Chris Kluwe: "Fired By Two Cowards And A Bigot"

[BlueSky]

@CS85, thanks for your illuminating contribution. Always a pleasure.

If I could go back in time and not create this thread I would. I absolutely repudiate political discourse of any nature on message boards, no matter how civil.

I really don't see political discourse. I used political figures as examples but political views have nothing to do with the point I was trying to make. If someone describes something as being as black as coal or white as snow, they're not talking about natural resources or the weather, right?

In any case, I regret that it morphed into something you find unpleasant.

[chuckymack]

I have no inside information, but my gut feeling is that Chris Kluwe remains out of football for the same reason as several other former players (Tim Tebow, Terrell Owens, and Chad JohnsoCinco come to mind):

The teams don't want to deal with the media circus that some players attract.

Chris Kluwe makes himself a target with his sociopolitically-charged comments. The media pounces upon him, publishing quote after quote, constantly hyping him, helping him achieve more fame than his play alone would.

Tebow is a third-string QB with an All-Pro fanbase.

Terrell Owens doesn't realize he's on the wrong side of forty.

Chad Johnson's mouth often outpaced his production on the field.

...And Chris Kluwe is a punter with a freakin' book deal.

The phrase 'Not Worth The Headache' comes to mind.

[Gothamite]

I suspect you're right, but the question is also about the hostile work environment he claims existed. That has to be investigated and cannot be allowed to continue.

That's all I was trying to say. I only brought it up because it's a gear-grinder to see all the hand-wringing and finger-wagging and indignance that goes on towards conservatives - and much of it is justified - while people like Oprah and Biden and whoever else just get a free pass for being hateful, stupid, or serial sexual harassers.

Nobody's talking about Oprah or Biden here because they're not relevant to this discussion. We're talking about homophobic remarks. If you wanted to show some sort of "liberal bias" you should have led with Alec Baldwin, except... whoops. That would have actually disproved your point.

[infrared41]

@ 'red...did you watch the clip? You're a radio guy, right? So you have more than the average bear's appreciation for how inflection and tone can shape the meaning of words that may look innocuous on paper. In the interview, Oprah says "...and they just need to die" with what struck me (and others) as conviction and malice. I think she does a lot of good work and that's why this - what looked for all the world like a rare unguarded flash of real hate - surprised me. Whoever she's talking about, she sounds like she wants them to die. I'm not saying I've never wished death on anyone - that clown that shot up the theater in Aurora comes to mind - but from her it was a bit of a shock.

All that is beside the point because while people can (and obviously will) argue the validity of examples till doomsday, the fact is that many if not most people are hypocrites. They will overlook outrageous behavior (at least to a point) if it comes from like-minded people while they rail against the same type of behavior from people who share their views.

That's all I was trying to say. I only brought it up because it's a gear-grinder to see all the hand-wringing and finger-wagging and indignance that goes on towards conservatives - and much of it is justified - while people like Oprah and Biden and whoever else just get a free pass for being hateful, stupid, or serial sexual harassers.

Don't know how much more clearly I can explain it.

Sorry, but I don't agree with your premise and I don't care enough to get worked up over it. As I said before, I'm not a fan of Oprah's and I do not share her views...for the most part anyway, I'm sure there are at least a few things (maybe more, maybe less) that Oprah and I agree on, but again, I don't care enough to get bent out of shape over it.

How about you get twice as upset? That way it can be a wash.

[BlueSky]

Thanks, but I'll pass. What I need to learn once and for all is that it's really not worth it, especially the time wasted here debating people I'll never meet whose views often defy reason. Not you, but others. Yours only occasionally defy reason.

Besides, I've been dismissed by the Great Relevance Decider Goth.

[IceCap]

especially the time wasted here debating people I'll never meet whose views often defy reason.

That'll defuse the situation

[BlueSky]

especially the time wasted here debating people I'll never meet whose views often defy reason.

That'll defuse the situation

Well, I misspoke. I meant of course they defy my idea of reason. But I'm sure they feel exactly the same way.

[IceCap]

[infrared41]

Thanks, but I'll pass. What I need to learn once and for all is that it's really not worth it, especially the time wasted here debating people I'll never meet whose views often defy reason. Not you, but others. Yours only occasionally defy reason.

Here's the thing, I don't get too upset over idiotic comments in either direction. My feeling is if we get upset over them, we only lend them more credence. In my not-so-humble opinion, the best way to diffuse idiots is to ignore them. Your mileage may vary.

[Gothamite]

Usually a very good policy, but when an employer allows such things in the workplace, it creates a poisonous working environment. Employees shouldn't have to be subjected to such garbage just to keep a job. Which is why the allegations, if true, are so serious.

Besides, I've been dismissed by the Great Relevance Decider Goth.

Trying to change the subject to Oprah didn't help your argument at all. And I'm a lot less interesting than she is.

[infrared41]

Usually a very good policy, but when an employer allows such things in the workplace, it creates a poisonous working environment. Employees shouldn't have to be subjected to such garbage just to keep a job. Which is why the allegations, if true, are so serious.

I was referring to the Oprah thing and the like. Chris Kluwe's allegations are a far more serious matter.

[The_Admiral]

Kluwe is backpedaling on wanting that coach to be banned for life, saying he only needs some therapy sessions now. That's quite a difference!

[CS85]

Kluwe is backpedaling on wanting that coach to be banned for life, saying he only needs some therapy sessions now. That's quite a difference!

In addition he basically announced his de-facto retirement from football.

[BlueSky]

Hypothetically speaking (jury is still out in this case), what consequences could/should there be in a situation like this if it turns out the accuser/"victim" is lying?

[The_Admiral]

My guess is the whole thing would go away very quietly, but I don't think anyone is so reckless or dumb as to make such accusations up completely. At worst, he exaggerated too much.

[IceCap]

Hypothetically speaking (jury is still out in this case), what consequences could/should there be in a situation like this if it turns out the accuser/"victim" is lying?

Kluwe was finished in this league when the Raiders cut him, so there's nothing the NFL or NFLPA could do about it, really. If what he accused Priefer of turns out to be false, or even greatly exaggerated, then it would be up to Priefer to sue him for libel.

Kluwe's already backing down a bit, which makes me think that at the very least he exaggerated his claims. Which is a dangerous thing to do when you accuse someone of saying the kind of things he accused Mike Priefer of saying. The things he accused Priefer of saying were downright heinous, and have no place in a professional working environment. NFL or otherwise. If any of what Kluwe said is false it'll make future accusations that have truth behind them that much harder to take seriously.

I'm thankful for what Kluwe's done for the LGBT rights cause, even if his delivery has left a bit to be desired in the past. If it turns out he fabricated a significant portion of this story, however, then he's doing the cause more harm then good at this point and should probably shut up for the foreseeable future. That and hope Mike Priefer doesn't take him to court.

[The_Admiral]

The fact is that human memories are fallible. In anything so tumultuous as the endangerment of your job and eventual termination, you're not going to remember things clearly. People just don't. That's why we have the legal systems we have. I certainly don't think this was made up out of whole cloth, but that he'd come down from "I will sacrifice my career to make sure this man never coaches again" and settle for "it'd be nice if he got some treatment and wrote some checks to the right people" suggests that some legal representation advised him to walk it back, and fast.

[rainmaker17]

I'm really, really sad Oprah is still getting this much airplay.

[rams80]

Hypothetically speaking (jury is still out in this case), what consequences could/should there be in a situation like this if it turns out the accuser/"victim" is lying?

Clockwork Orange-style marathon of Duck Dynasty to marinate in your so-called Civilization.

[Gothamite]

Hypothetically speaking (jury is still out in this case), what consequences could/should there be in a situation like this if it turns out the accuser/"victim" is lying?

Libel laws pretty much take care of that. No worries there.