching League of Denial last night and boy does the NFL look horrible in this.

Let's see:

- They've ruined the career of Dr Omalu

- they held up research from happening

- they've denied denied denied in the face of overwhelming evidence in attempts to fend off legal issues

- lied about grants they gave to Boston University

- blamed CTE on potential drug abuse (so a drug abuse problem is better than a concussion problem?)

- paid their own quacks to refute respected neurosurgeons.

- Their stance has gone from "there's no evidence that head injuries lead to dementia later in life" to "There's not enough evidence that head injuries lead to dementia later in life". Both statements are certifiable bullsh** and the science is there to prove it.

- Not only did they knowingly withhold a workplace hazard to their employees, but they told them the exact opposite of the truth.

A few months ago I watched Chris Nowinski's Head Games on netflix and I haven't been able to watch football the same way since. It was always my third favorite sport, but recently it's been sliding even further and I've been finding myself getting less excited for the games. It feels like I'm watching the sport with bated breath at all times because I don't want to be watching the game when a guy dies on the field.

I think it's a matter of time before the game looks dramatically different.

[Cosmic]

^^^

There is something cool about that whole gladiator thing where guys could get hurt out there and pulled off on a stretcher. I think everyone involved signs up with that part in mind. But until recently, the idea was that if you made it through without blowing out your knee or something like that, you were "free" from football. I don't mean to be disrespectful, but I think of it kind of like serving in the Army in wartime... you signed up to do something that you knew was dangerous (for money instead of patriotism, don't get me wrong) and you made it back home safe. You thought you were done. Now we are gradually realizing that is not the case. We have the NFL version of Agent Orange or Gulf War Syndrome now. Just playing football the way it is normally played today could stick with you the rest of your life.

[Cosmic]

I couldn't remember exactly where was the best place to post concussion news, but this seemed OK. Apparently, UCLA has tests that can diagnose CTE while the player is still alive. Hall of Famers Tony Dorsett and Joe DeLamielleure both have confirmed CTE now. Dorsett told ESPN that while flying from Dallas to LA to get tested, he forgot multiple times why he was on the plane. So sad.

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9931754/former-nfl-stars-tony-dorsett-leonard-marshall-joe-delameilleure-show-indicators-cte-resulting-football-concussions

[bosrs1]

Seems like almost everyone, living and dead, they test for CTE in the NFL comes up positive. Future is not exactly looking bright for the NFL if that's the case.

[Gothamite]

That's (hopefully) the final straw. Start testing some current players, and when we learn that a beloved (and marketable) player like Brady, Rodgers or one of the Mannings has early-stages then maybe the fans will care enough about their fellow human beings to force some changes to the sport.

[bosrs1]

That's (hopefully) the final straw. Start testing some current players, and when we learn that a beloved (and marketable) player like Brady, Rodgers or one of the Mannings has early-stages then maybe the fans will care enough about their fellow human beings to force some changes to the sport.

I was wondering the same thing. When are they going to test a current player near the end of their career like a Peyton or Brady. Or more accurately, when will a current player or players step up and be the first one to get tested.

[ADW77]

This should be a surprise to no one, but there's been nothing on nfl.com about all of this. I see it on ESPN's website, but of course the NFL wouldn't allow such information to be spread through them.

[OnWis97]

That's (hopefully) the final straw. Start testing some current players, and when we learn that a beloved (and marketable) player like Brady, Rodgers or one of the Mannings has early-stages then maybe the fans will care enough about their fellow human beings to force some changes to the sport.

I was wondering the same thing. When are they going to test a current player near the end of their career like a Peyton or Brady. Or more accurately, when will a current player or players step up and be the first one to get tested.

It will happen. One of these guys is probably already thinking "I've got a ton of money and I have to think about quality of life...I don't need to do this forever." The problem is that very few NFL players actually make a ton of money and they hold on as long as they can.

But I'd expect an early retirement to come from someone soon, citing concerns with CTE-related poor quality of life.

[Eye]

That's (hopefully) the final straw. Start testing some current players, and when we learn that a beloved (and marketable) player like Brady, Rodgers or one of the Mannings has early-stages then maybe the fans will care enough about their fellow human beings to force some changes to the sport.

Actually, hopefully this isn't the final straw. I don't know how you can sit there and want someone to have brain damage.

Some retired players have brain damage. That's enough for me; I don't want anyone else to deal with that.

The final straw should already be here.

[Gothamite]

I agree completely - I've been arguing that plastic helmets should be prohibited for over four years now.

But you and I are seemingly in the minority. It seems that the vast majority of football fans are unwilling to address this issue squarely.

Frankly, I don't think enough of them give a damn about the health and lives of players and probably won't until it's a player they feel like they know.