daveindc

New Browns uni coming 2015

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I can't really understand the thinking that the team needed to change their uniforms. But there is some precedence for it, since the last time they changed uniforms they won a Superbowl.

... in Baltimore.

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How the Browns Should Look

  • More Satin Looking Helmet
  • NO Contrasting Stitches
  • No Big Cleveland Wordmark
  • White Numbers with orange shadow

pwsHRhA.png

Much improved. The white numbers and text provide much better contrast and color balance. Still not a fan of the orange-brown-orange combo, but that's a different area than what your tweaks were going for. The jersey changes are much, much better.

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You'll get no argument from me that they dropped the ball. I was just responding to some of the knee-jerk reaction that these are "2000's Bills bad." Let's call a spade a spade and save the overreaction for another, more fitting time. It's a downgrade, but not a total disaster. Just adding a full stripe to the pants bumps this up from "ugly" to "meh." There's no such quick fix for something that's on the level of the 2000's Bills.
If nothing else these uniforms at least look like they were designed to go together from head to toe. Which is more then you can say about the 2000s Bills look. I'd put these new Browns unis in the upper tier of Nike's redesigns, but considering its competition includes the Bucs' atrocities, the Jags' helmets, and a Dolphins logo that looks like a cruise ship logo? Not saying much. I'd say it comes in at number two under the Vikings, but that's more to do with the dreadful nature of its competition and less to do with its own merits as a uniform.

Haha, I know we've had this conversation before. My experience is a little different from yours, I've caught the "just because" excuse from both sides, and I'm talking in life as well as design. And it comes in many forms, this thread has displayed examples of both. I will say, though, that the modern arguments tend to lean toward the dumber/brash/confrontational end of the spectrum. On the other hand, the traditional arguments are usually calmer, subtler, well-thought-out, and reasonable. Yet, they both often display the same rigid line of thought. In real life, it's kind of like a person who holds fast to the "way things should be" often being as closeminded as the flighty free-thinker who just wants to let it all hang loose. I know you're not like that*, but it's more than possible for that to happen, and both sides to be at fault. Likewise, you could also end up being the only sane voice in the madhouse. Doesn't always mean you have to give up and leave the house to burn. Side note, I don't know how I'm typing these words, I've never considered any form of optimism to be one of my strong suits AT ALL.

It's not so much wanting to let the house burn down. It's more just a general sense of discouragement. Why spend time writing up a detailed analysis of what I like and what I don't like while also sharing my final thoughts if it's going to be lost in a sea of comments ranging from "only people 35 or over hate these!" to "you don't like these, lol get off my lawn!"? Oh, and you've gotta love the people who get so defensive that when you simply don't agree with them they turtle and fall back on "why are you arguing on a message board?" Yeah, THAT's what's going to motivate me.

I really do get what you're saying. I do, and I agree with it. Everything's just become so brash. I'm not sure why the modern side seems that way. It's not youth. You have a 48 year old in this thread pulling the "you only hate these because you're old!" crap. You also have teenagers thinking these suck. So I don't know. Maybe the modern side just feels incredibly defensive.

We have had this conversation. A year ago, I think. During the Bucs' unveiling. As much as I agree with you though, in a year we're right back to where we started.

*For what it's worth, you, McCarthy, and OldSchoolVikings have consistently made posts that I personally have found helpful and informative, and have helped me to examine further, and pay closer attention to, the values of traditional design. The three of you have also inspired me to give a lot of thought to at what exact point do modern designs go wrong, what is indeed "doing too much". So you've at least done that, without it even being your intent.

I do appreciate it :) And likewise you've caused me to hold off on the trigger finger and give a newer design some time to sink in. To see if it can win me over. For the most part? The new Browns jerseys have, save for the orange numbers and NCAA-sized wordmark. The stripes, however, have really grown on me.

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I am actually pretty immature. I get it. I like making fun of people that take themselves way to serious. Which is about 90% on this board.

You people act like your opinion matters. Except for the handful of you that are actual designers your all a bunch of wannabes and it's quite pathetic. Analyzing and scrutinizing every little detail of a logo is lame.

In reality it doesnt mean anything unless your a fan of the team or the actual designer.

So go on Mr. important with your big bad self, insulting othe people's work and opinions.

Oh if you do happen to be a designer and post on this website it makes you even more lame.

Find another hobby, DUDE!!!!! Sorry just the 15 year old in me.

Friendly warning from a mod.

Any and all opinions are welcome. Yet if you cannot articulate your opinion without insulting your fellow board members then disciplinary action will be taken.

Thank you for your expected cooperation.

-Lord Ice of the House of Cap, Warden of the Majestic XII and herald of Chris, the First of his name of the Creamer Dynasty. Long live the King!

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Yeah, I'm starting to think that the notions of "progress" and "modern" in and of themselves encourage the types of reactions that we often see. It just seems to be a common mindset that pops up throughout history and life in general. "In order to prop up the new, you have to put down the old" and all that nonsense. I don't get it. Shoot, Bischoff and WCW are perfect examples, they got to the top by brilliantly blending old and new elements, then got caught up in putting down the "old" WWF while their shiny new empire crumbled around them.

Heh, your view of the Browns' uniforms is actually better than mine, the pants single-handedly caused me to place this firmly alongside the Jaguars' set. That decision really threw me for a loop, just like the gradient helmet did.

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A couple things I think are stupid Nike inserted junk that makes this uniform dumb is...old college fashioned team name on pants...stupid stripes on helmet...and the stripe that comes to the front looks funky. Wish they would have gone with an enlarged stripe like Ohio state but with the three stripes...not texturized the stripe on helmet...just put the three stripes on the pants thick like 49ers. The big cleveland I think is sweet and looks better than all the small wordmarks that teams have. The orange numbers are a bold move for cleveland and I think they are ok. It just seems to me they looked at old Oregon uniforms and took old aspects of those uniforms and threw them on the Browns

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Heh, your view of the Browns' uniforms is actually better than mine, the pants single-handedly caused me to place this firmly alongside the Jaguars' set. That decision really threw me for a loop, just like the gradient helmet did.

Oh, the pants definitely ruined it. I agree. With standard pants striping it's a "meh" look. With the wordmark down the legs? It looks like amateur hour. Between that and the NCAA-sized wordmark the whole package just looks collegiate. Which isn't what you want in a pro look. Especially when your team is this consistently horrible. I foresee many a "look like a college team, play like a college team" jokes in this set's future. The pants are definitely the feature that sinks the whole thing.

Another thing that soured me to these isn't even really anything about the uniform itself. It's the Nike-speak. They played up the contrasting stitching like it was this game-changing innovation. Yeah, one that the XFL went with fifteen years ago. I don't mind the stitching myself. It's just that I think I'd have had a better impression of the whole thing if they had gone "we thought contrasting stitching looked good, so we used it."

Yeah, I'm starting to think that the notion of "progress" and "modern" in and of themselves encourages the types of reactions that we often see. It just seems to be a common mindset that pops up throughout history and life in general. "In order to prop up the new, you have to put down the old" and all that nonsense. I don't get it.

I think that's it. Too many people associate "modern" with terms like "progress" and "evolution." The latter two terms indicate a clear, factual improvement. The former term is a style. Its value, like the term "traditional," is entirely subjective.

To me "progress" and "evolution" has little to nothing to do with design. It occurs when materials and equipment improve. The Montreal Canadiens have had the same uniform design since 1947. Yet the uniform has progressed and evolved as equipment and materials improved. If they throw that identity out and go with something modern? That's not evolution. That's just going to a modern design. And whether that's better or worse is a subjective opinion. Nothing more.

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Now, just to promote discussion:

One of the main gripes people have had with the fitted template era is the reduction of sleeve stripes to shoulder caps. It looks like the Browns and Nike tried to remedy this with the new Browns uniforms. The shoulder stripes extend passed the shoulder caps and onto the front of the jersey. How does everyone feel about Nike's attempt to provide longer shoulder/sleeve stripes?

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I like it. The easiest solution would be to just enforce the NFL's existing rules on sleeve length, but short of that? I'm a fan of the bolder, longer stripes.

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Another thing that soured me to these isn't even really anything about the uniform itself. It's the Nike-speak. They played up the contrasting stitching like it was this game-changing innovation. Yeah, one that the XFL went with fifteen years ago. I don't mind the stitching myself. It's just that I think I'd have had a better impression of the whole thing if they had gone "we thought contrasting stitching looked good, so we used it."

I don't bother with Nike-speak. I have better things to do than to listen to hypemen make their products look "special." All that tells me is that you don't have the confidence to let your work speak for itself, when you feel the need to write paragraphs yapping endlessly about everything.

And I 100% agree with the rest of your comment, Cap.

Now, just to promote discussion:

One of the main gripes people have had with the fitted template era is the reduction of sleeve stripes to shoulder caps. It looks like the Browns and Nike tried to remedy this with the new Browns uniforms. The shoulder stripes extend passed the shoulder caps and onto the front of the jersey. How does everyone feel about Nike's attempt to provide longer shoulder/sleeve stripes?

I love it. These are the type of things designers should be thinking about, in my opinion. There's no reason to let a classic design element die without trying to preserve it first. I want to see more teams figure out ways to keep striping alive on football jerseys.

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I'm really OK with pretty much all of it. The worst I can say is that most of the "features" were unnecessary (carbon fiber helmet stripe, BROWNS on the pants), but whatever... they're nowhere near as bad as the Bucs and Jags. The only thing that actually bugs me is the orange numbers on the brown jersey. I think it's darn near illegible.

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A day later, I think it is a lateral move, mostly because I think their now old set was vastly overrated. I think the dropshadow and stitching are bigger problems than the pant lettering and giant wordmark. As far as Nike redesigns go, I'd put it alongside the Vikes, Fins, and Seahawks: decent, but with some adjustments could be great

Can someone make a version without these four elements? I'm pretty sure they would actually look pretty good since I agree with the fact that the stripes style is a good way to make them relevant once again.

-Contrasting stitching

-Number upshadows and color switch (white on brown and brown on white)

-Cleveland wordmark

-Browns wordmarks (stripes all the way down instead)

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Seems to me a big selling point for this redesign is the "nine combos!!!" angle, which in the NFL isn't really something a team can take advantage of, even if you think that's a good idea. Look at the Seahawks, they supposedly have nine combos, but you never see half of them, and they consistently wear one of the worst ones, the monochrome.

I'm afraid that's what will happen here... because of the NFL's (completely reasonable) alternate uniform rules, they will only get the chance to wear the orange (I'm guessing now the orange will be the alt) jersey twice. And to make a bigger design-splash, I'm betting they'll go orange mono at least once if not twice. As for the brown, they already showed their poor taste last year by forcing the all brown on us with their traditional look, so with this modern turn, mono brown is sure to show up.

i could be wrong, but something about the market-speak and overall feel of this redesign give me the depressing feeling that were going to see the nastiest combinations more often than the more reasonable ones.

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Just for fun. My two brown/brown concepts vs the actual.

2_vs_original.jpg

I'm still a little shocked that I don't hate the new uniforms. *insert joke.* They ended up better than I'd anticipated, even from the leaks. I'm actually fairly impressed. I was absolutely expecting another Bucs look. I'll still reserve final judgement until I actually see them on the field.

The only primary things I don't like are the traffic cone orange primary color and the drop shadow. Initially I thought the jersey wordmark was too big but I don't think it looks right in the fixed smaller versions posted by Bucksfan.

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I don't mind and actually like the wordmark on the pants. I was going for something similarly modern with the front stripe on the pants. They're initially a little garish, a bit of attention whoring, but the name is the logo. And I imagine from a distance it reads more like a broken stripe of brown or orange. Especially so when it's on the move instead of static as it's presented here.

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-Lord Ice of the House of Cap, Warden of the Majestic XII and herald of Chris, the First of his name of the Creamer Dynasty. Long live the King!

Since when? I must have missed the meeting that week. B)

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Here my "How The Browns Should Look" Concepts

pwsHRhA.png

ikoJcD2.png

qVm4uLB.png

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almost...remove the word mark, convert the shadows to outlines, change the orange numbers to brown, replace the socks with brown striped and white striped.

That would give you a solid and modern browns update.

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Those would look so much better with either standard block or a classier / more professional looking number set. Those numbers are terrible. The 31 is the only one of those three that looks acceptable.

They'd also look much better with no shadow, or at least a more standard one

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No kidding. The new look isn't great but it's hardly one of the worst uniforms in history. I don't think it even makes the list of worst current uniforms in the NFL.

I agree. I honestly don't find these that bad. There are far, far worse things the Browns could have done.

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