New United Kingdom flag proposals

[pianoknight]

Well, what about going to one of the simpler options?

All three flags are represented in there:

The St. Patrick's and St. George's flag are represented there pretty obviously, with the St. George's flag being outlined in white to sort of 'separate' England and North. Ireland on the flag so it represents two different 'countries' and gives the flag some needed separation without it looking too garish.

The flag of St. David is also there with the black background and the gold is moved to a trim around the flag, like how some official American flags have that gold fringe around the flag, so the gold is still in there, but not being front and centre as that would only look too garish.

It's still probably a downgrade from the current flag, but what are you gonna do without blue?

I like it, I think you could just drop the gold trim altogether though. looks a bit fiddly.

That is not the flag of the good guys though, is it? Red black and white feels a long way from Red, White and Navy.

I would think that the UK should avoid a dominant red-black flag

I don't know, Dave the Prime Minister might be more up for that than you imagine...

I too was messing around with it for a couple minutes:

Obviously not all of these would work, but I was just letting a couple of ideas out. I like the 2nd and 3rd one on the top and the 3rd one on the bottom.

Cleve-jacked! Err.. wait.... ummm...

[wildwing64]

At this point I think the current Union Jack has become too iconic and recognisable to change, and I don't really see it happening. What I would like to see, if Scotland does break away and the flag does get redesigned, is a simpler approach of removing blue and having a white and red flag. Nothing against Wales, but green, white and red doesn't work for me.

[Beckhamcantbendmiami]

Has anyone tried one with the yellow cross from St. David as the field instead of a background from another flag? I kind of want to see that

I would go with just white and red if a change had to happen, the rest don't really look or feel right. Or England can finally man up and just use St. George's cross, Wales and Northern Ireland are more conquered territories then anything.

What I'm interested in is how it would it change the countries, territories, and others flags that use it. Would they just replace the old uk flag with the new one, keep it for historic reasons, or get a new design overall? It might push New Zealand to get that new flag they have been looking at

[jaker52]

we need a concept contest for this.

[ColeJ]

i'd like to see scotland return to the old gold and red lion, personally. slightly off topic.

[marble21]

i'd like to see scotland return to the old gold and red lion, personally. slightly off topic.

That is the Royal Standard of Scotland. Used historically by royalty and nowadays it's use is restricted unlike the official flag known as the Saltire which can be flown anywhere.

Given the massive use of the Saltire by the Yes campaign, I believe it would be highly unlikely that they would change to the Royal Standard as the official flag if they did get independence. Custom variants of the Royal Standard are popular for Scottish sports fans, particularly when facing other members of the United Kingdom. I imagine this would only increase if they got independence.

[BrandMooreArt]

England conquered Wales in 1282 and formally annexed it in its entirely by 1542. That was a case of one country totally dominating and incorporating the other. That's not what happened with Ireland and Scotland, however. The Acts of Union in 1707 (Scotland) and 1800 (Ireland) were formally unions of equal nations (though there were political shenanigans that made Catholic Ireland not so equal). Point being that until 1997 Wales was considered fully part of England by the time the unions with Scotland and Ireland occurred. Then they got elevated to "constitute nation" status when devolution became all the rage.

Anyway there seems to be two lines of thought here. The first is "what if Scotland leaves?" Well over 60% of the English public polled indicated they'd like the flag to change if that happens. Though, to be perfectly honest, it probably won't happen. Polls indicate that Scotland probably won't vote for independence. If it happened I like the idea of just replacing the blue with black. It would give Wales some love in the flag and the white saltire could be interpreted as part of the Cross of St. Patrick.

The second line of thought seems to be "how do we include Wales?" Let's assume Scotland votes to remain part of the UK. Should the UK still consider changing the flag to give Wales some representation? The best option there, in my opinion, is this one...

A classy, subtle addition that doesn't ruin the overall design by forcing black and gold into the equation.

i remembered seeing this and thinking "that looks pretty cool" then i learned St. George was known as the dragon slayer, so i don't think placing a dragon in the middle of the flag is a great idea.

[29texan]

If this one is used, we'll have to change the National Anthem to "God Save our Eyes."

[Epiphanic]

Assuming it does change if Scotland votes yes, the simplest and most obvious answer is to eliminate the blue and re-center St. Patrick's cross for Ireland. Essentially this:

You can add an outline around St. George's cross like the current Union Jack has to show it being in front of St. Patrick's cross (and to make it more aesthetically pleasing).

[marble21]

The Union flag is now a much bigger symbol in its own right than simply a combination of elements from its members. It will not change regardless of the outcome of this referendum or any future vote by any of its members.

I know people are just being hypothetical and offering up their thoughts, which is interesting to see so many different opinions. I still have not seen anything better than the original though. In either an aesthetically pleasing or symbolic of the United Kingdom way.